Chinese Language / Mandarin

[chenchow]

After the category of Chinese Language is put up, there have been many hits and I know that a few of you have been learning this language that is used by more than 1.5 billion people on earth.

So, this forum would be a good discussion point for those who wish to learn and for those who are proficient to help as much as possible. It will be a very good interaction!!!

[littlebigone]

After the category of Chinese Language is put up, there have been many hits and I know that a few of you have been learning this language that is used by more than 1.5 billion people on earth.


hits increased? where?

[chenchow]

What I mean is the Learning Chinese section which we have links to USC and MIT chinese learning syllabus and in fact, for USC, the lecture notes itself. We have seen 49 hits to them as of now.

anyone teaching mandarin? i learnt like halfway from friends, then dunno what..kinda forgot already..hehe :oops:

[Thirdshifter]

all i can say is.. len lui.. leng luin?

[littlebigone]

leng lui...but that's Cantonese not mandarin

[Schye]

How about pomplek chun? :wink:

budakkerek:
Did you learn the mandarin character too or just the speaking language?(dont know how to express the meaning of this sentence in a better way, anyone with better english please correct me;))
Maybe we can help if you tell us the detail...

and to those who are interested in learning Japanese language, i may help ortry to find some nice site for you .

[masterof_none]

should be

'xiao jie' - miss.

[littlebigone]

This is going to turn into "how to court a chinese girl 101"

[royston]

Syamsul, did you study in an Chinese Ed school before?

cool... Xiao Jie you also can speak it out... hahaha!! :lol:

Pomplek is actually Tamil word, means girl but in a quite "rude" way because Tamil Language categorized in a few levels... normally pomplek is not suitable for old ppl... :?

Like thirdshifter said, leng lui, that is in cantonese. In Mandarin is called mei nu... Anyway, most of the girls will smile at you and drive you crazy if you simply call them Leng Lui... muahahahah !!!! :twisted:

I am not perfect in Mandarin and when I speak Mandarin, people look at me one kind... but my first gf was a Singaporean, we used to speak in Singlish and Mandarin... on top of this, when I was in secondary school, I like to use computer to type Mandarin/Cantonese song lyrics for my friends... so my Han Yu Ping Yin should be quite OK lor... :P

~ roy ~

[chenchow]

I believe that there are a number of us here who would be able to help provide resources on mandarin. Schye, start a topic on japanese and you could help over there...

royston, not to discourage, but just to point out.. han yu pin yin , not ping yin... :D

[jiinjoo]

I think I need mandarin classes too :? being in an english system for the past 5 years totally destroyed my mandarin (and malay don't need to say).

also wanna test if the charset works here (ignore if you see gibberish below)

大家好! 努力奋斗, 用工读书, 别常常上网, 耽搁读书时间!! :roll:

end test.

[masterof_none]

Syamsul, did you study in an Chinese Ed school before?

cool... Xiao Jie you also can speak it out... hahaha!! :lol:



No, I study Chinese here at USC. Don't have a chance to study Chinese in Malaysia. But I believe that even if I study Chinese in Malaysia, they'll try to speak Malay with me.. So, better study here.

Also, for those who want to learn Chinese, I've included USC Chinese department website under 'Learning Chinese' link (in the Update section).

It's got fantastic collection of good notes and you can play around with the Java Applet Chinese chars. Really cool and really works!

I think we can establish ReCom Language Center :
1. Malay
2.Chinese
3.Indian

And I suggest one of us can take lead in respective languages.
I suggest Luke for Bahasa, Royston for Chinese, and Dharman100 for Indian

Zenma yang?

that's a very good idea, and in fact, i would suggest that we go even further to have a language center, for other languages, like japanese (Schye), German (dharman100, iQing), French, Russian....

It will be a very good learning experience..

Jiinjoo, your mandarin seems pretty good still..

For the benefit of everyone, I would type out how the sentence typed by Jiinjoo read and meant:-

大家好! 努力奋斗, 用工读书, 别常常上网, 耽搁读书时间!!
da4 jia1 hao3 ! nu3 li4 fen4 dou4 , yong4 gong1 du2 shu1, bie2 chang2 chang. shang4 wang3 , dan1 ge. du2 shu1 shi2 jian1 !!

It means, everyone is fine or good! (sth like that, basically saying hi to everyone), working hard, hardworking in reading books, don't always go online, it would affect reading's time!! )

[chenchow]

that was me, sorry for forgetting to log in..

[Diesel]

ha, cool.
i really really need somebody to translate a CoCo Lee's song for me. pe pe pe please!!

[littlebigone]

hahahah....before we make a language center for every language, i think we should at least find a working model for one of them. Otherwise things will get messyy and we end up with 6 or 7 empty forums.

[chenchow]

yeah, agree with littlebigone... anyone has any idea on how to implement that?

Plus, just would like to check whether everyone could see the chinese word well, i mean it is some sort of character or wierd symbol... because i tried some of the computers in different lab and some work and some don't ... i guess it is whether the computer is able to read mandarin...

[masterof_none]

hey Diesel,! welcome back !
surely some of us know CoCo lee's song. ChenChow surely know.

About Language center.
It depends. If a lot of people want to learn, we can specify only one or two language at a time. Too man languages might be problematic.

But we need feedback. By the way, if you've leftover assignments, artworks, please submit it to creative corner.

You can upload it to our mirror (innovane.com).

Go ahead and check out the creative corner! and submit your works.

[royston]

haha... ChenChow, thanks for the correction... so malu... :oops:

Syam, I don't think so I am good in mandarin... But if you guys feel comfortable, I am glad to put some contribution in this Chinese Language corner... 8)

I believe learning language will not be as "hot" as other topic. Not every member will access to the language corner to read and learn everytime they log in. Maybe once a while they will be there...

Anyway, I believe this is part of the great job to be done as I also wish to learn English, Japanese and so on...

The current "Learning Chinese" section is good but if possible, we try to categorize it into certain portions like:

1. About Chinese Language
2. Basic knowledge of Chinese Language
3. Writing/Reading Mandarin words
4. Listening/Speaking Mandarin words

Assume that I am a Chinese Language idiot, I go inside your Learning Chinese page. I do not know how to start, there are a couple of links but I am not sure how and what I should know before I started it. Probably the above 4 category would give me some guideline so that I know where to start and so on.

By the way, I guess "Learning Mandarin" would be not be appropriate as the word "Chinese" includes Mandarin, Hokkien, TeowChew, Hakka, etc. People who has no knowledge about Chinese Language might think that Chinese=Mandarin, anyhow this is just my personal opinion. Correct me if I am wrong again... :P

Thanks,
~ roy ~

[chenchow]

good suggestion royston...

i believe that you could be the main driving force for us, as the semester near its end, most of us would be having a hard-pressed time to contribute as much as before, but I promise you that all of us would try our best to complement everyone's effort... Go Recom!!!

[royston]

why don't we make a conclusion on:

1. How many type of language we wish to set up?
2. Who should lead those languages?
3. Standardize a fixed format for all languages in terms of categories.

By the way, the leader of that particular language may change to other person at anytime... if the leader is not available (busy, someone-better, etc) or the members feel like changing a new leader.

Any better idea?

~ roy ~

[masterof_none]

The current "Learning Chinese" section is good but if possible, we try to categorize it into certain portions like:

1. About Chinese Language
2. Basic knowledge of Chinese Language
3. Writing/Reading Mandarin words
4. Listening/Speaking Mandarin words

Assume that I am a Chinese Language idiot, I go inside your Learning Chinese page. I do not know how to start, there are a couple of links but I am not sure how and what I should know before I started it. Probably the above 4 category would give me some guideline so that I know where to start and so on.



hey Roy, this is actually is a brilliant idea.!
Yes, we will have some kind of intro to Chinese( or Mandarin) , I guess we should encourage Malaysians to know Mandarin too.

We will , but right now, we should plan first. I think lots of people, like ChenChow said, are busy ( including me) . so, this winter we may find lots of room for us to develop Recom.

Great ideas. ! .Thanks

By the way, Roy,since you're the real world software engineer, why don't you become our software development leader instead of the Mandarin section.I think me and others can handle the Mandarin section, for the starting...

"GNU Public Licence out of ReCom in less than six month ."

I think if we come up with some software, (especially in the context of Malaysian education) , we don't have to promote ourselves, They'll come chase us to publish our name in newspapers. !!
How does it sound Roy?.

Together, let's make a difference.

[royston]

By the way, Roy,since you're the real world software engineer, why don't you become our software development leader instead of the Mandarin section.I think me and others can handle the Mandarin section, for the starting...

"GNU Public Licence out of ReCom in less than six month ."

I think if we come up with some software, (especially in the context of Malaysian education) , we don't have to promote ourselves, They'll come chase us to publish our name in newspapers. !!
How does it sound Roy?.

Together, let's make a difference.

Me? haha... no no... In fact I don't know much about software, buat lawak Syamsul... :lol: I have some trivial knowledge on ASM and C++ that's all. When come to GUI stuff, I am still a junior, not like Bachok and you... :oops:

Anyway, if we can really generate a new software development group in future, it will be my pleasure to be one of the member 8)

Thanks Syam for your promotion... heehee... :P

~ roy ~

[Schye]

I would really like to learn Tamil here;) and i am taking German this year , but i am poor in it because i never practise it.
I can help in Mandarin too although my BC is not that good :wink: especially han yu pin yin ....
got a B for PMR ...haha

[Schye]

I just found out that MIT Mandarin Exam 3 is printed in traditional Mandarin character which is only being used by Taiwan nowadays.

Is it common in US ? or just MIT?

[masterof_none]

at USC, we learn Traditional first.
when you go certain level (I think level 3 or sth) then only they teach you the simplified version.

I think they're all like that in US colleges.

by the way Schye, we don't care about PMR ;-)
all we need is interest and enthusiasm.

about Tamil, I think we have to find someone in ReCom to contribute.
I learnt a little Tamil while working at Klang but that was it .

It's good to revive my Tamil memory.

[wwhong]

not only taiwan but hong kong also using traditional character. but i heard hong kong is going to switch as well, dunno how true is that. for hongkies, they use traditional character because they are used to it but for taiwanese, they use traditional character cos they want to be different from china. i even read about their intention to change their national language to "min nan", a dialect that almost the same as hokkien just to be different from china, haha...

personally, i think the simplified chinese is more practical but when come to beauty of course is the traditional character.

[chenchow]

Up to a certain extent, I would believe that the present simplified Mandarin writing would be a better standardization, but currently, almost all newspapers in Malaysia are still using the traditional Mandarin writing.

As all schools in Malaysia teach simplified writing, almost all of us here who go through the school system in Malaysia would have learned the simplified writing, but I think that would not be a huge problem when you are reading the newspaper with those traditional wordings. Somehow, after some time you would be able to make that up.

[silverblue]

I have a question that has been in my head for quite some time....

Do people who speak Mandarin, Cantonese, Hokkien, Hakka, Taiwanese, and other Chinese dialects write the same way in Chinese? As in, if someone were to write a Mandarin essay, will a Cantonese-speaking person be able to read the essay as it was written in Cantonese?

[iQing]

There's some difference actually...
different dialeg uses different expression/words but basically they are almost alike...

for example..
in Mandarin we say beauty
but in Hokkien we don't use the same word as mandarin (which is Bee) but we use the word Xui...

I think it's something like that...

you can see Old Master Q's comic... the written language it uses is a bit different from mandarin... it's in cantonese

[royston]

Hi Cheryl,

In fact, Mandarin is the only one we considered as language and the rest like cantonese, hokkien, hakka, teowchiew are considered as dialects. Difference is language can be written in words such as essay, diary and so on but dialect cannot be written in words because it does not have words, I am not sure you understand what I am trying to tell.

No doubt, you still can see a lot of cantonese words in Hong Kong magazine but I would say it is not a proper language. For example:

English: What is this?
Mandarin: She me dong xi?
Cantonese: Li "D" hai mat yeh lei kar?

In dialect, we use a lot of "redundant" words such as "D", "kar" and so on. They can't be transformed into words/characters. If a frequent-cantonese-speaking person who does not know mandarin, they will have problem reading mandarin essay, same as the pure-mandarin-speaking person will never understand/read Hong Kong magazine... :lol:

Correct my English "chi-cher"...

~ roy ~

[iQing]

I agree about that....

just like Malay

there are dialects or telor
Kelate, negeri sembilan, utara etc.

they are not consider as languages as well

[wwhong]

Do people who speak Mandarin, Cantonese, Hokkien, Hakka, Taiwanese, and other Chinese dialects write the same way in Chinese? As in, if someone were to write a Mandarin essay, will a Cantonese-speaking person be able to read the essay as it was written in Cantonese?

yes, everyone write in the same way in the standard chinese but of course people do write differently according to their dialect in casual communication. just like our malay frens write the same standard malay but when come to casual they got kelantan slang all those like apa they write apo, etc.

to make it simple, all formal and serious stuff is written in the standard chinese and of course no matter what dialect u speak, as long as u can read chinese u will be able to understand that. if u read the hong kong or taiwanese newspaper, they are all written in standard mandarin. they do write their dialect in casual part like jokes, etc.

talking about why we learn simplified chinese in school but still the newspaper is written in traditional character, this is because they have to accomodate those older reader who don't quite understand simplified chinese as simplified chinese was introduced not long ago. (30-40 years ago) but this is good as well cos we got to learn 2 types of writing. one of the advantages being a m'sian chinese?

yup i fully agree with chen chow even though we never learned traditional character but we still managed to make it up by looking at the radical and most of the time we got it. one of the beauty of chinese language

[iQing]

I can't write old version chinese but I can read them... funny
so I have no complain that some media still use old chinese characters

I heard Japanese has 3 versions of charactors....

I remember seeing a movie called HERO
the Hero said that there are 19 ways to write the word "sword"

[wwhong]

yup, there are hiragana, katakana and kanji (basically just chinese word). out of the three, i think katakana is the hardest as i hardly memorize all of them after 3 semesters of japs, haha....

talking about the 19 ways to write the word "sword" in chinese, we should really thank shi huang ti (that's what most of the english history book wrote, usually people call him qin shi huang) without him, learning chinese will be a disaster!! just imagine u have to learn 19 ways of writing a word which carriy the same meaning, that's a pain in the ass. he is the one who standardized the chinese character. one of his contributions beside the great wall of china.

[iQing]

Yes I agree....
he's great although he ordered that books must be burned...

historians say that Shih Huang Ti has made more contribution to the world than Julius Ceacer....

[wwhong]

historians say that Shih Huang Ti has made more contribution to the world than Julius Ceacer....

hi iqing, i would definitely wanna know more. appreciate if you can share it here.

[iQing]

They say that both of them conquered empires of approximately the same area and population but

after thier death,
the roman empire didn't last very long

but chinese empire still remain until today...

that's thier criterion

[Schye]

di?a?lect ( P ) Pronunciation Key (d-lkt)
n.

A regional or social variety of a language distinguished by pronunciation, grammar, or vocabulary, especially a variety of speech differing from the standard literary language or speech pattern of the culture in which it exists: Cockney is a dialect of English.
A variety of language that with other varieties constitutes a single language of which no single variety is standard: the dialects of Ancient Greek.
The language peculiar to the members of a group, especially in an occupation; jargon: the dialect of science.
The manner or style of expressing oneself in language or the arts.
A language considered as part of a larger family of languages or a linguistic branch. Not in scientific use: Spanish and French are Romance dialects.


I think Mandarin, Cantonese, Hokkien, Hakka etc are different from mandarin or in another word, different language.They maybe classified in a large family of a language but i would say they are different language.

Comparing it with Bahasa Malaysia spoken in different state is not suitable at all.Those dialacts just change parts of certain words and may be having just a few unique words which means we can still understand each other easily most of the time(not Kelate slang though ).

ex:
Air - ayaq, ketar - ketaq ------------North part
makan - makang, ikan - ikang --------- Terengganu , Pahang

As you can see there are certain pattern up there while in Mandarin , they are totally different.

EAT
jiak - Hokkien
sek - Cantonese
chi - Mandarin

So , i think they should be classified as different spoken language.However they either dont have their own character/writing or the writing are not being used anymore which lead to the situation now.
I am not sure who had standardized the language in China, but it was a nice move and did help to unite a country such as BM now.

Usually those who learn simplified Mandarin can read traditional Mandarin
as well.This is because the shape or the atmosphere is still there.Many can read but cant write because Chinese character is different from one to one , and those who can read just read it by their roungh shape and not the whole chracter in detail.

About Japanese,
there are 3 types of character.

Kanji - it contains both simplified Mandarin and Traditional mandarin + some character which is not being used anymore.This is because of the place and the time ,the character was being brought in - mixed of the 19 types of ways to write the word sword ?!

Hiragana- simplified from chinese character which has the same pronunciation which was being used by ladies .

Katakata - simplified from Chinese character too but it was only being used in formal letters.

A better description can be found at
http://www4.justnet.ne.jp/~aoh/KANA_HISTORY.HTML

Although kana may look different from one to one, but compared to German grammer, i think they are easier....hah.

[bubblesgirl]

To Schye,
how much for the lesson of Japanese Language per-hour(^ - ^ )??

[screw3d]

我不会讲华语。

[Schye]

可是我会写 8)

[budakkerek]

i learned some stuff from my chinese friends. But forgot bout it..only remember some important words only"

pat toh
ni she wa de nan peng yau

hahahah... :lol:

[budakkerek]

i learned some stuff from my chinese friends. But forgot bout it..only remember some important words only"

pat toh
ni she wa de nan peng yau

hahahah... :lol:

[tehjiao]

I think it's a advantage/bonus to those who is chinese ed in M'sia, as they can write simplified mandarin, read in traditional mandarin, can speak in english, malay and at least their own dialect plus cantonese if they like HongKong movies. I don't think that there is any place else in the world which can provide this environment to build up this multilingual ability in such a huge population! Not even Singapore, HOngkong, China, Taiwan and US! So, hey man, be proud to be chinese educated in M'sia! :lol:
Though not very fluent in every language, at least we can communicate with others. This is the most important as language is used for communication.
My friend told me that last year he went to HOng Kong for travelling, he met a chinese girl in hongkong airport who was so worried and try to communicate with the air port guard. When he approach the girl, surprisingly he found that the girl was speaking in Malay! And she can't even understand English, MAndarin and cantonese. Guess where this girl from? ????? YES! She's from Indonesia! When she found that my frined can speak in Malay and english and cantonese and mandarin, she was relieved. Then, my friend helped her to the correct gate and solved her problem as she was 'sesat jalan' in the huge air port. Well, i would say that luckily i'm a Malaysian Chinese. It would be sad if i myself can't even know my own mother tongue and communicate with others who are same race as mine. 8O

[tehjiao]

I think it's a advantage/bonus to those who is chinese ed in M'sia, as they can write simplified mandarin, read in traditional mandarin, can speak in english, malay and at least their own dialect plus cantonese if they like HongKong movies. I don't think that there is any place else in the world which can provide this environment to build up this multilingual ability in such a huge population! Not even Singapore, HOngkong, China, Taiwan and US! So, hey man, be proud to be chinese educated in M'sia! :lol:
Though not very fluent in every language, at least we can communicate with others. This is the most important as language is used for communication.
My friend told me that last year he went to HOng Kong for travelling, he met a chinese girl in hongkong airport who was so worried and try to communicate with the air port guard. When he approach the girl, surprisingly he found that the girl was speaking in Malay! And she can't even understand English, MAndarin and cantonese. Guess where this girl from? ????? YES! She's from Indonesia! When she found that my frined can speak in Malay and english and cantonese and mandarin, she was relieved. Then, my friend helped her to the correct gate and solved her problem as she was 'sesat jalan' in the huge air port. Well, i would say that luckily i'm a Malaysian Chinese. It would be sad if i myself can't even know my own mother tongue and communicate with others who are same race as mine. 8O

[z]

i'm a bit ashamed to admit that i cannot read traditional chinese characters until lately, when i started learning kanji. my jap lecturer likes to explain the origin/components of the characters, which makes learning the kanji meaningful (well, at least to me, i'm not sure if the americans appreciated that though).

unfortunately, learning chinese is not an easy task. many people have to struggle to memorize the characters, the stroke orders, etc. btw, anyone has any idea if there are any other languages whose characters are pictograms?

[z]

i'm a bit ashamed to admit that i cannot read traditional chinese characters until lately, when i started learning kanji. my jap lecturer likes to explain the origin/components of the characters, which makes learning the kanji meaningful (well, at least to me, i'm not sure if the americans appreciated that though).

unfortunately, learning chinese is not an easy task. many people have to struggle to memorize the characters, the stroke orders, etc. btw, anyone has any idea if there are any other languages whose characters are pictograms?

[sim_min]

hahaha,
i am more than willing to do that~

[sim_min]

hahaha,
i am more than willing to do that~

[chenchow]

z, i am sure you could read at least most of the traditional chinese right? Most of our main stream chinese newspaper are still on traditional writing...

[chenchow]

z, i am sure you could read at least most of the traditional chinese right? Most of our main stream chinese newspaper are still on traditional writing...

[sim_min]

z, i am sure you could read at least most of the traditional chinese right? Most of our main stream chinese newspaper are still on traditional writing...

i think they are using traditional chinese only for the title, but they are using simplified chinese for the content.

[sim_min]

z, i am sure you could read at least most of the traditional chinese right? Most of our main stream chinese newspaper are still on traditional writing...

i think they are using traditional chinese only for the title, but they are using simplified chinese for the content.

[chenchow]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

[chenchow]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

[sim_min]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

yeah, you are right, i have asked my mom to look that for me :roll:

[sim_min]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

yeah, you are right, i have asked my mom to look that for me :roll:

[Schye]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

yeah, you are right, i have asked my mom to look that for me :roll:

As far as i know, sin chew or kuanghwa (cant remember which one) has both versions. It depends on the reader groups that they target.

note: I was in the Student Club of Nanyang and we did a research before(just a small one on the readers ages and the paper they purchase)

[Schye]

Most like KwongHua, Sin Chew are all in traditional wordings for all its papers, not only wordings... Only Nanyang is using the simplified chinese.

yeah, you are right, i have asked my mom to look that for me :roll:

As far as i know, sin chew or kuanghwa (cant remember which one) has both versions. It depends on the reader groups that they target.

note: I was in the Student Club of Nanyang and we did a research before(just a small one on the readers ages and the paper they purchase)

[masterof_none]

since this discussion is rather interesting, why don't you guys create an SIG for Mandarin? ;-)

[masterof_none]

since this discussion is rather interesting, why don't you guys create an SIG for Mandarin? ;-)

[Wayne]

Hi everyone..
i wonder if i can take Mandarin course in US?
is it very simple or otherwise?

[Wayne]

Hi everyone..
i wonder if i can take Mandarin course in US?
is it very simple or otherwise?

[wwhong]

yeah it's simple, just go register for the class and go to the lecture. no one gonna stop you, don't worry. however, if you planning to take low level mandarin course just to get an easy A without going to class,etc, I advise you take something else and learn something new. go ahead and take some higher level course if you are interested.

[wwhong]

yeah it's simple, just go register for the class and go to the lecture. no one gonna stop you, don't worry. however, if you planning to take low level mandarin course just to get an easy A without going to class,etc, I advise you take something else and learn something new. go ahead and take some higher level course if you are interested.

[tree007]

gee, just curious.. then wat do we learn in chinese class in the US? is it sth like SPM? where we have wen yan wen n stuffs like that? higher level in simplified or traditional?

just curious....

[tree007]

gee, just curious.. then wat do we learn in chinese class in the US? is it sth like SPM? where we have wen yan wen n stuffs like that? higher level in simplified or traditional?

just curious....

[wwhong]

a little bit different once you reach college level. it's more focus. for eg, if you choose to study wen yan wen then the class is primarily focus on that. not like SPM anymore where basically we learned everything from grammar to wen yan wen to ming ju jing hua. I have a friend from China taking a chinese reading class now. The class is like analyzing an article from different perspective ie critical thinking, beautiful sentence stucture, etc. Then you will be given some written assignment as well.

Different school maybe has different course stucture though. Make sure you check the course out to see if it interests you before taking that. about learning traditional or simplified, mostly will be simplified since that's the standard in China but sometime it depends on your teacher. I heard one of my friend said he has to learn traditional because his teacher is a taiwanese. again, that depends and you definitely wanna check it out. anyhow, i think there shouldn't be a problem for m'sian chinese to read and write in traditional chinese right?

[wwhong]

a little bit different once you reach college level. it's more focus. for eg, if you choose to study wen yan wen then the class is primarily focus on that. not like SPM anymore where basically we learned everything from grammar to wen yan wen to ming ju jing hua. I have a friend from China taking a chinese reading class now. The class is like analyzing an article from different perspective ie critical thinking, beautiful sentence stucture, etc. Then you will be given some written assignment as well.

Different school maybe has different course stucture though. Make sure you check the course out to see if it interests you before taking that. about learning traditional or simplified, mostly will be simplified since that's the standard in China but sometime it depends on your teacher. I heard one of my friend said he has to learn traditional because his teacher is a taiwanese. again, that depends and you definitely wanna check it out. anyhow, i think there shouldn't be a problem for m'sian chinese to read and write in traditional chinese right?

[tree007]

errrrrrrrrrrr......... :P

[tree007]

errrrrrrrrrrr......... :P

[Shian_Ling_the_Duchess]

I am now doing a chinese class about China cultural politics in the 20th century. Very interesting. about Mao and communism mainly. the whole class taught in mandarin. I have also done some cool parodies of chinese poems.
Yo i love Chinese language! it's beautiful.. :)

[Shian_Ling_the_Duchess]

I am now doing a chinese class about China cultural politics in the 20th century. Very interesting. about Mao and communism mainly. the whole class taught in mandarin. I have also done some cool parodies of chinese poems.
Yo i love Chinese language! it's beautiful.. :)

[tree007]

oh wow.. cool..
so teach in trad. chinese or simplified?
n da.. do u have trouble understading those from china? 'cos some of the chinese accent very susah faham.. :P

[tree007]

oh wow.. cool..
so teach in trad. chinese or simplified?
n da.. do u have trouble understading those from china? 'cos some of the chinese accent very susah faham.. :P

[Shian_Ling_the_Duchess]

it's in simplified chinese. The professors are from china and they speak proper chinese. so no problem understanding. Since my mandarin so good. (oops, hehe i am being narcistic) :p

[Shian_Ling_the_Duchess]

it's in simplified chinese. The professors are from china and they speak proper chinese. so no problem understanding. Since my mandarin so good. (oops, hehe i am being narcistic) :p

[wwhong]

haha...i don't think you need to worry about their accent. They speak standard mandarin like what u hear from in the movies. The young generation all can speak standard chinese so there will be no trouble in understanding what they say at all

[wwhong]

haha...i don't think you need to worry about their accent. They speak standard mandarin like what u hear from in the movies. The young generation all can speak standard chinese so there will be no trouble in understanding what they say at all

[kennytang]

since mandarin is becoming more n more important especially in business field, i think we ought ot learn it.
mandarin rules!!!!!!!!

[kennytang]

since mandarin is becoming more n more important especially in business field, i think we ought ot learn it.
mandarin rules!!!!!!!!

[tree007]

hmmm.. since like every1 is focusing on mandarin. will that spell the end of other dialects? (to me, mandarin is just another dialect that happened to be "official" dialect of China)

should steps be taken to protect dialects? for example, Taiwan is planning to teach (dunno whether implement dy or not) "tai yu" (almost/practically same as hokkien) as second national language.

wa si hokkien lang~~~~!! :P

[tree007]

hmmm.. since like every1 is focusing on mandarin. will that spell the end of other dialects? (to me, mandarin is just another dialect that happened to be "official" dialect of China)

should steps be taken to protect dialects? for example, Taiwan is planning to teach (dunno whether implement dy or not) "tai yu" (almost/practically same as hokkien) as second national language.

wa si hokkien lang~~~~!! :P

[DecentMerson]

hahaha... Ngai heh Hakka nYin....(I'm hakka)

Mandarin is definitely very very important.... more and more people are realising this fact and the number of students picking up mandarin(took spm exam) is increasing...(a good sign)

and for the local chinese newspaper in Malaysia....most Major Newspaper (SinChew Jit Poh and Nanyang Siang Pai) are using tradition writing for the headings and simplified version for the details....

not everyone of us(Malaysian Chinese-ed) know how to read traditional chinese writing.... My skill has deteriorate until....shame on me.....

still remember the days i read (chased) those Wu Xia Xiao Shuo by JingYong (typical warrior-fantasy-heroic-martial-arts plot) during Form 3,4.....

one more thing, although Singapore gov and education system have been promoting mandarin ever since... and all of their hongkong series are dubbed in Mandarin, their level of mandarin are considerably second to Malaysian Chinese ed student....

[DecentMerson]

hahaha... Ngai heh Hakka nYin....(I'm hakka)

Mandarin is definitely very very important.... more and more people are realising this fact and the number of students picking up mandarin(took spm exam) is increasing...(a good sign)

and for the local chinese newspaper in Malaysia....most Major Newspaper (SinChew Jit Poh and Nanyang Siang Pai) are using tradition writing for the headings and simplified version for the details....

not everyone of us(Malaysian Chinese-ed) know how to read traditional chinese writing.... My skill has deteriorate until....shame on me.....

still remember the days i read (chased) those Wu Xia Xiao Shuo by JingYong (typical warrior-fantasy-heroic-martial-arts plot) during Form 3,4.....

one more thing, although Singapore gov and education system have been promoting mandarin ever since... and all of their hongkong series are dubbed in Mandarin, their level of mandarin are considerably second to Malaysian Chinese ed student....

[Thirdshifter]

Ok, i need to find a Mandarin Speaking Girlfriend.

On the other hand I think people that speak mandarine generally would know how to speak english as well. So whats the point?

[Thirdshifter]

Ok, i need to find a Mandarin Speaking Girlfriend.

On the other hand I think people that speak mandarine generally would know how to speak english as well. So whats the point?

[kennytang]

and for the local chinese newspaper in Malaysia....most Major Newspaper (SinChew Jit Poh and Nanyang Siang Pai) are using tradition writing for the headings and simplified version for the details....

ya. its really good to do it this way

[kennytang]

and for the local chinese newspaper in Malaysia....most Major Newspaper (SinChew Jit Poh and Nanyang Siang Pai) are using tradition writing for the headings and simplified version for the details....

ya. its really good to do it this way

[kennytang]

still remember the days i read (chased) those Wu Xia Xiao Shuo by JingYong (typical warrior-fantasy-heroic-martial-arts plot) during Form 3,4.....

i love that too....
but too bad i read vr vr vr slow.
so i have just read a few... :(

[kennytang]

still remember the days i read (chased) those Wu Xia Xiao Shuo by JingYong (typical warrior-fantasy-heroic-martial-arts plot) during Form 3,4.....

i love that too....
but too bad i read vr vr vr slow.
so i have just read a few... :(

[sim_min]

to those who loves dialects and wish it could be spread to our cucu-cici, have a look at this article which is written in mandarin by my brother.

http://chinese.cari.com.my/myforum/viewthread.php?tid=95543&fpage=1

[sim_min]

to those who loves dialects and wish it could be spread to our cucu-cici, have a look at this article which is written in mandarin by my brother.

http://chinese.cari.com.my/myforum/viewthread.php?tid=95543&fpage=1

[wwhong]

sure, i do agree dialects should be preserved so that people from different dialects will remember their culture and continue spreading it down.

but in terms of official events, i think it's still better to use mandarin. in that case people from every dialect can understand. if u just gonna use one dialect in the event, then surely only the people who can understand it will bother to attend and sort of lose the unity there.

about teaching dialects in school, that's a good idea but do we have that many teachers who know the dialect well? the best thing is for one to understand mandarin and his/her own dialects at the same time.

yeah, dialects should be preserved as every dialect has its own beauty. for eg, there's hakka "mountain song" that you won't find in other dialects and if you wanna scold people just use hokkien and that provides a good effects. hehe....no offense to the hokkien people but that's what many thought...

[wwhong]

sure, i do agree dialects should be preserved so that people from different dialects will remember their culture and continue spreading it down.

but in terms of official events, i think it's still better to use mandarin. in that case people from every dialect can understand. if u just gonna use one dialect in the event, then surely only the people who can understand it will bother to attend and sort of lose the unity there.

about teaching dialects in school, that's a good idea but do we have that many teachers who know the dialect well? the best thing is for one to understand mandarin and his/her own dialects at the same time.

yeah, dialects should be preserved as every dialect has its own beauty. for eg, there's hakka "mountain song" that you won't find in other dialects and if you wanna scold people just use hokkien and that provides a good effects. hehe....no offense to the hokkien people but that's what many thought...

[Schye]

about teaching dialects in school, that's a good idea but do we have that many teachers who know the dialect well? the best thing is for one to understand mandarin and his/her own dialects at the same time.


It is not easy to teach dialects in school as I think it is hard to find a professional in it now. One of my senior was giving a Japanese "Penang Hokkien" lesson last time and i found that hokkien has more than 7 level of pronunciations(if i am not mistaken).

And in fact , the dialacts in our country are not the same as the original one anymore. For example, from what i have heard from my Taiwan friends, there is no such word as "TAPI" but they use "tan si@<hidden>但是". They dont use "jamban" but they use "ben so＠便所". However they have "Kuey" and "sabun".
From this i think we can see that most of the Hokkien who were fisherman had "import" and "export" a lot of words with Malays.
Maybe this is another situation like "Manglish" ---- "Mankien"?!?!
Actually i did ask my parents before if Sabun if hokkien or BM , but they themselves didnt know about it too.

yeah, dialects should be preserved as every dialect has its own beauty. for eg, there's hakka "mountain song" that you won't find in other dialects and if you wanna scold people just use hokkien and that provides a good effects. hehe....no offense to the hokkien people but that's what many thought

I still think that Cantonese provides better "effects" :)
note: i am not hokkien :P

[Schye]

about teaching dialects in school, that's a good idea but do we have that many teachers who know the dialect well? the best thing is for one to understand mandarin and his/her own dialects at the same time.


It is not easy to teach dialects in school as I think it is hard to find a professional in it now. One of my senior was giving a Japanese "Penang Hokkien" lesson last time and i found that hokkien has more than 7 level of pronunciations(if i am not mistaken).

And in fact , the dialacts in our country are not the same as the original one anymore. For example, from what i have heard from my Taiwan friends, there is no such word as "TAPI" but they use "tan si@<hidden>但是". They dont use "jamban" but they use "ben so＠便所". However they have "Kuey" and "sabun".
From this i think we can see that most of the Hokkien who were fisherman had "import" and "export" a lot of words with Malays.
Maybe this is another situation like "Manglish" ---- "Mankien"?!?!
Actually i did ask my parents before if Sabun if hokkien or BM , but they themselves didnt know about it too.

yeah, dialects should be preserved as every dialect has its own beauty. for eg, there's hakka "mountain song" that you won't find in other dialects and if you wanna scold people just use hokkien and that provides a good effects. hehe....no offense to the hokkien people but that's what many thought

I still think that Cantonese provides better "effects" :)
note: i am not hokkien :P

[PeiWen]

yeah, mandarin has gaining its importance nowadays. But really I'm really ashamed of myself that I hardly speak any dialects, albeit I'm a pure Hainanese. Honestly, dialects are rather vital as well, else the future generation will soon forget the origins of these unique languages that seem to be the representatives of the sub-groups of Chinese. (I'm not sure if I'm correct to illustrate dialects in thsi way, anybody please correct me if I'm wrong.) I used to be the mandarin tutor in my Uni for a short semester, I discovered that actually there are many students can't speak mandarin at all. Of course there are also students other than Chinese attend the Mandarin class, which is very comforting and touched as they perceive the importance of mandarin.

[PeiWen]

yeah, mandarin has gaining its importance nowadays. But really I'm really ashamed of myself that I hardly speak any dialects, albeit I'm a pure Hainanese. Honestly, dialects are rather vital as well, else the future generation will soon forget the origins of these unique languages that seem to be the representatives of the sub-groups of Chinese. (I'm not sure if I'm correct to illustrate dialects in thsi way, anybody please correct me if I'm wrong.) I used to be the mandarin tutor in my Uni for a short semester, I discovered that actually there are many students can't speak mandarin at all. Of course there are also students other than Chinese attend the Mandarin class, which is very comforting and touched as they perceive the importance of mandarin.

[yekban81]

Since in the late 20th century, the awareness of the importance of Mandarin language is obvious in our Malaysia society. Chinese parents are mostly sending their children to chinese school. Even non chinese parents are doing so. Back some years then, they prefer their children to be educated in English school. And I am one of products from English school.

I still remember vividly how nervous I was when arriving at UTM, Skudai four years ago to pursue my undergraduate course. Cos chinese in local U, most of them use mandarin in their daily conversation. As for me, I never speak mandarin with friends before even though I had attended some chinese tuition during my primary school and additional chinese class(POL) in secondary school. In these four years back at UTM, I struggled to speak mandarin with friends. I survived and speak fluent mandarin now.

If given choices, I wish to study in chinese school...miss lots of chinese medium literature, comics, and great novels. I am illiterate in chinese writing. :cry:

[yekban81]

Since in the late 20th century, the awareness of the importance of Mandarin language is obvious in our Malaysia society. Chinese parents are mostly sending their children to chinese school. Even non chinese parents are doing so. Back some years then, they prefer their children to be educated in English school. And I am one of products from English school.

I still remember vividly how nervous I was when arriving at UTM, Skudai four years ago to pursue my undergraduate course. Cos chinese in local U, most of them use mandarin in their daily conversation. As for me, I never speak mandarin with friends before even though I had attended some chinese tuition during my primary school and additional chinese class(POL) in secondary school. In these four years back at UTM, I struggled to speak mandarin with friends. I survived and speak fluent mandarin now.

If given choices, I wish to study in chinese school...miss lots of chinese medium literature, comics, and great novels. I am illiterate in chinese writing. :cry:

[naturesimple]

i fully agree that mandarin importance nowadays... i'm grateful that my parents sent me into primary chinese school n then only transfer to government 1 when secondary....this help me a lot cause i can read chinese n write chinese words(not so deep 1 lar of course).........also quite regret never take chinese in spm.
yekban81,
wanna ask u wat course r u pursuing in UTM???

[naturesimple]

i fully agree that mandarin importance nowadays... i'm grateful that my parents sent me into primary chinese school n then only transfer to government 1 when secondary....this help me a lot cause i can read chinese n write chinese words(not so deep 1 lar of course).........also quite regret never take chinese in spm.
yekban81,
wanna ask u wat course r u pursuing in UTM???

[Sylvia]

I was lucky that my parents sent me to chinese primary school too.I took chinese in SPM .It took me sometime to think bout it coz language are not easy to score but fortunately I did well in SPM .I got an A1 :!: .I was so happy :D However,I also face some problems with traditional chinese.I can read and understand them but I can't really write them :?

[Sylvia]

I was lucky that my parents sent me to chinese primary school too.I took chinese in SPM .It took me sometime to think bout it coz language are not easy to score but fortunately I did well in SPM .I got an A1 :!: .I was so happy :D However,I also face some problems with traditional chinese.I can read and understand them but I can't really write them :?

[mish]

Hey!! I just discovered this forum for learning mandarin!! So surprised!! Never thought that such thing like learning mandarin forum would appear here!!

I went to a chinese primary school and took chinese papers in spm. Though I obtained an A1 in english and an A2 in mandarin(spm 2003), but I still think that my mandarin is better than my english. (guess u can find it from my english typing, too much errors right? :oops: )

So, I'm willing to help ..... in learning mandarin!! :)

[yekban81]

Mish,
Thanks a lot for willing to share your knowledge here. Hope to see your active participation over here since this thread has been idle for few weeks.

[mish]

Mish,
Thanks a lot for willing to share your knowledge here. Hope to see your active participation over here since this thread has been idle for few weeks.

sure, sure.... I will participate actively here... :)

[calibre2001]

Hello all,

I'm new to this forum and possess a red- hot burning desire to learn mandarin. In my past, I have tried numerous times and failed miserably without even getting through Lesson 7 of those Speak Mandarin books. Alas, I find this forum inspiring for the likes of me.

I enjoy watching China movies largely because I love listening to proper Putonghua. Yeah, the 'shing shang shong' in it is simply music to my ears. But I reckon its impossible to talk like that here for obvious reasons.

My main problem with Mandarin are the 4 tones. One goes up, one slides down then up, one is continous and the last is a sudden brake. Impossible for me!! Even worse, using the wrong tone produces a wrong meaning! How do Malaysian Chinese ever get the tones correct given that the pronounciation of Malaysian Mandarin is rather flat and improper??

[chenchow]

I think practice makes perfect. Try to speak and learn from mistake. It would be great if you have a conducive environment to learn...

What is your objective of learning? Speaking only? Speaking and writing?

Feel free to pop by any question here..

[calibre2001]

Mr primary objective is to be able to move around Malaysia without much language difficulties. ISo speaking it is, writing seems almost impossible for me. It seems that for Malaysian Chinese, knowledge of BM, English, Mandarin and perhaps Hokkien & Cantonese will provide optimal results for communication around the country. Pretty tough fact of life, innit?

Unfortunately, I don't have a conducive environment to learn the language. Perhaps my previous job was since everybody there spoke it all the time and I was as blur as a sotong. But I couldn't take it personally.

So Malaysians actually speak Mandarin with the 4 tones? I can barely hear them.....

[calibre2001]

Since in the late 20th century, the awareness of the importance of Mandarin language is obvious in our Malaysia society. Chinese parents are mostly sending their children to chinese school. Even non chinese parents are doing so. Back some years then, they prefer their children to be educated in English school. And I am one of products from English school.

I still remember vividly how nervous I was when arriving at UTM, Skudai four years ago to pursue my undergraduate course. Cos chinese in local U, most of them use mandarin in their daily conversation. As for me, I never speak mandarin with friends before even though I had attended some chinese tuition during my primary school and additional chinese class(POL) in secondary school. In these four years back at UTM, I struggled to speak mandarin with friends. I survived and speak fluent mandarin now.

If given choices, I wish to study in chinese school...miss lots of chinese medium literature, comics, and great novels. I am illiterate in chinese writing. :cry:


That's a superb story you have there. There's a question that I like to ask here if you dont mind answering. Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?

[ElansarGelmir]

Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?

Hmmm... I can hardly understand some jokes which took place in mandarin (i understand what's stated, but do not understand why they laugh at it). Maybe I'm a sotong at times?

[calibre2001]

Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?

Hmmm... I can hardly understand some jokes which took place in mandarin (i understand what's stated, but do not understand why they laugh at it). Maybe I'm a sotong at times?


It sounds like a difference in communication frequency to me. Different jokes appeal to different groups of people.

I'm willing to bet that the following joke won't make them laugh at all:

Question: What's the difference between capitalism and communism?

Answer: In capitalism, men exploit men but in communisim it is the exactly the other way round.

If you didn't find that funny, its perfectly fine 'cause only my friends reading Law abroad got the gist of the joke.

[ElansarGelmir]

It means communism == capitalism?
Hmm... Feel like laughing out, but the joke has not enough power for me to do so... kind of corny to me, funny to him.

calibre, if you had listened to anyone from China speaks mandarin, you'll be flabbergasted at their talk-cum-sing mandarin.

[calibre2001]

I actually do know several mainlanders. Those who usually speak the heavily accented Mandarin are usually from the north. Even then, they do vary by region since China is really made of countries. Indeed, the accent of the Southerners are very different. Sounds pretty inferior compared to the northerners.

Interestingly, the Chinese language along with English are both threats to several minority languages in the world. Welsh, Gaelic, some minority language in Taiwan included.

[yekban81]

Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?


Initially when I have a good grasp on Mandarin(speak simple mandarin), I did find some difficulties in getting blended with Mandarin speaking chinese in the aspect of lame jokes and serious stuff; economic, politic due to the use of terminology and advanced chinese words(for beginner). Years of interacting with friends in mandarin have been improving my understanding and capabilty to mix well with them.

[Dr_Tay]

Recommended Mandarin Han Yui Ping Yin classes by Hong Sien Shen at the YMCA, KL.

[masterof_none]

Recommended Mandarin Han Yui Ping Yin classes by Hong Sien Shen at the YMCA, KL.

Thanks for the info.

but care to explain what's Han Yui Ping Yin?. (I know Ping yin, but not sure about han yui?)

[youngyew]

Recommended Mandarin Han Yui Ping Yin classes by Hong Sien Shen at the YMCA, KL.

Thanks for the info.

but care to explain what's Han Yui Ping Yin?. (I know Ping yin, but not sure about han yui?)
Han Yu (typo by dr_tay i suppose) means Han's language. Han, the major ethnic in China (about 90+ percents). Yu, language in mandarin. So basically there were many languages in different ethnics, but Han Yu became the dominant language, and hence the mandarin we know today.

[sabishii]

Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?

Hmmm... I can hardly understand some jokes which took place in mandarin (i understand what's stated, but do not understand why they laugh at it). Maybe I'm a sotong at times?

haha, that's prefectly normal.. taiwanese tend to make 'cold jokes' i.e. jokes that aren't supposed to b funny but they it's funny in a sense that it's supposedly funny, but actually not funny. does that make sense at all? 8) if it doesn't, then take it as a cold joke..

[sabishii]

Aside language difficulties, did you find difficulties blending in with the people due to different points of view, slightly different upbringing etc etc?

Hmmm... I can hardly understand some jokes which took place in mandarin (i understand what's stated, but do not understand why they laugh at it). Maybe I'm a sotong at times?

haha, that's prefectly normal.. taiwanese tend to make 'cold jokes' i.e. jokes that aren't supposed to b funny but they it's funny in a sense that it's supposedly funny, but actually not funny. does that make sense at all? 8) if it doesn't, then take it as a cold joke..

[budakkerek]

cold jokes = sarcastic jokes?
in the sense that they're not actually 'really' funny, but ppl find it funny due to the unfunniness of it *i;m creating my own word here haha*
get what i mean?

like when i'm in a very bad mood, and i say stuff which i dont think funny, but my friends think it's funny and they laugh. smthg like dat.