How true is it Regarding Cashflow Quadrant?

[ygod84]

You may have heard of Mr Robert Kiyosaki, the best selling author of ?Rich Dad, Poor Dad?, ?Cashflow Quadrant? and other popular titles. Robert has designed the Cashflow game which has caught the world by storm. The ?Cashflow Quadrant? book and game have changed many people?s mindset and consequently their lives.

The diagram on the right is what he called the Cashflow Quadrant.

Robert says we enjoy our incomes from one or more of these quadrants. 90% of us trade our time for money as in the ?E? quadrant. Some prefer to work for themselves as in the ?S? quadrant. Some make it to the ?B? quadrant with very few qualify themselves in the ?I? quadrant.

Today, many of us know the risks of remaining in the left side of the quadrant, the ?E? and ?S?. We cannot afford not to have a job to bring home money for our family. We must always have projects or businesses to work in order to pay ourselves for people in the ?S? quadrant. With more uncertainties looming ahead, many of us need another backup financial vehicle.

Congratulations to you if you are holding a high paying job and living a comfortable and happy lifestyle, happy at home and at the workplace. However, if you are stressed out at work and it has affected your family life, I sincerely encourage you to look at the right side of the quadrant, mainly the ?B? quadrant.

Late Billionaire Paul Getty said, ?I would rather earn 1% from the efforts of 100 people than 100% from the efforts of myself?.

Business owners are enjoying incomes from the efforts of other people. They can have a game of golf on every weekday or vacations that last for months and yet, they still have the financial resources to live life the way they wished. Isn?t this wonderful? You bet.

Which quadrant(s) are you currently getting your incomes from?

C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\1.gif
Robert recommends for people getting their incomes from 'E' or 'S' quadrants to use the Network Marketing financial vehicle to move to 'B' quadrant and upgrade to 'I' quadrant after accumulating enough wealth.
C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\2.gif

[ygod84]

There are three main types of business systems commonly in use today


1. Traditional businesses ? where you develop your own system.
In the current economic situation, traditional business owners are tightening their belts and more are getting out of it. High risks are attached to developing your own system through a series of trial and error. Furthermore, capital investment is considerably huge.

2. Franchises ? where you buy an existing system.
Master franchising systems have been accepted as a safer way of succeeding in the business system. Master franchisors have a system for franchisees to follow. In fact, the latter just need to behave like in the ?E? quadrant, following instructions. The first challenge for would be franchisee is the initial capital investment, usually from S$50 thousands onwards. This amount excludes the monthly operating expenditure expected from running a shop outlet. The next option is Network Marketing.

3. Network Marketing ? where you buy into and become part of an existing system.
It operates like franchises. However, instead of opening shop outlets to move products, it uses people, you and me, to recommend good products to others. We have become the walking advertising billboards and we are paid a royalty or commission based on a percentage of the sales. Through this way of distribution, we have removed the middlemen like national distributor, regional distributors, local wholesalers, local distributors, retailing outlets and cut down on advertising. The manufacturers? objectives of moving their products to consumers are achieved with better results. The word of mouth advertisement is by far the best way and we have been using it as part of our daily lives. We recommend our friends to sample good food, buy at good value stores, watch a great movie, consult a good physician and so on. This healthy culture will continue.

Network Marketing - The New Global Wave

Network Marketing is fast gaining popularity globally due to high-end results enjoyed by manufacturers employing this way of distribution. It has registered a high annual global turnover of US$84 billion in 1999. This amount constituted a mere 1% of the total global retail sales, which has turned many renowned MNCs like AT & T, Colgate, Campbell Soup, Motorola, Ford and many others to set up subsidiary companies adopting this new way of product distribution.

The huge success of Network Marketing in the US and Asia has seen our Singapore government opening up this new way of marketing in June 2000. It was featured in the NUSS (National University of Singapore Society), The Graduate magazine, Aug 2001 issue, which termed it as ?Wave of the Future - Network Marketing?.

Many public figures have endorsed Network Marketing, including former US President Bill Clinton who said, ?The industry gives people a chance, to make the most out of their lives and to me, it is the heart of the American dream.? Today, many Singaporeans are using Network Marketing to realise their dreams!

In Asia, current Vice-Premier of Taiwan, Ms Annette Lu has encouraged Taiwanese network marketers to lift the image and professionalism of this important industry to help the economy and in turn, contribute towards society.

Renowned Harvard doctorate graduate, Prof Charles King from the University of Illinois at Chicago, has involved in extensive, ongoing research on Network Marketing and distributor operations and has written his findings and recommendations in his book, titled ?The New Professional?. The book is hailed as ?the best, most authoritative, and up-to-date source of information on the industry?, commented by Mr Richard Poe, renowned author of SUCCESS magazine and WAVE 3,WAVE 4 books on the same industry.
<IMG SRC ="C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\3.gif" ALT="Bill Clinton">

Former
US President Bill Clinton
commented," Network Marketing gives everyone a chance to make the most of our lives."


<IMG SRC ="C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\4.jpg" ALT="Graduate magazine">


NUSS August 2001 Issue

The Graduate magazine, Aug 2001 issue,
which termed it as ?Wave of the Future - Network Marketing?.

[ygod84]

What Mr Robert Kiyosaki says about Network Marketing

Mr Robert Kiyosaki has also written a book dedicated to the industry called ?The Business School?. He encourages people to consider Network Marketing as a financial vehicle to upgrade to the ?B? quadrant.

I like to share Robert?s views on Network Marketing.


?And that?s why today I recommend people consider network marketing. Many famous franchises cost a million dollars or more to buy. Network marketing is like buying a personal franchise, often for less than US$200.

I know much of network marketing is hard work. But success in any quadrant is hard work?

Yet, if I could give you a recommendation as to finding a good organisation to help you get over to the right side of the Quadrant, the key is not so much the product but the education the organisation offers. There are network marketing organisations that are only interested in having you sell their system to your friends. And there are organisations primarily interested in educating you and helping you succeed.?


We agree wholeheartedly with Robert, every success carries a price and is paid upfront. We worked hard with a team of like-minded achievers when we were introduced to Network Marketing. Today, we have a successful system of good education to mould our business partners into better persons and at the same time, enjoying good financial incomes.


<IMG SRC ="C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\5.jpg" ALT="Mr Robert Kiyosaki">


Mr Robert Kiyosaki
Best Selling Author


<IMG SRC ="C:\Documents and Settings\sin ong\Desktop\Nstream\6.jpg" ALT="Network Marketing ">


This book shares the
eight wonderful values
that Network Marketing offers.

[ygod84]

I am a student from MMU. i have read the book by Mr Robert Kiyosaki. I found that his ideas about this network marketing is quite true. So, recentlly i joint a MLM( MultiLevel Marketing) company. Like Mr Robert Kiyosaki said : we can buy a personal franchise for less than US$200."

i joint the company for 75USD(about RM287.85). out of 75USD, 25 USD is airtime.
In the same time, i am looking for team mates. Now i am staying in Cyberjaya.
i and my friends have done some research before we join this company. We do think that it is a realiable company. we have a a very peak timetable in MMU. but we still have some free time to learn business part time. We also think that the money is worth to gain knowledge and learn how the network marketing is being running . We also can attend free seminars which are worth more than RM 100 each. It teaches us many skills.

The company name is :N-stream.
- it is a malaysia's company
- it is a new company and will be launched by our Prime Miniter abdullah batawi coming april
- the chairman of the company is brother in law of Prime Miniter abdullah batawi ( refer to the link below)
- the business just started 6 months ago.( it is worth to join now as it is still new)
- it is not a direct sale company (it provides services and system)
- it didn't use piramid plan which is againt law(it uses hybrid plan)
- it promises money back gurrentee within 14 days.( i experienced it personally, i opened 2 accounts and closed one of them and i got the money already :D )
- Some of the rates are cheapest compare with REDTONEs, IDD, NasionCom, i-connect and etc... (the rates will be provided upon request)


You can go to the webpage
www.nstreami.com[/list]

Those who are interested to be my business partner. Feel free to contact me, i will explain more about it. Even if you are not interested to become my business partner but you want to gain more knowledge about MLM, feel free to e-mail me also, we can be friend to exchange knowledge with each other.

my e-mail: ygod84@<hidden>

Thanks.

[chenchow]

I would say that this forum would be a great place to share and learn experience on learning aspect. I would say that as ReCom does not allow any ad or anything in that respect, this would be more towards sharing and learning and even perhaps getting some potential business partners or working/networking together~!

Perhaps some of the ReComers could share the differences between Hybrid Plan vs Pyramid Plan?

[yekban81]

I got a shocking revelation from my internet browsing activity. Rich Dad in Robert Kiyosaki's Rich Dad Poor Dad (RDPD) is very likely a fake. I did a rough reading over some articles. They made me realise of my ignorance. I may have been caught under the cult of personality attack by RDPD since I am not an active reader; too naive about financial world.

Below is part of a review by Mathew Emmert on RDPD:

"Rich Dad" Just a Fad
The real estate focused Rich Dad, Poor Dad, authored by Robert Kiyosaki, is a best-selling book that claims to provide the road to real riches. But taking a closer look reveals there just isn't much under the hood in this popular book series.
By Mathew Emmert (TMF Gambit)
July 14, 2003

Over the past several weeks I've written two real estate-related articles, REITallocate Your Portfolio and REITs With A Twist. Since then, I've received a number of emails from readers asking my opinion on the guide to getting rich in the real estate market titled Rich Dad, Poor Dad.

The quick answer to this question is that my opinion of this book, and those books that followed it, is not terribly favorable. Now, as I'm not a book critic, my opinion in and of itself may not interest you. But based on the frequency and popularity of this topic and this question, I think it's important to devote a little more cyber ink to explaining why I feel this way.

I first learned of this book about two years ago, and upon review, quickly dismissed it as a good deal of hype without a lot of substance. But to my surprise, about a year ago, friends began recommending the book to me and its popularity grew. This was unsettling because I considered much of the book not just to be inaccurate, but worse, I thought it could potentially cause financial harm.

Song and dance
Kiyosaki's material is almost completely devoid of specific financial advice. Further, his material on making money in real estate appears to be little more than repackaged hype from the "no money down" real estate hucksters of the late '80s (you know, the Carlton Sheets of the world).

That's why, this past February, it was so refreshing to read Eleanor Laise's article titled "Karma Chameleon" in SmartMoney Magazine. This piece is largely an expose on the shortcomings of Kiyosaki and his books. However, her article goes way beyond opinion, using solid investigative work to highlight a great many inconsistencies in Kiyosaki's story. Laise's article details a great many reasons why anything that Kiyosaki says should be highly scrutinized.

If you're not particularly familiar with the basis for Kiyosaki's book, consider this from the SmartMoney article:

At the heart of the Rich Dad phenomenon is an intriguing premise: Growing up in Hawaii, Kiyosaki says he learned the wrong way to manage money from his 'Poor Dad,' his own highly educated but financially hapless father, and the right way from his adopted 'Rich Dad,' a friend's entrepreneurial father who dropped out of school in the eighth grade and became one of the wealthiest men in Hawaii.

As Laise points out, "it's a nice gimmick," but unfortunately it turns out to be false. When pressed about the details of his "Rich Dad" by Laise, Kiyosaki finally says, "Is Harry Potter real? Why don't you let Rich Dad be a myth, like Harry Potter?" Hmmm.

Now, I realize this idea has a certain media appeal, but one needs to realize that's all it is: media (in other words: made up). And when you get beyond the cuteness of the story, you'll find the books a bit light on fundamentals.

His message leads many to believe real estate somehow takes less homework than other investments, a premise I would strongly disagree with. Real estate can be a great investment; so can stocks, bonds, and REITs. But it takes just as much knowledge and research to be a successful investor in this sector as it does in any other.

There are no free rides. And any strategy that doesn't share that little tidbit is more marketing than content. Despite their claims, buying a foreclosure for pennies on the dollar and selling it "days later" for huge profits is a rare occurrence. And your chance of being able to do so with "no real estate experience" is miniscule at best, and impossible at worst.

Lessons learned
My father used to tell me that I could trust someone who claimed they were not an expert but offered what knowledge they had, much more than I could trust someone that claimed to be an expert but never shared how they achieved their success. I suppose that's simply another way of saying that humility is a good thing, particularly when possessed by someone who also has a great deal of knowledge.

The truth is that Kiyosaki, and those like him, can make far more money selling you their "proven methods" than they ever could employing those methods themselves. The only available evidence leads one to believe that Kiyosaki has amassed whatever wealth he has by selling his methods, as opposed to employing them.

Now, these gentlemen trying to cash in on their "no money down" schemes would likely say that I'm just a bitter man, envious that I didn't develop their "proven methods." But before the Rich Dad fans start zipping out hate mail stating that I'm just jealous of what Kiyosaki and his like have accomplished, let me say that I begrudge no one their success. In fact, I wish nothing but success for all those who genuinely attempt to help others improve their financial well-being (after all, that's the reason The Motley Fool exists). I only ask that those who choose this noble pursuit do this with honesty and integrity, and fully disclose information that may be material to their potential customers and all those who may employ their advice.

This brings us to the No. 1 rule for successfully avoiding financial hucksters: If someone truly has the means to get rich quickly, they aren't going to tell you about it.

If you truly want to learn from the behavior of "the rich," you'd be a great deal better off reading The Millionaire Mind, sequel to The Millionaire Next Door.

Fool On!

Mathew Emmert is currently working on the Making Money Is Extremely Hard Work Package, but he doesn't expect it to sell very well. He doesn't own any of the companies mentioned in this article. The Motley Fool is investors writing for investors.

The website for this original source: http://www.fool.com/news/pls commentary/2003/commentary030714me.htm

A Malaysian website on RDPD: http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopic=113489&st=0

A detailed analysis on RDPD by John Treed: http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html

i joint the company for 75USD(about RM287.85). out of 75USD, 25 USD is airtime.

You don't need to know much about buzzwords like "network marketing". Any decently smart kid will tell you that if you pay $75 for $25 of services, you're losing $50. It's as simple as that.

I didn't understand why so many people can be fooled into such a scheme until I read that some findings that human greed can make us do virtually anything.

[ygod84]

i knew i will get feedback like that... I think i need to clarify something. "You will never know how to use computer unless you really spent time on it" Am i right? i just join it for part time. main purpose: to gain knowledge. i am not that kind of crazy person who will sacrifice my study, my life for MLM. i was strictly againts MLM a few years ago. But after my friend introduced me this company. It is the first time i believe ( a bit). i am not someone who trust "fast earning", so i didn't fully believe it, i am looking forward to learn how this company is actually growing from nothing. It was just setup a few months ago. So, it is the best chance for me to learn about a company.

For prince:
you are GOOD in math. but i think i will use USD50 to buy experience and knowledge. They provides seminars and trainings. If you want to find this kind of seminar outside, it will cost you a fortune. USD50 for all these things, is it worth? I don't know about other people but It is worth for me as it might help me in future, who knows? I look for business partner that would work hard to gain knowledge and learn about business, main purpose is not earn money. Anyway i think i am still young to earn MONEY as i still need to earn KNOWLEDGE.

For chenchow:
Your idea is good. Can anyone compare the differences between Hybrid Plan vs Pyramid Plan? Me, myself also not very understand about it. Anyone who has the knowledge welcome to discuss here. Thanks!

[chenchow]

I would look at this issue from both perspectives. First, there is no free profit, i.e. if one is to join some kind of get-rich scheme, there is always some tricks behind. Those companies need to stay profitable to survive, and that profit needs to come somewhere.

However, I would say that I am happy that ygod84 is going out of his way to to learn more. I would say that to be frank, beyond whatever you need to pay, networking is essential. While some of those may cost money, build up your networks, through your friends and those people you know. Attend conferences etc too. Read up as much on all relevant issues, be it domestically or internationally.

[__earth]

let's not cut and paste such a long material. Read the forum etiquette.

[pandaboy]

Have you guys came across this:

http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html

For prince:
you are GOOD in math. but i think i will use USD50 to buy experience and knowledge. They provides seminars and trainings. If you want to find this kind of seminar outside, it will cost you a fortune. USD50 for all these things, is it worth? I don't know about other people but It is worth for me as it might help me in future, who knows? I look for business partner that would work hard to gain knowledge and learn about business, main purpose is not earn money. Anyway i think i am still young to earn MONEY as i still need to earn KNOWLEDGE.


You have a point, but it's very important to learn the right knowledge and not be fooled by the many bogus sources of information out there. Many people can claim to be gurus of making money, but why would the real wise gurus go out there to promote themselves (these people, like Kiyosaki, are sure gurus of marketing)? If you are looking to learn something about managing wealth and have $50 to spare, get the book "The Intelligent Investor" by Graham and you'll have spare change too (since the book cost less than that).

[DecentMerson]

hi there...to put it aptly, I don't buy it.
ygod84 sorry to discourage u, but this is why...

after having read through the posts and visiting the links...i still think this hybrid plan has not much differences from a pyramid plan...(i don't really see much major differences)

http://202.9.101.195/nstreamweb/NSI_System.asp

only that it doesn't require u to get new members... but most people will do search for business partners... and hence... the end result is much of the same...

however, if you do value those seminars and experiences are worth much more than $50... then, go for it... but, just to let others know... those seminars doesn't cost them much...

came across other form of "pyramid scheme".... the prepaid card scheme... i bet most college students in Subang area (Taylor, Inti, Metropolitan and Sunway College) know about this... well, it is a pyramid scheme... but for the fees you pay, you do get back the equal face value of the prepaid card in the end... and if u are able to recruit members, u can even earn some $$$ too... but, too bad.. they give u about RM 200 of prepaid card per month (if i remember correctly)... so, u have to use it, or sell it... in the end... the phone company and the pyramid heads are the one who earn the cash...

becoz, someone have to use the prepaid cards... no matter what, the ppl who started the pyramid scheme will have all the cash... and i think the phone companies are more than happy to sell their prepaid card cheaply (actually, they are selling it cheaply to the agents)....they want more people to sign up for their service...
since the fixed cost of providing the service is high, while the variable cost for another additional user is virtually non-existent...

sorry for my words diarrhea...

and one more thing...

it sounds a bit like how an insurance company functions... (instead of selling insurance, NSI is just selling other kind of services and goods) and just to let u know.. u can get pretty cheap training (&seminars)... maybe even paid training from insurance company...

[ygod84]

dear DecentMerson,
u looked like u have much experience in MLM, can u tell me more about it? sorry to say, i have put USD50 into it.. now i cannot withdraw my moe\ney already. so, i have to do sontinue wat i planed earlier... Any MLM guru, senior here? can give me more information? may be can compare between Amway screen Lam Berger and etc.... thanks...

dear price,

i will try to get the book :The Intelligent Investor, by Graham . Thanks...

where u guys from anyway? and how old? just want to know if it is convenience to u all... thanks..

[DecentMerson]

sorry... i dun have much experience, if any, in MLM... just that last time around, my friend did ask me to join... so, i did some research and read about it...

well, i'm from Subang Jaya, and i'm 2 months short of being 20 years old...

darn... not a teen anymore....but 14 months more to go, in order to drink legally in the States...

still wondering why Malaysia has a younger drinking age than US... sad... :)

[Maxforce]

i joint the company for 75USD(about RM287.85). out of 75USD, 25 USD is airtime.

You don't need to know much about buzzwords like "network marketing". Any decently smart kid will tell you that if you pay $75 for $25 of services, you're losing $50. It's as simple as that.

I didn't understand why so many people can be fooled into such a scheme until I read that some findings that human greed can make us do virtually anything.

Fear and greed - the greatest marketing ploy!!!

[luke]

Have you guys came across this:

http://www.johntreed.com/Kiyosaki.html
Reading the analysis taught me not to believe even bestseller fancy financial strategy books

but again, reading this website: http://www.sowpub.com/cgi-bin/forum/webbbs_config.pl/read/24459 taught me not to believe a book author attacking a book from another author ...

but again, that website might also be all bullsh1t ...

I recalled my family doctor recommending me to read the "rich dad, poor dad" book ... I didn't ... I think I won't ...

and just yesterday a friend of mine told me about this scheme that gives you money by installing a software that surfs the internet for you ... he had to pay $100 to start though ...

so, in the end, who should I (or we) believe? the world is full of lies ... eventhough "the truth is out there", it is hard to find it ...

- a word of wisdom from a nobody ...

[Maxforce]

Well basically I think anything that requires money upfront is probably a scam!

[weich]

Well i think one can be successful in network marketing but has to be really aggressive about it and you must not doubt the product you're selling. You have to convince other ppl what they are doing is right and from there build your 'downline' but these network marketing schemes are mostly like huge ponzi schemes. First, they give money to a few ppl i.e. the most charismatic and enthusiastic ones (the so called capable ones - probably spotted during the seminars/conferences conducted) who will have more faith in the product and they'll sell even more and be even more enthusiastic in promoting the product. You'll earn 'big bucks' initially but in the end, say when the company collapses, the money stops coming in and you the 'capable' one will be the person ppl (your downline) will blame. It's like a viscious cycle. Best thing is to stay away from it.

As for Kiyosaki's book, the only useful thing i got out of it was about selling your property and within the same year buy another one to avoid tax or something like that. Sounds logical but not sure if it applies to the Malaysian tax system. Anyone can clarify this?

[Maxforce]

Ex auditor here.
Clarification on Msian tax system: Nahhh doesnt apply at all!!!!
The only exemption you will get is on residential property ONCE in a lifetime when you sell. Oh yeah, husband and wife, only one person can claim this exemption, so if you wanna sell property, sell before you marry!!!
UK laws how?
btw I have been shopping around and unable to find anything that I could buy then rent out higher than the instalment paid. Anyone successful in this task or have I been fooled by Kiyosaki yet again? :(

[MelaOS]

Yea, seriously there's a lot of MLM out there, and i would love to hear opinions on some of the good ones, i.e. provide good training, great system, etc. Anyone care to add a list of good MLM or other money making system?

And MLM does kinda work towards your benefit in one way, i see the difference in my friend who has been brainwashed, lol, does seems to have mature in his mindset and thinking regarding money and stuff.

On the rich dad thing, i was kind of suprised to see that Rich Dad was a hoax since i've read a good few of his books and was starting to believe a lot of what he was saying. But instead of feeling cheated and stuff, i'm kind of glad. Because regardless whether he was a fake or not, at least he provided us some food for thoughts regarding money and how to better take care of our future. Just don't take what's he saying literally, that's all.

Finally to the question why the drinking age is lower in our coutry, well since 70%++ of the population are malays, we don't have much market here for booze do we? So what's the solution they've came up with? LOL.

Like i said, just my 2cents, feel free to rant about it.
"Law 27 - PLAY ON PEOPLE'S NEED TO BELIEVE TO CREATE A CULT LIKE FOLLOWING"

[Maxforce]

Kiyosaki's books well though it is a well thought marketing ploy, I do not consider them a scam actually. It is very basic in the sense that it is something that once you started working, many will tell you the so-called wisdom in his book.
His opinion about house being a liability unless you managed a net positive cashflow is intriguing, but a marketing ploy no less, as he himself also agree that we should buy house for our own accomodation and pleasure/pride. So basically the opinion itself, is useless.

[ck]

Scam or not, I am not sure. But I do like his concept though... and that goes forth on any marketing scheme.

As mentioned by the rest of the members, MLM do provide a good training - specifically in motivation. You go to their seminars and you would be brainwash. Why? Because we are seing a lot of successfully businessman, driving nice car and giving talk.

At the end of their talk, you would be wondering "If they can do it, why not me?". I went for those MLM basically to look at how they motivate the fellow members. You could learn a trick or two from them.

I learn a good networking scheme which I think many are familar with it:
a) Join membership for RMXX amount.
b) Every member you recruit, you get 10% from RM XX amount.
c) If you are uncomfortable with the scheme, you can withdraw from the membership. And we will reimburse you with 80% of your membership.

Sound familar? Just replace those XX amount with a figure and you would see how network marketing earns money.

Maybe RECOM can start one perhaps? :lol:

[Maxforce]

yo Lam, fancy seeing you here!
I think it is worth underlining that there are different type of salesman that may succeed in different areas. Sure, we may be challenged to think, if he can why cant i? The only thing is this, you will have to follow their way and system of doing things.
E.g. A Supersalesman selling fruits would not be very good in selling ICT solutions, and that goes vice versa.
It may look simple, but really it is not that simple. I guess, it is worth a try finding out, besides the membership is not that expensive.