GDP, statistics

[masterof_none]

I;m working on some statistic figures about Malaysia to estimate the probabilty of Malaysia can become develop nation by the year 2020.
so far, what I know is only :

year to 2020 : about 16 1/2 year

I need current Malaysia GDP per capita, how much is the GDP percapita of the develop nations (US,Canada , Japan, etc) and what's the difference between our GDP and their GDPs.
and then hopefully it would help us have a clear idea what should we do for the next 16 1/2 year, project the yearly goal of GDP etc.

I can simply do some googling but I need reliable source too.
I'm wondering if anybody can help me. and within a week or so, the statistic should be up here.

Thanks

[chenchow]

This is the best I could find up to now. It is from Bartleby (http://www.bartleby.com/151/150.html#Economy) and OECD (http://web.hhs.se/personal/suzuki/a-English/ne06.html)

GDP (Purchasing Power Parity) 9,000
In Asia, we ranked 7th.
1. Japan 26,500.
2. Hong Kong 25,000
3. Singapore 24,700
4. Brunei 18,000
5. Taiwan 17,200
6. South Korea 15,700
7. Malaysia 9,000
8. Thailand 6,600
9. China 4,300
10. Phillipines 4,000

In the OECD countries, the selected countries are:
1. Luxembourg 48,500
2. Norway 36,500
3. US 35,200
8. Canada 28,900
12. Australia 27,400
15. Germany and UK 26,300
17. France 26,200

So, we still have a long way to go.

For GDP with Exchange rate. In Asia, we ranked 8th.
Japan, China, Korea, Taiwan, Hong Kong, Indonesia, Thailand, Malaysia, Singapore, Phillipines.
Note: This is not per capita.

For GDP with Purchasing Power Parity. In Asia, we ranked 8th.
1. China 5,560.0 Billion USD
2. Japan 3,364.5 Billion USD
3. South Korea 748.8
4. Indonesia 687.0
5. Thailand 410.0
6. Taiwan 386.0
7. Phillipines 335.0
8. Malaysia 200.0
9. Hong Kong 180.0
10. Vietnam 168.1
11. Singapore 106.3

For economic performance,
1. USA
2. Luxembourg
3. China
4. Germany
5. Belgium
6. UK
7. Hong Kong
8. France
9. Netherlands
10. Ireland
15. Singapore
24. South Korea
25. Malaysia
29. Japan
32. Thailand

[masterof_none]

thanks Chen Chow. That really help!

and if anybody can come up with more figures, (like percentage of time spent by the Japanese at work ), that would be good too.

if anybody has a complete guide of malaysian GDP's 20 years back, Please scan them and email it to me at hasran@<hidden>

[WilliamLee]

Hi, do I call you Hasran?

There's a link I obtainted about stats on the Malaysian Economy:
http://www.pmo.gov.my/NewSMPKE/economy/econ_frame.htm

just some figures...hope you find something there.

Yeah, 2020 is not too far away. And in fact it's coming really really soon. Hopefully living standards in Malaysia will improve.

cheers

[masterof_none]

Thanks for the link William. hope it would benefits many users besides me.

people call me by my nickname masterof_none , but my name is Syamsul.

I figured that the only thing Malaysia can become a develop country is political stability .

But , that's not enough. It needs confidence from Malaysians too.
If not, we will forever dreaming. The momentum is yet to come...

But I believe it would start from this website !

[__earth]

about GDP, don't you guys think it's flawed?

i mean GDP = consumption + investment + govt. spending + net export.

this means every gallon of oil spilt, another unit of GDP goes up.
IMHO from a green perpective, damage should be added to the current theory. it should be:
GDP = consumption + investment + govt. spending + net export - DAMAGE

and damage could cover a gamut of things, from environment damage and social damage to capital deprivations. of course, capital deprivations might already be counted in prevent/future value but you get the idea.

[littlebigone]

I think current economist know about those factors. Maybe there is a normalized/adjusted GDP somewhere out there in the world.

Also, another factor that may not show up on GDP is stuff like cottage industries or income and production that does not get reported.

A good example is housewife making a move into the career world. Before that they may have been taking care of their children, cooking, selling cakes, but this does not add up to the GDP. Suddenly there is a women's lib awareness and this jump to the career world surges the nation's GDP.

I think this is partly why Malaysia's GDP growth and any developing country's growth is grossly overstated.

[__earth]

i think i disagree about overstated though you maybe right on your first point. GDP is always understated. however, it could be overstated if you have an Enron's styled case.
like you've said, it doesn't report what doesn't get reported - like the cottage industries and the housewives plus black markets.

just a intriguing fact. did you guys know that in Italy, the black market size in reality if half of the country's economic income? when i heard that, i bursted into laughter in the lecture room.

[iQing]

Ooo... interesting..
I wanna know more about GDP
where can I read about it...?
can u suggest a weblink?

thanx

:D :D 8O :?:

[chenchow]

I have found some links about GDP.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/econ0025.htm
http://www.cftech.com/BrainBank/FINANCE/GDP.html


May be those would give you some more idea of GDP.

I would like to bring to attention of everyone to GNP as well.

To those who are not familiar with these stuff, GDP is Gross Domestic Product, and GNP is Gross National Product.

GDP for Malaysia would include everything that is in a country. So, GDP would include a US investment in Malaysia, but it will not be included in GNP.

GNP for Malaysia will include investment from Malaysia at other countries.

Hope this will clarify a bit more.

[__earth]

well, though GNP exists, even economists nowadays rarely use GNP beacause GNP in reality is a subset of GDP. Nevertheless, GNP is still useful for some purpose albeit not as useful as GDP.

In GDP, although investment is important, consumption is the most important component. It consists of almost 70% of the total GDP in almost every country.
That was why during the recession, you found the Msian govt tried to encourage ppl to spend their money instead of leaving otherwise. the higher the consumption, generally the higher the GDP gets. I said generally because there are cases where that's not true and that's way deeper into macroeconomics.

also, GDP could be interpreted by two means - expenditure and income.
the one that i've just explained is from the expenditure point of view.

I lack the knowledge to explain it from the income perpective. i hope somebody else will explain that.

[iQing]

If I have no mistaken, there are 2 kinds of GNP right?

one type is absolute GNP another one is relative GNP? not sure..

i think one of them above takes inflation into consideration

[chenchow]

I think the 2 types will be one is normal one, while another one would take in Purchasing Power Parity(PPP). So, for instance the GDP per capita for Malaysia is USD4500+, whereas our GDP per capita PPP is about 9000+ .

The GDP per capita PPP will diminish the effect of currency, so that would means that if we compare GDP per capita PPP of US and Malaysia, US with 27000, then they are having 3 times the purchasing power of us based on their income. If based on absolute GDP, they will be able to buy 6 or 7 times more than us, but the difference is that their goods are more expensive.

Hope that could explain a bit.

[iQing]

why some experts say that in the future china will take over USA as the country with the strongest economy in the world?

does it have something to do with GDP and GNP growth?


thanx again

[__earth]

i'm not sure what you are talking about.

but if you are referring to the growth rate, then China's rate is currently larger than the US, in fact one of the highest in the world. This is because in less developed nations, it's easier to develop the undeveloped.
that's why you had the "asian tigers" but, since the undeveloped has somewhat been developed, the rate is lower than usual.
as a note, some other factors do affect the rate.

one classic case is Japan. Throughout the 60s and 70s, their rate was booming, sometimes it exceeded 10%!!!
now, the rate is so slow, it's barely 1%. in the recent years, it was almost 0%.

and of course, GDP = Consumption + investment + govt spending + net export.

consumption will be huge since China is the world most populous nation. Investment is coming in because of cheap labor. govt spending - china has too many undeveloped lands so that too will increase. net export - im not sure.

[iQing]

Maybe that's why people say that we should do business in China...

I'm considering about it...
better learn Mandarin if you wanna do business in china (a good advantage if you know how to speak chinese)

thanx

[chenchow]

Although population will increase the total GDP, what that is typically looked at is GDP per capita, which means the total GDP is divided by total number of population, so I believe that great population will not make much difference then.

[__earth]

you're right but it depends on which perpective you take =).
both information, per capita and total provide different information.
for instance, the higher the per capita, the higher the standard of living (also dependent on a few other factors).
on the other hand, higher to total describes the size of the industry.

[chenchow]

Fully agree with _earth.

_earth, I hope that you can share more knowledge on economics with us. For me, I have only taken a class each on micro and macro, so what I know is really limited...

[__earth]

sure, but i can't do a lectiure =)

[masterof_none]

Malaysians need to know about the concept of GDP because this is almost the sole factor for OECD to determine whether we're a developed nation or not..

They use it GDP per capita as a measure.
Also, after taken into account the inflation rate , etc.
(PPP) or , we can use the Big Mac Price index.

Several things can be done:

1. look at the GDP , 10 years .
2. look at which one is stronger, which one is weaker..
3. Assess our performance,
4. See what we can do directly to achive higher income.

I know lot of people here know economics. So, you can contribute too!

[__earth]

just wondering, is it true that we need to have 7% of growth for 30 years in order to achieve developed status?
if that's so, it's kinda shallow definition.

[__earth]

alright, somebody at the shoutbox claims that Msia doesn't stand a chance against China's growing economy and therefore, there is no way Msia could compete with China.

What say thy?

[littlebigone]

I think our market and china's market were different a couple of years ago. But now china is moving towards opening their market and so attract the same investors as Malaysia. That is why Malaysia now views China as a threat.

Ideas?

[__earth]

obviously, labor-wise china is the winner. however, china's labor force is not really well trained. so, i think the only way msia could stay competitive is to fight in other areas like hi-tech and stuff.

or better, msia needs to invest in china. if you can't fight em, join em.

on the side note, china has been sucking Penang's industries but there's nothing to be afraid of coz we are sucking singapore's :twisted:

[chenchow]

I certainly think that Malaysia has its own competitive advantage, where it is able to attract many multinational corporations to move into Malaysia in the past one year. BMW, Ericsson, DHL, HSBC, Citibank, Boeing etc are good example, of those multinational companies that move their regional HQ to Malaysia within the past 12 months.

However, more needs to be done for us to improve further.

[1st_Spirit]

Nicely done from __Earth, "Can't beat them, join them"

If we sucking sing so sing sucking from whom?[/quote]

[__earth]

i bet they are sucking the US. =)
The US meanwhile is having a huge deficit.

talking about US, it's funny how the US is having a persistant recession. a year ago when the econ was bad, i actually didn't see the effects of the downturn save in the papers. things were going fine but now, i'm seeing it now with my own eyes.
UofMichigan itself is trying to save money due to a significant reduction of aid from the state. And mind you, this happens about 3 years after the recession hit the US.

The other countries meanwhile already on the road to recovery.

[1st_Spirit]

Logic:
Big fish > Small fish,
Small fish > Smaller Fish,
Smaller Fish > Bigger Fish,

It that true that:
Small Fish > Bigger Fish?

[__earth]

it might seems a hole in logic but my bet is that there's more to it than some fishy business. there's probably some monkey business too. :P

[1st_Spirit]

Fishy Vs Monkey, Good Idea,

If Monkey Catching Fish (China Sucking Malaysia)
Small Fish eating smaller Fish (Sing)
Smaller fish sucking big Whale (USA)

Hehhehe, what a fishy and zoo talking :)

[littlebigone]

i bet they are sucking the US. =)
The US meanwhile is having a huge deficit.

talking about US, it's funny how the US is having a persistant recession. a year ago when the econ was bad, i actually didn't see the effects of the downturn save in the papers. things were going fine but now, i'm seeing it now with my own eyes.
UofMichigan itself is trying to save money due to a significant reduction of aid from the state. And mind you, this happens about 3 years after the recession hit the US.

The other countries meanwhile already on the road to recovery.

could be due to a certain 87 billion being spent elsewhere

[__earth]

bush is a funny guy. He is willing to spend 87 billions for a war, but not for the Kyoto Protocol.

[1st_Spirit]

He meant for OIL and for WAR and for personal pleasure

[qedx]

well enacting environmentally friendly laws can only get you so much money. hell it costs a LOT (havent you guys ever played Simcity?). The best deals usually come from

1. Max security prison
2. toxic waste disposal plant
3. army base
4. casino
5. getting rid of trash deals

[__earth]

Just wondering, are the professors in any other university liberal?
I know Michigan professors are very liberal. Not that it's a bad thing though. =)
I could see the conservative students feeling like they wanna puke whenever any anti-Bush joke come out from up front.