Why Yahudi?

[yekban81]

"Kaum Yahudi memerintah dunia melalui proksi" Dr. Mahathir (2003) during Persidangan Pertubuhan Islam OIC ke-10 in Putrajaya.

Details:
http://www.kmu.net.my/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=3703
http://www.wolverinemalaya.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=144
http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/10/17/oic.mahathir/

US Pro-Israel(Jew)-US the main proxy of Jew:
http://www.wrmea.com/html/us_aid_to_israel.htm

The Assassination Policy of Israel-Human Right Violation:
http://electronicintifada.net/bytopic/146.shtml

Who is Yahudi in the perspective of this website:
http://www.darulnuman.com/mhikmah/yahudi.html
http://www.jewfaq.org/whoisjew.htm

I totally have no idea who is Yahudi and why Islam doesn't "like" them. I decided to do a research in this topic for my academic project. Hope to hear others' view on this issue.

[Europa]

I thought the Yahudi refers to the Hebrew Jews?

[david_david]

racially jews r close to the arabs, like cousins I think.Not sure, but I think tat the languages( arabic & hebrew) echo each other.
Shalom means peace...sounds like salam in arabic


Jews can refer to the religion or the race.

Ppl whose mother are jewish are considered jewish.

IMHO the issue is because of the founding of the state of israel in the midst Arab countries , land , control of sites holy to both,arab & muslim pride, perceived double standards by the US & Western world towards Israel,maybe jewish" prowess" also.

jews hav strong sense of brotherhood, there are 2 sets of rules for them 2 treat jews & non Jews.

Arab states were humilated by Israel in 1948 coz they were defeated by a weaker Israeli army( outnumbered & underequiped)

Attacking & criticising Israel is a good way to prop up the arab states' despotic regime.

Large number of muslims sympathasie wif suicide bombings and other terrorist activities.Muslims hav sense of brotherhood 2, so attacking the palestinians is like attacking them.

on the other hand, Israel's occupation is unlawful & brutal( collective punishment, destruction of homes, assasinations,military checkpoints, etc) .US is definately Pro-Israel.

also George Soros, who allegedly caused the asian financial crisis is jewish.

arguably, jews are intellectually superior( particularly Ashkenazy jews...not sure about spelling).. they fill high positions in the West, haf vast financial empires,

they won many noble prizes & many r great scientists, mathematicians ... www.jewhoo.com

einstein had a jewish background & was offered the Presidency of Israel.

saying that Jews rule the world...sounds a bit paranoid

[da-hype]

saying that Jews rule the world...sounds a bit paranoid

i think what Dr.M meant when he said that was.. the jews (israel) are being allowed to bully palestine and break UN laws, human right laws and bla bla because the US is backing them up. The US gives Israel between 6 - 8 billions dollars a year for millitary support. And the palestinians (don't have an official army) are forced to throw stones, shoes and once in a while a suicide bombing to "fight" back.

[debbie]

Ada apa dengan Yahudi? I'm Hebrew... so careful. *grins* Don't stereotype, ok? It's not like the Jews ARE "bullying" them. It's.. er.. how do you explain? Our right, I suppose. Yeah. It dates back to ancient times ... some of our(their) land, the Palestinians claimed it's theirs... something like tht. And they/we don't break UN laws cos religious laws are held sacred far above wht UN laws may demand. Don't worry, I'm NOT Jew. Israel's military is one of the world's best because , they believe, of God's doing.

[kevinkhoo1986]

So the so called "Yahudi" is christian? Where are they came from? Actually like yekban81, i am still confused about the term "Yahudi". Since i was a kid, i only learn that "Orang yahudi adalah bangsa yang hina" and so on.... But i do not know why they hate jewish so much especially the muslim. Can someone clarify it further?

[yekban81]

All this while, I think the Yahudi's "capture" of Palestin (as reclaim vs occupation) since 1948 strucks anger and hatred among Arabs until now.

I don't think Yahudi = Christian. In fact, Christian was(or is) anti-Yahudi. Read the article: Mengenal Siapa Yahudi in the third URL which I have provided in my first post. Someone has reminded me that Einstein was once offered a presidential position in Israel. Even Steven Spielberg is a jewish out of my ignorance. Well, I noticed that Israel is not recognised by Malaysia since we are prohibited from entering Israel as can be seen written in our international pasport.

[phantom]

the middle east conflict is a very tough and mind-breaking issue.pointing fingers wont solve anything.

when i am in m'sia,the palestinians seem to be the innocent ppl while the ppl of israel are pointed as the problem creater.

but vice versa r being pinpointed here in usa.

to put it simple,the mass media either in m'sia or usa only care to show one side of argument.

saying that palestinian were humilated in the 1948 war is like agreeing with the killin that took place then.nope,palestinian were not humilated but were taken their rights without their permission.

rewind the history.in my microbiology class i learned that a british jew scientist have found that a good bacteria could turn something useful for da military purposes.his findings had helped britain to win the 1st world war.i forgot what he managed to create from the good bacteria and becoz of his success,he had asked the Goverment of Britain a piece of land for the Jewish ppl around the globe to congest.

and that was how Britian had used its legacy to build a nation,now called Israel.

the problem now is not about hating the jewish and throwing them out from israel but how to divide israel to create two different peaceful nations,one being palestinian and another being israel.

siding one side would only lead to stalemate and more killing and more blood shed.

[digimushu]

Ada apa dengan Yahudi? I'm Hebrew... so careful. *grins* Don't stereotype, ok? It's not like the Jews ARE "bullying" them. It's.. er.. how do you explain? Our right, I suppose. Yeah. It dates back to ancient times ... some of our(their) land, the Palestinians claimed it's theirs... something like tht. And they/we don't break UN laws cos religious laws are held sacred far above wht UN laws may demand. Don't worry, I'm NOT Jew. Israel's military is one of the world's best because , they believe, of God's doing.

Don't you think thats just like the muslim extremists yelling 'jihad!' and 'allahu akhbar' while commiting suicide bombings?(just an example, dont shoot me). Somehow, I feel that religion is the lamest excuse for a war since time immemorial(forgive my agnosticism). To me,since the world has so many religions, no one god's law is above another. All are equal, as all men are supposedly created equal. I dont think any religion advocates the use of violence in solving problems.

Personally, I do not condone violence between nations, especially on the basis of religion. The israeli attack with helicopters on palistinian muslim leaders is wrong. A cease fire was on and it was violated by the israelis. No nation has the right to invade the sovereignity of another. I admit, Iraq invading Kuwait was wrong, and the UN has the right to respond the way it did the first time. However, i'm still waiting for the WMD that is supposed to be the reason to go to war for the second time.

What justifies the taking of one's life? In the bible, jesus says, if one slap u on the left cheek, turn the other cheek and let them slap u again. Tolerance and moderation is the key to every religion. As they say, an eye for an eye will make the world go blind.

A peaceful solution can always be achieved if everyone avoids extremism. Discussion, dialogues and understanding another's perspective is important. if all fails, let the leader settle it over a game of chess, at least the people will not have to suffer the ravages of war.

[Europa]

I always thought that the land issue can be simplified in this way :

Originally, the Jews lived around what is now known today as Israel. Then came the Crusades, and they got displaced all over the place (mostly Europe and they incurred the wrath of the native Europeans, mostly due to their accumulated wealth from trading and their standing as infidels in the eyes of devout Christians). Fast foward to WWII, with the Holocaust. The 'world' feels guilty over 2mil dead Jews (and not 50mil dead Chinese and mils of dead of various citizenship, including the Allies themselves) and gave them the land title of their homeland (over the objections of the current landowners, the Palestinians).

The Palestinians got displaced, and Egypt, Syria and Jordan decided to help them by launching the Yom Kippur War(also known as the Six Day War) but failed due to the Israel's strategic terrain advantage, superior equipment and training although vastly outnumbered and outgunned and sheer desperado of the Israelites. The West Bank and some other places got captured by Israel before a truce was called.

Since then, with a military option out of the option (with strong US military aid) the Palestinians launched the infatida and the situation remained more or less so until today with the height of Israeli-Palestine relations achieved during Rabin and Barak's tenure as President and PM respectively. The most development would be the roadmap developed by the Middle East Quartert (US, EU, UN, Russia), preceeded by a peace plan backed by President Clinton.

The Muslim world hates Israel for preceived oppression of the Palestinians(remember, a significant majority of them still stayed in refugee camps with the Israel military intruding every now and then with stories coming out of those events putting the Israeli troopers in bad light). Heck, the current PM was said to have initiated a massacare at one of those camps when he was Def. Minister! Besides, the Muslim world was also outraged at what they see as desecration of the 3rd holiest site in the Muslim world (Temple Mount) Hence when Saddam Hussein and even Al-Qaeda said that they sided with the Palestinian 'brothers-in-arms' they recieved support from the Muslim grassroots!

Long short story isn't it? But the story has its origins dating waaaay back into the Biblical times, so its still relatively short. Please correct and mistakes in my brief interpretation, if any. So obiviously the solution isn't going to be simple. IMHO, I'll be hoping that the solution would be similar to Tom Clancy's one in 'The Sum of All Fears' but I'm afraid its too idealistic. Anyway, I still think both sides(Jews against the Islamic world in general) is at fault here, for not accomodating EACH OTHER's presence in Israel!

[da-hype]

Ada apa dengan Yahudi? I'm Hebrew... so careful. *grins* Don't stereotype, ok? It's not like the Jews ARE "bullying" them. It's.. er.. how do you explain? Our right, I suppose. Yeah. It dates back to ancient times ... some of our(their) land, the Palestinians claimed it's theirs... something like tht. And they/we don't break UN laws cos religious laws are held sacred far above wht UN laws may demand. Don't worry, I'm NOT Jew. Israel's military is one of the world's best because , they believe, of God's doing.

no offence but that one of the dumbest things i've heard in a while. The reason their militarry is the best is because.. like i said.. the US gives them 6-8 biliion a year for military forces.


oh and phantom, just because you are in the US and they show palestinians as bad people.. does not make US news right. The huge support from the US government and media to Israel .. is because alot of the media and senetors are backed up by rich jews.
Just to name a few... Time warner, AOL, Starbucks, FOX .. and so on.

Put a side the debate of land... and think about this..
Israel has an "official" army.. and palestine does not.. while Israel takes more land and grow larger.. they are also killing innocent civilians everyday with guns / tanks / planes and so on. The palestinians on the other hand.. throw stones, shoes and once in a while a suicide bombing. Is you pay attension..you will hear in the news once in a while a suicide boming in israel.. then israel responds buy bombing regfugee camps where terrorist suspects are hiding. It's like The LAPD bombing south central just because there are 2 drug dealers homes there.

you guys might not remember this picture, but i remember seeing it on malaysian news and foreign news in 99 i think. it's a picture of the Israel army opening fire at a dad and his son.

http://www.hirc.org/palestine.html
http://www.witherspoonsociety.org/10_things_about_mideast.htm
http://www.islam-usa.com/25ques.html


NOTE: yahudi = Jews... and NO muslims don't hate non beleivers. Some say, to hate people of the book is like hating your own brother.

[__earth]

Ada apa dengan Yahudi? I'm Hebrew... so careful. *grins* Don't stereotype, ok?

Are you really a jew or are you joking?


NOTE: yahudi = Jews... and NO muslims don't hate non beleivers. Some say, to hate people of the book is like hating your own brother.

You meant, no muslims hate non-believers right?

[debbie]

[quote=debbie]Ada apa dengan Yahudi? I'm Hebrew... so careful. *grins* Don't stereotype, ok? It's not like the Jews ARE "bullying" them. It's.. er.. how do you explain? Our right, I suppose. Yeah. It dates back to ancient times ... some of our(their) land, the Palestinians claimed it's theirs... something like tht. And they/we don't break UN laws cos religious laws are held sacred far above wht UN laws may demand. Don't worry, I'm NOT Jew. Israel's military is one of the world's best because , they believe, of God's doing.

Don't you think thats just like the muslim extremists yelling 'jihad!' and 'allahu akhbar' while commiting suicide bombings?(just an example, dont shoot me). Somehow, I feel that religion is the lamest excuse for a war since time immemorial(forgive my agnosticism). To me,since the world has so many religions, no one god's law is above another. All are equal, as all men are supposedly created equal. I dont think any religion advocates the use of violence in solving problems.

Personally, I do not condone violence between nations, especially on the basis of religion. The israeli attack with helicopters on palistinian muslim leaders is wrong. A cease fire was on and it was violated by the israelis. No nation has the right to invade the sovereignity of another. I admit, Iraq invading Kuwait was wrong, and the UN has the right to respond the way it did the first time. However, i'm still waiting for the WMD that is supposed to be the reason to go to war for the second time.

What justifies the taking of one's life? In the bible, jesus says, if one slap u on the left cheek, turn the other cheek and let them slap u again. Tolerance and moderation is the key to every religion. As they say, an eye for an eye will make the world go blind.

Do you actually know wht Jesus meant whn he said tht? Their military is the best because of God. It has nthng to do with the money. Why on earth is the US military not the world's best if they have the money?

Digimushu, don't misunderstand. Religion is not the excuse 4 war. We cannot give away wht is ours. Phantom, we aren't the "problem creators", ok?

[theT]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.

for example, I used to have a jew roommate. And when I first moved in she guessed that I'm a muslim because I'm from Malaysian and how my name sound. Then we had party that night. there she asked me whether I hate her. when I asked her why she said that, she replied because most muslim hate jews. I didn't hate her, don't hate her and won't hate her. She was one of the wonderful person I ever met.

For me, I can understand why the palestinians hate jews (Israel). Israel violate the palistinean soil. But I don't understand why some people hate their neighbor/teacher/classmate or you name it coz they're jews. these people done nothing to you but you punish them because of some other jews(israel) wrongdoing

[david_david]

Dr. M should hav spoken out against the Israeli gov, it's actions, etc, n Pro-Israeli US....instead of lambasting all of da jews....y make racists remarks in an International muslim conference?

definately sends da wrong message.

[yekban81]

I don't think that all jews are as "cold blooded" as those in Israel. In fact a person who is jew because of his/her family background(mother is jewish) may not even learn nor practice the jew's religion (judaism) , but remain as an atheist. I guess Einstein is an atheist even that he is a jew due to family background.

Undeniably, US is a pro-Israel. One may view that US is being used by Israel to satisfy her needs. Alternatively, one may suggest that US is giving military and money aid to Israel as a win-win strategy since Israel would be the US main entrance to the Middle East. Since the collapse of Saddam's rejime in Iraq, this strategy seems to be redundant. So why do US still help Israel? I am thinking that the possibility of US economic and perhaps politics too is being controlled by jew who support Israel. Could US become another homeland to the Jew extremist like in Israel since anything impossible can be made possible in a democracy system?

[da-hype]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.


Muslims hate jews?? since when do ALL muslims hate jews? i don't. and FYI there are jews all over the middle east.. in yeman for example.. you don't hear muslims killing jews in yeman do you? Or other parts of the world. don't generalize. it's idiotic and anoyying.



david_david, yeah i agree. Dr M should have not made the racist comments.




NOTE: yahudi = Jews... and NO muslims don't hate non beleivers. Some say, to hate people of the book is like hating your own brother.

You meant, no muslims hate non-believers right?

sorry __earth i meant.. muslims don't hate non beleivers. typo. :P

[debbie]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.

for example, I used to have a jew roommate. And when I first moved in she guessed that I'm a muslim because I'm from Malaysian and how my name sound. Then we had party that night. there she asked me whether I hate her. when I asked her why she said that, she replied because most muslim hate jews. I didn't hate her, don't hate her and won't hate her. She was one of the wonderful person I ever met.

For me, I can understand why the palestinians hate jews (Israel). Israel violate the palistinean soil. But I don't understand why some people hate their neighbor/teacher/classmate or you name it coz they're jews. these people done nothing to you but you punish them because of some other jews(israel) wrongdoing


Israel doesn't WANT to "violate Palestinian soil". Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times. It's god given, an inheritance so we can't let it go no matter wht. So u c, religion is not excuse for war. If some1 took away something your dad or mum gave you as inheritance, would you let it go? Ariel Sharon knew what he was doing. God knows Israel's position, god is with Israel. And again, I'm not a Jew. Being Hebrew doesn't mean one is Jewish. Not all Jews are Hebrew.

[da-hype]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.

for example, I used to have a jew roommate. And when I first moved in she guessed that I'm a muslim because I'm from Malaysian and how my name sound. Then we had party that night. there she asked me whether I hate her. when I asked her why she said that, she replied because most muslim hate jews. I didn't hate her, don't hate her and won't hate her. She was one of the wonderful person I ever met.

For me, I can understand why the palestinians hate jews (Israel). Israel violate the palistinean soil. But I don't understand why some people hate their neighbor/teacher/classmate or you name it coz they're jews. these people done nothing to you but you punish them because of some other jews(israel) wrongdoing


Israel doesn't WANT to "violate Palestinian soil". Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times. It's god given, an inheritance so we can't let it go no matter wht. So u c, religion is not excuse for war. If some1 took away something your dad or mum gave you as inheritance, would you let it go? Ariel Sharon knew what he was doing. God knows Israel's position, god is with Israel. And again, I'm not a Jew. Being Hebrew doesn't mean one is Jewish. Not all Jews are Hebrew.


LOL.. this is some funny shit.. when did god talk to you? did he tell you he is supporting israel? you make it sound like a sporting event .. and GOD is Israel's number 1 fan. lol

Just wondering.. if Israel is for the jews.. then how come its still growing in size? why not just take the SMALL area since the bible times?

[qedx]

hmmm it seems they conveniently forgot the part where God kensel the gift

[theT]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.


Muslims hate jews?? since when do ALL muslims hate jews? i don't. and FYI there are jews all over the middle east.. in yeman for example.. you don't hear muslims killing jews in yeman do you? Or other parts of the world. don't generalize. it's idiotic and anoyying.



sorry for generalization. maybe i should've said most muslim that I met.

[digimushu]

Debbie, Debbie,

ANY unprovoked preemptive strike by one government on another is wrong. Plus, the helicopter attacks are not a surgical strike, many other civilians were harmed in that attack. Tell me, is that justified? Does that make the Israelis more 'good' than the Palistinians? Will it even end the conflict on the Gaza strip? Basically the Israelis gave the UN the finger the same way Iraq was attacked.

There is no right or wrong anymore in this world, at least no absolute right or wrong as far as the governments are concerned. The only thing that remains, is just a conflict of interest.

if the israelis are just defending their turf and fortifying their land, instead of initiating a expansionary policy, I would see them as the victims. But after the helicopter attacks, I feel that the Israelis are no different than the muslim extremists that they are targeting.

[topdog]

Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times.
umm...ours?

if i were god/yahweh/allah/sky/whatever, i would just smite the whole middle east, palestine and israel included. habis cerita.

/ducks

[digimushu]

Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times.
umm...ours?

if i were god/yahweh/allah/sky/whatever, i would just smite the whole middle east, palestine and israel included. habis cerita.

/ducks

Seconded!

Similiar to your parents giving u a rotan when u r a troublemaker
hahaha
*ducks with topdog*

[chenchow]

In fact, when Dr. Mahathir made that comment "Jews rule the world by proxy", he doesn't necessarily have a very negative connotation. That sentence was brought out completely out of context.

In fact, Dr. Mahathir even mentioned that he had a number of Jewish friends, and he did specifically mentioned that not all Jews are bad, and he was trying to highlight the specific situations over the West Bank.

In my opinion, Dr. Mahathir meant that although there are very few million Jews, many of them are high achievers, and it is something that Muslims could learn and forge ahead, and Dr. Mahathir was not promoting hatred or any terrorism or fighting acts. He was trying to spur the spirits of Muslims to learn knowledge, and keep up to the pace of the world's development.

Just my two cents.

[Thirdshifter]

Israel doesn't WANT to "violate Palestinian soil". Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times. It's god given, an inheritance so we can't let it go no matter wht. So u c, religion is not excuse for war. If some1 took away something your dad or mum gave you as inheritance, would you let it go? Ariel Sharon knew what he was doing. God knows Israel's position, god is with Israel. And again, I'm not a Jew. Being Hebrew doesn't mean one is Jewish. Not all Jews are Hebrew.

That's one side of the Story. Palestinians or Muslims in general believes in the same thing, that God is on their side and the holy land belongs to them and they have every Gods given right to claim it.

But!

What about History? Hasn't Judaism been around longer then Islam has?
Yes! but Muslims Believes that From the time of Adam, It was always the same religion. Just a different name. The religion whom they openly admit was practiced and preeched by Abraham, Moses and Jesus. Islam is just another Brand of the same religion. Same teachings just a different Sects of this Monotheist religion. Islam tries to bring the gap closer by letting Jewish and Christians Females to be Weded to a Muslim Men without converting her. Meaning, they don't need to believe that Muhammad is their Messenger and are not obligated to it's rules. For an example, The prohibition of consuming Alcoholic Beverages. All for what? Because Muslims believes that it is the same religion. Just like Shia and sunni division. A little different here and there but a whole lot of similarities everywhere.

The only thing that Really separates a Muslim, Christian and Jews is who is who. Jesus etc,- As far as i'm concerned Christians, Jews and Muslims shares the same God and their Holliest books are almost a duplicate of each other. The same God Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad believed in is the same God Muslims, Christians and Jews believes in.

Why the hatred?
I can almost guarantee that all 3 of them never preeched Hatred.

But i know that Moses (a Jew) warned Jews about the future,

"For I know that after my death you will act corruptly and turn from the way which I have commanded you; and evil will befall you in the latter days, for you will do that which is evil in the sight of the Lord, provoking Him to anger with the work of your hands (Deut. 31:29).

Early Christians, Ex-Jews? Echoed Moses by writing many anti-semite sentiments in the new testament.

And finally the Koran never specifically mentioned about hating Jews but it did however warned Muslims to beware of all non-Believers. Also if you had read history when Yathrib (Medina) was atacked by Meccan's The Jewish Community in Medina who signed the agreement to protect Medina regardless of Religion differences had actually gave help to the Meccan's and were accused of treason to Medina. It was since then Muslims became more aware of Jews. Since then also Jews starts hating Muslims as well, because the Many Jewish who commited treason were executed or driven out of Medina, not all were but the rest left because of the stigmatism. The Attack Sucess was/is blamed on the Jews.

But.. That ofcourse was 1400 years ago. I as a Muslim had moved on. Muslim Nations for centuries had been a safe sanctuary for Jews. Christians had been running around killing jews up until 1945. Because Of the big rivalry of Islam vs Christians from the time of the Crusaders. Egypt, for an example still have many Jewish settlers and no matter how unbelievable you think it is.. they lived in peace. Still are.

What does this has to with the topic? Yahudi or better known as Jews are just like you and me. They want to live in peace. Israel is a good attempt in achiving it. I totally support the idea of Israel. Even though there's a lot of Ultra-orthodox Jews that claim Jews are not meant to be goverment of nations, Leaders of Organizations or hold any power i say screw that. Just as how i agree with a creation of an independant soveirn nation of Palestine i want Israel to exist as well.

Also Jewish aren't the only one being killed/hated because of their religion. Try be a Muslim nowdays. :D

Have we forgot the Kosovo? same people, Same color. Just that one thinks Jesus is a prohpet and one think he's God. Well i guess i can blame that one on Jesus.. can't wait for the resurrection!

In Islam we were thought of tolerance and i for once hope Yasser Arafat and the Many Arabs that hate this Idea tolerate it for the sake of young Muslims and young Israelites. There's a huge difference between the goverment and the people of these Lands.

In a bigger picture, all humans are interconnected. Regardless of your color, Political belief, Religious belief and Sexuality, No matter what theory you want go by all Humans came from the same ancestors. Adam or Apes we're all Still Humans.

So I guess this whole world belongs to everybody. Israel included :)

So debbie, If Malaysia is the birth right of Malays then is it justifiable to kill other ethnics? Is it fair if i was the PM of Malaysia and was a Malay and I chased all non-malays out, throw you into refugee camp and promised Malays that they will not return, not in my watch.. I mean acording to your logic Malaysia is after all my birthright, I wasn't born in Malaysia but still i'm a Malay and i have the right to do whatever i want, correct? But in this case not only God is on myside UMNO and Hang tuah is too. :D

[gatecrasher]

:lol: :lol: :lol:
this thread is the funniest!

[aquila]

I think many here come to the thread with set values and beliefs already. I don't think anyone can honestly say that he or she has no bias towards the entire issue.

I met a Jew who once told me something interesting. His friend, who went to the same jewish high school, decided to take up German and Arabic, languages used by people who "hate" the Jews.

Interesting assessment, don't you think? I honestly don't know how to respond to that. It is difficult to examine the situation impartially but we must. Otherwise, the conflict will remain a conflict.

During the British colonialist times, rich Jews went back to the now Israel, then Palestine and bought up sections of lands. Those pieces of land were not very ariable or profitable so I suppose they were bought pretty easily. When the British left, the Jews formed Israel with the bought land, simple as that. Many Jews returned from the diaspora (away from anti-semitic Europe - remember the holocaust?)

Then, the six wars between Arab nations and Israel started, and surprisingly Israel won all of them. I think this is why some believe that God is on Israel's side. They ARE a small country and yet they managed to beat all those alliances, proponents argue. With each war, more Arab land is annexed. Now Israel argues that those land cannot be returned for strategic military purposes. For eg, there is a hill (maybe West Bank?) which Israel believes will be a bad place to give up. Syria can easily shoot Israel from that hill. I can't remember the exact name of the place.

Anyhow, now Palestinians are living as refugees since they don't have their own land. They are arguing for a right to coexist. With so much mistrust on both sides, I think it is difficult for the conflict to be resolved. Look at both countries now -led by hardline extremists. Yasser Arafat is out to be a Palestinian hero by being belligerent and opposed to the peace process. (He believes himself to be champion of Palestinian rights - not very effective leadership if you ask me) Ariel Sharon is a hawk. (built the war, started the helicopter operatives) He once led a military operative that surrounded Arafat and other Palestinians in a valley. He now regrets not killing Arafat then.

And then there is the thing about the wall. From the Israeli perspective, security barrier. palestinian viewpoint -apartheid wall. Which is which? Now Palestinians cannot enter Israel to work or use services - hospital, school, etc. But the number of suicide bombings have decreased.

I think the only solution is to end the cycle of hate. Arabs should stop teaching children that Jews are evil. (Read Carmen bin Laden's memoir). Jews should then be less suspicious of Arabs/Palestinians (and stop bombing homes in order to weed out terrorists).

Why US is pro Israel? Hmm, just look at Washington DC. THere are so many proIsraeli lobby groups. POlitics in DC are tricky, my friends. You need the support of powerful groups and Jewish lobby groups are damn powerful. They are also sometimes special interest groups that donate large chunks of money to presidential candidates.

Jews have been badly misunderstood for decades. Don't look at them with your preconceptions. One of my friends in Malaysia once said to my face that he hates Jews. I was shocked and angry. Has he ever met a Jew? Does he know a Jew? How can he make judgements based on what other people (or the TV) say?

Definitely something to think about. Don't hate the Jews just because someone tells you to. Think for yourself.

[Schye]

The lands is there since the Earth was formed ... It belongs to noone. So, why fight for it?
Human ... Human ...

[__earth]

all your base are belong to us

[digimushu]

Actually if you think about it, we belong to the earth, not the other way round...

[__earth]

Actually if you think about it, we belong to the earth, not the other way round...

yup, you all belong to me.

all your base are belong to us.

[Thirdshifter]

Anyhow, now Palestinians are living as refugees since they don't have their own land. They are arguing for a right to coexist. With so much mistrust on both sides, I think it is difficult for the conflict to be resolved. Look at both countries now -led by hardline extremists.
You said it! It's not religion, it's not people, it's extremism.


I think the only solution is to end the cycle of hate. Arabs should stop teaching children that Jews are evil. (Read Carmen bin Laden's memoir). Jews should then be less suspicious of Arabs/Palestinians (and stop bombing homes in order to weed out terrorists).

I think this is an Issue that goes both ways. Arabs needs to stop hating jews for the sake of it and Jewish should stop doing the same. Real life experience had taught me that, Jewish like many other races or religion are pretty much as messed up as everyone else. Nothing special. Heck! i work with so many of them, i lost track. Never had a problem with any of them. Some are the nicest people i've met., but I still remember on Sept. 11 (my 2nd day at work) I was quite impressed?/Shocked? how convinced they were that it was Arab-Muslims that did it. Just like how convinced they were when the oklahoma bombing happened. Anything horrific, unconventional, "Extreme difining" are the works of Arabs. I ofcourse shared the same feeling :D you can't blame them.

Yesterday (Sept. 11) i hoped to see some sort of demonstration like those we see in NYC almost every month to protest about something - just for the heck of it :D, But this time i hoped that It'll be in a pre-dominant Muslim Country. Recomers/Malaysian should gather and do a demonstration in KL. Protest against those who turned today's Islam into something having to do with decapitations, the slashing of throats, abducting innocent civilians and exploding people. Those who have fixed the image of Muslims in the eyes of the world as barbarians and savages who are not good for anything except slaughtering people. Maybe?

Like charity, Hatred and Love starts at home.


Why US is pro Israel? Hmm, just look at Washington DC.

Because they are many senators who wants to fullfill the prophecy of returning the chosen people to their land? :D on a more serious note, Many Arabs want to eliminate Israel. Period.

Without the support it gets from USA (5 billion in milatary expenditure and 4 billion in economy) its Ally, I'm damn sure the Arab league will keep striking Israel until they had killed everyone! and make it uninhabitable! Nah, i don't think so. All it is is major propaganda. I hear them cry, Oh! the Arabs wants to kill us... They want to drive us into the sea.... They want us dead. They want my unborn son to be dead... goes on and on. Well the last guy that attempted that was Hitler not Yussouf bin Gabba.

Remember Chechnya? Russia bomb the shit out of it. Flattened the entire place and say now build your own country! After few years Russia saw some progress and said dang it! Send in some more troops, we need to bomb them again. 10-12 years later these guys are super-mad pissed off, goes to a school and just kill everyone then can. Desperate? yeah, I think so.

But Why!? Because they hate non-Believers so much?
I don't think so.

Every person that dies from extremism is our fault. It's a Human failure. Just like what happened to the Armenia, Jews in WW2, Rwanda, Sudanese are dying as we speak. There's a lot of shit that is going on. Pointing towards race and religion is an easy way out of it. I think that is where the problem lies. We find someone to blame then we bomb the shit out of it. It worked well in chechnya didn' it? If all religion was to vanish today i doubt the Israel and palestine conflict will find it's end.


Jews have been badly misunderstood for decades. Don't look at them with your preconceptions.
True. Very true indeed. Just like how jehovah witnesses, Borned again christians, Mormons, Muslims, Iraqi's, Palestinians, Malays?

One of my friends in Malaysia once said to my face that he hates Jews.
Your friend is not alone. There's many who would share his opinion. Just like how the Palestinians are refered as Militia Men. Gunmen, Suicide Bomber, Depressed, no freedom yada yada by the American and mostly west press. Jews in Israeli are refered as Puak Pelampau Yahudi on RTM.RTM2.TV3 and NTV7.

The Media is atleast particially responsible for this. With information people can make a sound decision. But when you are fed bullshit 24/7 what do you expect? if not extremism?

[budakkerek]

that's why you cant believe everything you read. That's why we should look and learn, not only from books, but from ppl. Dont..or should i say, never, overgeneralize. Coz that's what started all this shit in the first place
My 2 cents

[debbie]

sometimes it's so obvious that muslims hate jews. their hatred could be something with no basis.even jews realize that.

for example, I used to have a jew roommate. And when I first moved in she guessed that I'm a muslim because I'm from Malaysian and how my name sound. Then we had party that night. there she asked me whether I hate her. when I asked her why she said that, she replied because most muslim hate jews. I didn't hate her, don't hate her and won't hate her. She was one of the wonderful person I ever met.

For me, I can understand why the palestinians hate jews (Israel). Israel violate the palistinean soil. But I don't understand why some people hate their neighbor/teacher/classmate or you name it coz they're jews. these people done nothing to you but you punish them because of some other jews(israel) wrongdoing


Israel doesn't WANT to "violate Palestinian soil". Like I said, the land was ours in the beginning... in the bible times. It's god given, an inheritance so we can't let it go no matter wht. So u c, religion is not excuse for war. If some1 took away something your dad or mum gave you as inheritance, would you let it go? Ariel Sharon knew what he was doing. God knows Israel's position, god is with Israel. And again, I'm not a Jew. Being Hebrew doesn't mean one is Jewish. Not all Jews are Hebrew.


LOL.. this is some funny shit.. when did god talk to you? did he tell you he is supporting israel? you make it sound like a sporting event .. and GOD is Israel's number 1 fan. lol

Just wondering.. if Israel is for the jews.. then how come its still growing in size? why not just take the SMALL area since the bible times?



I'm really sorry if you chose to take it that way.I was just relating it from an insiders point of view, it's up to you to think what you want. I never said god talked to me about that but it's in the bible. Plz refer Deuteronomy 12 the last part ... NIV, Zondervan publications. *grits teeth and tries to keep controled even though bombarded big time*

Digimushu and the rest.... I apologize profusely for making the Israelites sound as demented as the Islam extremists. Truth be told, the Israelites aren't. Maybe the way I put it made it rather "too much". Please don't think Hebrews are radical religious extremists nor big bullies. It's just a matter of believe and I'm sure most Hebrews can't control what the govt is doing so don't go around stereotyping or thinking they are psychotic. I was relating it just as it is according to ancient rules... it's NOT outdated, trust me.

This is getting off hand. I apologize. Will think "democracy" before rambling out the truth according to wht I knew.

[da-hype]

debbie, I'm not stereotyping. of cource it the Israel government. not ALL the jews. just because BUSH is an idiot.. does not mean all american are.

a matter a fact.. i don't think anyone in recom if silly enough to stereotype ALL the jews in the world just because of the Israel government. :)

[debbie]

Didn't mean YOU personally. General, ok? Your's is the 1st parapgraph only, da-hype.

[digimushu]

debbie, I'm not stereotyping. of cource it the Israel government. not ALL the jews. just because BUSH is an idiot.. does not mean all american are.

a matter a fact.. i don't think anyone in recom if silly enough to stereotype ALL the jews in the world just because of the Israel government. :)

Yeaps^^

[jiinjoo]

Yeah - this thread is funny, but sad too :?

For me, I can understand why the palestinians hate jews (Israel). Israel violate the palistinean soil. But I don't understand why some people hate their neighbor/teacher/classmate or you name it coz they're jews. these people done nothing to you but you punish them because of some other jews(israel) wrongdoing
I think theT and her roommate should be the leaders of israel and palestian.

Dr. M was just being himself don't you think?

And we really need to separate jew the religion from jew the race, eventhough most jews practice judaism. So in some sense the hatred is more racial than religious, but somehow the (religious) Muslim world has a problem with it. I have a problem with it, but no one says that the Chinese race has a problem with middle east.

US is pro Israel not because they side with their race or anything, it's more like trying to have a foothold in middle east for other benefits, oil maybe? Yes US economics and politics are heavily dominated by the jewish race, but there are stronger arguments of why US side Israel rather than, say, Iraq? :)

Could US become another homeland to the Jew extremist like in Israel since anything impossible can be made possible in a democracy system?
That's good question. US has been helping Falungong and supporting Tibet too. Frankly, I don't know the answer, but it does seem that way. Maybe some historical events can shed light? China's revolution started in Japan, our independence started with a gang in Cambridge, seeds of extremism seems to be started by people who are away from their purpose and see the issue from a 3rd point of view?


Then, the six wars between Arab nations and Israel started, and surprisingly Israel won all of them. I think this is why some believe that God is on Israel's side. They ARE a small country and yet they managed to beat all those alliances, proponents argue.
Yes that is a valid argument. I think we (probably wif da-hype) are just tryin to find a more secular one, like how to have such a strong army in such a small country. If you have some male Singaporean friends, why don't you ask them? Their army was entirely set up by Israel 40 years ago. Maybe you'll find something more tangible to add on to the reason.

I think the only solution is to end the cycle of hate. Arabs should stop teaching children that Jews are evil. (Read Carmen bin Laden's memoir). Jews should then be less suspicious of Arabs/Palestinians (and stop bombing homes in order to weed out terrorists).
I resonate much with this. Rule of thumb - it takes two hands to clap.

The lands is there since the Earth was formed ... It belongs to noone. So, why fight for it?
Economist: Because there are limited resources on earth and everyone wants to gather more resources. Haven't you play Ages of Empire, Civilization, Rise of Nations or games like that?
Philosopher: Because humans have a tendency to change like nature. When everything is peaceful and boring, they have a tendency to want change and cause trouble. Moreover, human has a love for pride and flattery. If you blow yourself up and in heaven God said "Well done!" you'll feel so good.
Anarchist: The Land Belongs To ME!

all your base are belong to me! :D

[topdog]

In fact, when Dr. Mahathir made that comment "Jews rule the world by proxy", he doesn't necessarily have a very negative connotation. That sentence was brought out completely out of context.
i think the world community at large doesn't give a rat's ass about what dr. m has said, is saying, or will say.

of coz, this comment doesnt add anything useful to the discussion. just felt like making it:D

[ElansarGelmir]

well, i think the govt is the culprit who instills the hatred towards jews among malaysians. in our BTN course, they ruled out that the Jews is one of Malaysia's biggest treat.

[gatecrasher]

well, i think the govt is the culprit who instills the hatred towards jews among malaysians. in our BTN course, they ruled out that the Jews is one of Malaysia's biggest treat.
strangely, they also said that shia islam is "ajaran sesat". this implies that iran, a fellow muslim nation, is a nation of infidels.
but i wonder if members of anti-israel govts hate jews personally. isn't it odd to base policies on emotions alone? do they have other interests that they see israel threatening?

[ElansarGelmir]

this is what unscrupulous govts do... they make their policies for their interest and hope that the people will follow them. in this case, i think they succeeded... who are we to judge the jews when we haven't seen one (quote from someone who mentioned this before in RECOM... sorry if i've forgotten ur name, but i acknowledge ur idea)... and Malaysia keeps filtering the news about Palestine attack Israel, or put the attack in a better way which actually make Palestine less villain than what it actually is. Both Israel and Palestine have their conflicts to be solved. Y do we kepo? and even if we do, we have to make sure that we are not standing on either side of the fence... what happens to ZOPFAN?

[yekban81]

After 1967 war, Israel has seized West Bank, Golan Heights and Gaza Strips. In PBB, it's obvious that the world has voted to instruct Israel to "get off" from that place but just because of an objection from US by her veto power, the world decision becomes just a "voice in wane" until now. Where is the other four "veto holder"; Britain,China,Rusia and France? Why they didn't vote against US by their veto rights? Is it a fact that these great power (after WWII) use their veto power only when an issue involves their country?

[__earth]

Where is the other four "veto holder"; Britain,China,Rusia and France? Why they didn't vote against US by their veto rights? Is it a fact that these great power (after WWII) use their veto power only when an issue involves their country?

In the UN, the 5 powers have the veto to cancel a decision. One cannot veto to cancel another veto.

[debbie]

well, i think the govt is the culprit who instills the hatred towards jews among malaysians. in our BTN course, they ruled out that the Jews is one of Malaysia's biggest treat.

You heard him, ppl. At the BTN course , they ruled the Jews out as one of M'sia's BIGGEST TREAT . Haha.. finally, they acknowledge that. Too bad I'm not Jew, so you guys have to make do with a Hebrew, though not as an edible treat. :D

[ElansarGelmir]

anyway, today's Rosh Hoshanah, Jewish New Year... which means extra holiday for me! yay!!! L'Shona Tova!

[yekban81]

Askar Israel menyamar pejuang:
http://www.bharian.com.my/m/BHarian/Thursday/Dunia/20050127071914/Article/

I couldn't help but begin to hate Israel.

[sade]

i though the god rented the promised land to Jew, but jew have not paid the rental for 2000 years
this contract could be revoked

[Salvation]

Anyone read the book The International Jew by Henry Ford before?
I am abit perplexed,

[agape]

Anyone read the book The International Jew by Henry Ford before?
I am abit perplexed,[quote]

Nope.May I know what is this book all about?Sound interesting. :D
How about 'The Purpose Driven Life' by Rick Warren and 'Heaven is so Real!' by Choo Thomas? :P Read them before?

[Salvation]

haha..I have read The Purpose Driven Life for erm...i think 1 chapter :P
About the book "Haven is so real", many people claimed that it is occultic and fake, so I did not read it., although I know what the book is mainly about. :lol:

[agape]

What do you mean by many people claimed that the book is occultic and fake?Don't you think that it is better for you to read it and see if what they say is true? :D

Try to make an effort to read this particular book by Rick Warren.It tells us about the meaning of life and what is our purpose on this earth. :D

[debbie]

i though the god rented the promised land to Jew, but jew have not paid the rental for 2000 years
this contract could be revoked

I'm sorry . It was never on a rented basis. *grits teeth*

[inevitable]

israel is a race. thats all, why you hear muslim hate them? because of history. now, i dont think only the muslims hate them. not the entire israel ofcourse, only those who are killing the palestinians in their own motherland. israel there are acting out of any right except for them and do what ever they want and nobody's stopping them.
i have a few comments on some reply:
i 4got his name and are lazy to search back, says that jews, muslim and christian are related, thats true.
he also said that all are same god, now thats not true. if the god is same, then all will pray the same way. The holliest books are also not a duplicate, they are different. Bible and other books are incomplete, but Quran is the latest and are complete. Moses, Jesus(Isa), Abraham and Muhammad are prophets. Ofcourse they believe in same god. But not the one Christians and Jews believe in.

[jabir1909]

Who are the JEWS :

Jew is a nation which seemed to be so special (to their eyes), coz God had chosen most prophets out of their nation (logically because they are the worst, and they are the most needed to be preached again and again and again), thus in time they obtained many specialty from God over their demand (coz they never got enough), yet they can still kill some of the prophets 8O (that reflects who they really are), and they make their religion only for their kind (unacceptable at first glance) because of their so-called 'specialty'. This is the type of people everyone wants to hate and they deserve it, it’s a wrath of God onto them till the end of time.

ps : just ask the jews, in case they can still remember

[Salvation]

What do you mean by many people claimed that the book is occultic and fake?Don't you think that it is better for you to read it and see if what they say is true?
I am always careful of books of this nature, more offen then not, there are lots of controversy in it, if you are a Christian, the Bible is still the best. :lol: Other books are merely suplements to your faith.

Bible and other books are incomplete, but Quran is the latest and are complete.
Thats the funniest statement I have seen thus far in this forum. I hope this is a joke. :lol:

[kucingbiru]

he also said that all are same god, now thats not true. if the god is same, then all will pray the same way. The holliest books are also not a duplicate, they are different. Bible and other books are incomplete, but Quran is the latest and are complete. Moses, Jesus(Isa), Abraham and Muhammad are prophets.

hay man, be careful with what u're saying. u're talking about beliefs here. u need to respect others' belief as much as u want urs to be respected. and what u said was ur belief, u need to include somethig like "i believe that....". i'm a muslim and please dont spoil our image like that.

[theT]

from what I read here, most of the definition is kinda one sided and biased.

i have my own belief, it made me laugh to see people trying to fall othres in their beliefs.

i have no comment on jew. first I am not one, second, most of my close friend are at least jew by heritage, though they don't look or act like one.

What wwe choose to believe is personal, just respect everyone point of view

[Neutral_pH]

About the jews thing, I think there's no point in blaming them. Jews are a race just like the malays and chinese, and they are muslims and christians too. The fault lies in Zionist belief, not the jews. Zionists are responsible for all things happening in Israel, not the Jews. The jews are suffering as much as the palestinians themselves.

[inevitable]

okay i think i need to explain something here, some misunderstood me, I WAS JUST REPLY TO SHAPESHIFTER, he wrote that:

The only thing that Really separates a Muslim, Christian and Jews is who is who. Jesus etc,- As far as i'm concerned Christians, Jews and Muslims shares the same God and their Holliest books are almost a duplicate of each other. The same God Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad believed in is the same God Muslims, Christians and Jews believes in.

i was just correcting him, THAT IS ALL. im not giving a religion speech here. im just posting after i found somewrong statement, why do im the one who is being comdemn?
im not starting some religion or something ok. you want to accuse something, accuse him.

and yeah, my english not so good, you think its easy writing in a language you have long gone didnt use, now, learning a new language and suddenly have to use english back.

[inevitable]

sorry again, it was Thirdshifter notshape shifter, i was writing with anger a bit just now, can't concentrate, sorry