SPM English 1119

[y_benjie]

Hi guys!

I m going to take SPM this year, but I was quite uncertain about the 1119 paper. Could anyone of you please provide me with more info on:-

1) Paper 1 : As we know, it consists of 2 parts, which is directed writing and continuos writing. I was told that 1119 paper are mainly based on your continuos writing, and one need to write preferably, stories like narrative,descriptive to gain more points which would earn him a better chance to get an A1. How true is that?

2) Normally, how high is the mark to get an A1? I understand it depends on the standard on that particular year, but normaly it ranges from ? - ?

3) Some friends of mine told me if I write facts, argumentative, discussion, you will have to be VERY VERY OUTSTANDING, to get an A1. Is that true?

Thanks!

[youngyew]

Hi guys!

I m going to take SPM this year, but I was quite uncertain about the 1119 paper. Could anyone of you please provide me with more info on:-

1) Paper 1 : As we know, it consists of 2 parts, which is directed writing and continuos writing. I was told that 1119 paper are mainly based on your continuos writing, and one need to write preferably, stories like narrative,descriptive to gain more points which would earn him a better chance to get an A1. How true is that?

2) Normally, how high is the mark to get an A1? I understand it depends on the standard on that particular year, but normaly it ranges from ? - ?

3) Some friends of mine told me if I write facts, argumentative, discussion, you will have to be VERY VERY OUTSTANDING, to get an A1. Is that true?

Thanks!
I don't know much into the depth of marking scheme in 1119, but here is what I can tell:

1. Basically there is no set threshold score for A1 in 1119 paper, the marking is purely based on impression, not on grammar, points, contents etc.

2. Stories and narrative writings have historically been preferable for scoring A1... I think this is mainly because of its originality and authenticity. When you write narrative piece, it tends to be more creative and interesting, so it in turn would better impress the examiner. Whereas for argumentative or factual writing, it's more or less the same thing for everyone, so you have to be really outstanding to score an A1.

3. Very Very outstanding.... hmm.. I am not sure how outstanding you have to be. Just take the level of english in ReCom as an example. I think the majority of people who post here would obtain A1 with their command of english language. (For the record, I got A2 with an argumentative piece)

4. Don't follow all tips and trends blindly; instead, follow yourself - do what you do the best. If you can't write story (like me), there's no point forcing yourself to write one. It just wouldn't work.

Hope that helps.

[chenchow]

I agree with youngyew regarding the matter. Write on the type of essays that you know you would write best. I, personally wrote argumentative as well, as that's what I am writing much better in, if in comparison with writing stories.

So, it would depend on you. On writing argumentative essays, include some convincing points, as well as with concrete arguments and examples. Those will set you apart.

[gohweihan]

On factual (or argumentative) essays, it's not actually all about convincing points, solid arguments and concrete examples. You may give the most convincing point in the world, the best arguments that are unrefutable, and the most solid and clear examples, but if that all don't come into a nicely packaged essay, it wouldn't work.

It is possible to end up scoring with an essay without any one of the components. What is needed is actually analysis of the topic, and a piece of work that is directed towards the analysis. Basically it's about asking questions - the five Ws' and one H, and writing based on that to create a package of which makes an impact in the end.

I've written factual essays without examples or arguments - just points based on analysis, and it turned out well in the eyes of the people who marked them.

But for 1119, I wrote a combination of a story and factual analysis. It was a story based on World War II in the eyes of a soldier and the analysis was in the form of the ideas about World War II in the eyes of the people at that time.

[youngyew]

I've written factual essays without examples or arguments - just points based on analysis, and it turned out well in the eyes of the people who marked them.

But for 1119, I wrote a combination of a story and factual analysis. It was a story based on World War II in the eyes of a soldier and the analysis was in the form of the ideas about World War II in the eyes of the people at that time.
It's interesting but I can't make out the picture of a factual essay with only analysis and no examples. Can you give me a brief description of your essay?

By the way, I am impressed by what you wrote in the 1119. It's cool, telling WWII from the eyes of a soldier? It looks like a novel to me! :wink:

[gohweihan]

I've written factual essays without examples or arguments - just points based on analysis, and it turned out well in the eyes of the people who marked them.

But for 1119, I wrote a combination of a story and factual analysis. It was a story based on World War II in the eyes of a soldier and the analysis was in the form of the ideas about World War II in the eyes of the people at that time.
It's interesting but I can't make out the picture of a factual essay with only analysis and no examples. Can you give me a brief description of your essay?

By the way, I am impressed by what you wrote in the 1119. It's cool, telling WWII from the eyes of a soldier? It looks like a novel to me! :wink:

Examples, in my point of view, are concrete, readily available, already happened situations that can be used to back-up an analysis, something like this:

"Man is capable of space travel. With the landing on the moon in 1969, it is proven that indeed if NASA were to focus more on space exploration, a base in Mars is possible within the middle of the century."

The statement "landing on the moon in 1969" would therefore be the example in the piece. If I were to write something without an example, it would be something like this:

"Universities today are conducting lessons in a way that focuses on acquisition of knowledge. However, employers today look not only on the knowledge of the graduate, but on human capital as a whole (which is more than knowledge)."

This paragraph has no examples (or at least in my definition of examples). It has analysis of the situation - i.e. what universities are doing, and what employers want. To create more impact, I would probably contextualize the thing to a nation, say Malaysia or Singapore.

And that WWII piece I wrote for 1119 wasn't what I wanted to write actually, but I decided to after my teacher recommended that I do not go ahead with my original idea.

That one would be about a man who runs a joint venture in a company providing international security management, and found out that his partner backstabbed him, so he killed his partner and ran to Cairo.

[vseehua]

for the matter, i also prefered argumentative essays...but it is only for those who are informed with updates info about the world, even if its quite remote. The infos must b accurate, if you don't remember the date, jus give a time frame...you'll never know if the person who is marking your paper know what are your writing about..

and as chenchow's remark, go and do the type of essay that you have the most confidence in...don't worry about what others' are writing, worry about what you can do best, and all will be fine:)

[Anduril]

Well, I always write argumentative or factual essays, regardless in what languages. Not that I am good at that, but I can be really boring and long-winded with stories. So, every time I took my paper, those story topics were shut away straight. (kind of dangerous, eh?)

I don't know. I think to write argumentative or factual essays, one needs to be clear and precise. Just keep it simple and nice. That's my strategy. It works wonderfully (to my utmost surprise, of course).

[HappyCat]

for 1119 paper, my English language teacher had told us that we must very good in vocabulary and never make mistake for grammer, then we can score well in 1119 paper. :wink:

[youngyew]

for 1119 paper, my English language teacher had told us that we must very good in vocabulary and never make mistake for grammer, then we can score well in 1119 paper. :wink:
In my opinion, although good vocabulary is undeniably an important way of giving good impression, it is not a neccessity. I have friends who write superb argumentative pieces and stories, but they write it with normal range of vocabulary, not out-of-world bombastic words.

[vseehua]

well, i would say, jus use the vocabs that you are really sure of the meaning, if you are not sure, don't ever use it, cz instead of impressing the marker, you'll end up losing marks, curtesy of using the wrong words...:)...perhaps simplicity is the way to go...cz many bestsellers out there are simple to read:)

[joebf86]

regarding the marks for 1119, i was told by my teacher, who marks SPM papers and often called for meetings by jabatan, they do not remark ur paper and give another grade.

she said that they use ur overall english marks and compare with the cut-off points for 1119, which is absolutely higher in terms of standard.

eg: someone gets overall marks 65.
he/she might secure an A under Bahasa Inggeris but ends up with a C under 1119...

that's what i was told.

correct me if i m wrong.

[youngyew]

regarding the marks for 1119, i was told by my teacher, who marks SPM papers and often called for meetings by jabatan, they do not remark ur paper and give another grade.

she said that they use ur overall english marks and compare with the cut-off points for 1119, which is absolutely higher in terms of standard.

eg: someone gets overall marks 65.
he/she might secure an A under Bahasa Inggeris but ends up with a C under 1119...

that's what i was told.

correct me if i m wrong.
Really? If so, what explains that people who get A1 in SPM marking can get such a differnet range of grades in 1119? It can be anywhere between A1 to C5.

[joebf86]

that's the point

obviously the cut off marks for A1 for Bahasa Inggeris is pretty low.

anybody who gets A1 for 1119 sure gets A1 for Bahasa Inggeris but i saw these combinations before .....(A1:C5), (A2:B3) and (C5:D9)

isnt that proves that scoring an A1 for ur SPM under Bahasa Inggeris is no big deal?... provided u hav an average command of that language.

[youngyew]

I agree with the low cutting point that you meantioned.

However, I heard that the papers are remarked by a different group of people.

[gohweihan]

I agree with the low cutting point that you meantioned.

However, I heard that the papers are remarked by a different group of people.

1119 is based only on the essay written. Therefore, you may have perfect score for paper one that pulls the grade up, but if the essay is a terrible piece of work, then it's bye-bye A1 for 1119.

[vseehua]

whoever's marking your paper's not of concern here...jus concentrate on your performance during the exam and all will be fine:)

[flyinghigh]

after i've got my spm results i wonder how is the marking scheme of this paper... :?:
with my poor eng, i, unbelievably, got an A1 for 1119! that's wht i felt impossible at tht time! :o
i wrote a story in my exam. my eng teaher didn't encourage us to write factual essays coz it would be quite hard to get good marks!

[bush]

this so called GCE O, 1119 is nothing to shout about. The grade shown in the result slip is just ur grading for section C of paper 2(continuous writing), If u have written well, u can A1 or A2.......simple as that.

[deaf-knee]

anyone care to explain why some schools treat GCE O Levels as an additional subject?

If so I would have 11A1s!

However I only have 10 lah.

[bush]

anyone care to explain why some schools treat GCE O Levels as an additional subject?

If so I would have 11A1s!

However I only have 10 lah.

Its not an additional subject, its not even recognised as a GCE O level paper.

[byzhanii_bogn]

ya lor... can'teven understand why some papers treated itas an extra subject...

[bp_ffei]

What I've heard (forgot from where) is that they take some of the candidate's essay papers randomly and send them to be marked at Cambridge or something. There they'll rate essays that deserves an A1 all the way down to F9. They are then sent back to Malaysia and all other papers are marked based on this sample.

Come to think of it now, it sounds preposterous. I bet it was a rumour.

Anyway, I wrote a story and got A1 for 1119. Basically something to do with war and the location was set in Yemen. Haha...

[zchen]

i cannot say im an english expert.but it doesn't really matter what essay u write.like mentioned above,its the impression u set on the examinor,regardless of your tenses or grammer<thank god for that>.i had 1a for 1119,and my advice is that you offer something different from the other,usual normal packages that students write.using quotations from past people,or just a catchy phrase from a computer game will help...so long its inspiring<at least you felt so>.somtimes newpapers headlines can also work the magic,as long as you can stuff it inside.retain the flow of the essay to avoid a choppy one as it shows your writing flair.
for spm 2004,i wrote a factual essay<i dont usually write stories>..forgot what it is though.

p/s :heck if im so great i would hv won something in writing :oops:

[kimmyjay]

Hey, does that mean that the GCE O levels English paper, those British council people are just marking based on your section B essay which is the continuous writing?
I screwed up my directed writing. Spent too much time on my section B :(

[henry_yew]

Well, I don't know how the format is like now, but yeah, generally they use the essay section to grade your GCE "O" Levels English.

For me personally, the SPM English grade does not give you a good indication of where your standard of English really lies. The GCE "O" Levels grading is a better indicator. It is possible for one to score A+ in SPM English, only to get a B+ or a C for GCE "O" Levels English.

So, we can really question where the standards of SPM English really is, and what is the point of having two systems of grading. Say if you get an A+ for SPM English but a C for GCE "O" Levels English, wouldn't you agree with me that proclaiming that you have an excellent standard of English based on the A+ you obtained is just self-denial, but acceptance of the GCE "O" Levels grading would mean that the grading standard for English by the Malaysian Examination Syndicate is just appalling?

I would be more understanding if the difference between the grading is just by one grade, i.e. grade A for SPM English and A- for GCE "O" Levels, but the scenario where students score A+ for SPM English but C for the GCE "O" Levels does, in fact, happen. Just take a quick peek at some of your friends' exam results.

[Xon]

Hey, does that mean that the GCE O levels English paper, those British council people are just marking based on your section B essay which is the continuous writing?
I screwed up my directed writing. Spent too much time on my section B :(

In my year (SPM 2007), yea, it is only based on Continuous Writing. I would rationally presume the same over the years. I would suggest you look forward okay? Goodluck!

[kaiyi]

My tuition teacher told us that the grade of 1119 is based on writing paper(meaning section A and B) and is marked by Malaysians.

[Alexis Ma]

Kaiyi, henry_yew and Xon are all correct, as far as I know. I'l go one step further and say that the MUET and to a further extent, the IELTS are both better indicators of an individual's proficiency in English.

Those with English as their mother tongue and read substantially should, IMHO, attempt the MUET or IELTS in Form 4 or 5. If they can be satisfied with a good but not perfect grade, that is.

(Edit: Note that the IELTS does cost RM570 and is valid for only 2 years, and is useful only in foreign countries or some local private institutions such as Monash. Thanks for the reminder, henry_yew)

[henry_yew]

But don't bother taking IELTS if you have no plans to study abroad. The examination fee is quite high (about RM570 per examination) and it is only valid for two years. If you are going to study in a local public or private university, the MUET which a lot of you, who are in Form 6, will take is sufficient to meet the English language requirement.

Of course, the moment you cross the borders and say that you want to study abroad, e.g. Singapore, UK, USA, Australia, Canada, etc. then you have no choice but to take the IELTS/TOEFL.

[krezephie]

guys, its hard to get an A+ in english if ur gceo is B or below. i heard gceo is based on the band. if u get 44-50,u get A1, 38 - 43 A2. So if u get B3, it means maximum 37. let say 37+33+73= 143. still not enough to get A+. if 144 over 160 then only can get A+. unless graph for A+ turun. but i think last year it didnt turun.

sorry if i am wrong...

[henry_yew]

Let's not be too hard and fast about the marks to get A+, A, or A-. There are so many speculations on how the grading is that not many people care so much anymore.

The most important thing is that if you want to know where you truly stand, then give it your very best.

[Dominic]

The graph did go down last year. It seems easier to get 1A in 1119 nowadays.

[krezephie]

really? u mean only for 1119 of for english oso? because last year my school non of them got A+ for english or A1 for 1119. but there were a few who were targeted to get A+ but one of them got.... i think the graph didnt go down very low. but if it did also maybe around 87 or 88 they give A+ and for gceo im not sure.....correct me if im wrong...:)):):))one question - do they penalize our mark if we did many spelling mistake... i think i did bcos i didnt hv enough time so i wrote as fast as i could for 5 pages, i think the story i wrote was quite interesting but my language was not that good too, i didnt use many vocabs but i think the tone was ok... haiz...hope that i could get an A+.

[Dominic]

Very few people in my school got A+ for English during trials last year but when the real SPM results came out, so many of them got it (and 1A in 1119 as well), even those whose language are not proficient. So don't worry. The examiners are pretty lenient. Either that, or the graph was low.

Haha, I used to write really fast too until the time's up, and I won't have time to check it over. :-P You don't really have to use much bombastic words or idioms (I didn't). All that matters is that the flow of the story is there and it attracts examiner's attention.

[krezephie]

thanks dominic...