Crimea State Medical University [Archive]

libran_mei

30-05-2005, 11:45 AM

actually, don mind me asking this.but just being curious, what is the real reason for some of you pursuing medical in quite a far fetched country, Ukraine. its definitely not your typical place to pursue a medical degree, and definitely not a comfy one too. the entire purpose of me finding out is, of course not to put off your interests whatsoever but rather to provide a clearer insight to what you are bound to face once set foot there. it is of my concern that you do not regret your decisions later, because if i m not wrong, a few of my juniors including one of my young cousins do visit this site, and happen to gain a remarkable interest in our current topic, CSMU for a medical degree.

and guess what, a very shocking feedback i had, from the most unlikely person.my mom.she is quite convinced that the place isn;t suitable for any youngsters like myself, what;s more for my 18 year old cousin. and she isn;t too pleased with my constant "meddling" into people's decisions, by offering opinions on how it is really like in Ukraine. she even gave an example "what if these people actually had plans like we had previously, until you or someone else came along and started giving advices, different opinions and eventually deviate them from the actual facts".basically, i did not take offense to what she had said, but it did give some room to think myself.

though, i can obviously say it is simply because, i have been there and done that, i cannot deny the fact that different individuals have different opinions. and it is almost certain that the lifestyles we are brought up with and got accustomed to, also play a role or two in determining your physical, mental and spiritual strength when studying abroad. so, whatever stories you have heard or bound to hear, you have to ask youself constantly, will you be prepared by then?can you get prepared? are you willing to prepare for the challenges ahead?i din managed to complete the answers before took off and i paid quite heavily for them.i won;t say i regret it but iwould say, it would have been better if i had the answers.

Steppe

30-05-2005, 12:45 PM

Honestly, I am curious as well. I would have thought IMU local or even Manipal twinning would be a better choice. At least, there is no language barrier, do not have to subject to learning Russian. Here, in Malaysia, we know BM and English, hence no issue with the language barrier.

As for costs, local IMU, Manipal twinning, PMC, Monash and even with Sedaya now costs about RM 250k - RM 280k. It is slightly more expensive than Russia but I would have thought at least, we have a better, safer, and more conducive environment than Russia.

Well, just my opinions.

selvi

31-05-2005, 10:18 PM

actually, don mind me asking this.but just being curious, what is the real reason for some of you pursuing medical in quite a far fetched country, Ukraine. quote]
[quote=Steppe]Honestly, I am curious as well. I would have thought IMU local or even Manipal twinning would be a better choice.
csmu is a cheaper option after all for students whose parents cant afford. for some people money grows on trees, so their parents can send their children wherever to pursue their medical degree while other people struggle wit financial issues. i see ukraine as a place to experience their culture, to learn their language ( its definitely no loss if we learn an extra language ) n a place to seek for adventure. n also learnin to be independant in a foreign country. in ukraine there's only one recognized medical university which is csmu n there's about 1000+ of malaysian students there. if there can solve the problems they face, why would i be any different. if they can, why not me. lets be optimistic.

masdie

01-06-2005, 02:36 AM

to selvi and all students aspiring to read or is currently reading medicine, i wish you all good luck. study hard. i really hope to see you people become good doctors. don't disappoint us.

libran_mei

01-06-2005, 04:32 PM

No, don't get me wrong. Its not that I am against the idea of pursuing medical in Ukraine. Infact, it is true that it could solve the problem financially. what about Russia?its also another option. This is where I am getting at. When you think that its the only option, you will be surprised what other roads you can eventually take. wht about STPM?then you can get enrolled into local universities. Even IMU, you can get government or bank loans. They are choices. Seriously, personally, I do think Russia is a better option, simply because I have friends who opted out of Ukraine and now doin exceptionally well in RSMU (russian state medical university) and also MMA (moscow medical academy). All that i have stated are not unfounded or baseless. It is because I have heard and seen quite alot, and even been through it myself, that I can have the say, go look further and think carefully before any rash decisions. and definitely, i know the pain parents have to bear when forking out a fortune on their children's education. because i am sharing the pain now with my very own parents and so, i do strongly believe that money really doesn't grow on trees.

masdie

01-06-2005, 05:36 PM

Seriously, personally, I do think Russia is a better option, simply because I have friends who opted out of Ukraine and now doin exceptionally well in RSMU (russian state medical university) and also MMA (moscow medical academy).

do you really think that russian univs are better than ukraines'? you should never blindly trust stories people tell you.

cooldog

02-06-2005, 10:39 AM

I am afraid if we can't see the real thing for ourselves, we have to then rely on what others tell us. Then, it's up to us to discern what they say is true or not.

Personally, I also think that Russia is of better choice. I think it's highly ranked in the WHO's list of medical unis. I remember seeing it somewhere or someone telling me about it... I have a friend who is studying in Ukraine but he wants to transfer to Russia. He told me that Ukraine is not going to be recognised anymore by the Malaysian Government. I don't know how true this is.

selvi

02-06-2005, 11:59 AM

to selvi and all students aspiring to read or is currently reading medicine, i wish you all good luck. study hard. i really hope to see you people become good doctors. don't disappoint us.

thanks 4 ur support. i too hope i dont disappoint others, n especially myself. wat r ur plans?

selvi

02-06-2005, 12:46 PM

[quote="libran_mei"] what about Russia?its also another option. wht about STPM?then you can get enrolled into local universities. Even IMU, you can get government or bank loans. Seriously, personally, I do think Russia is a better option, simply because I have friends who opted out of Ukraine and now doin exceptionally well in RSMU (russian state medical university) and also MMA (moscow medical academy). All that i have stated are not unfounded or baseless. It is because I have heard and seen quite alot, and even been through it myself, that I can have the say, go look further and think carefully before any rash decisions. [quote]
if u look at $$$$, d expenses n tuition fees at csmu is still cheaper. . every penny counts.Russia's weather is colder n some of d russians dont like asians very much. they might be discrimination cases in ukraine too but its worse in russia. i dont know if u heard of d cases where even d STPM students who got GPA 4.0 cant get a place for medic in d government universities. they have to compete wit d matrik students to earn a place in d government universities. they r too many matrik students who got GPA 4.0 in their exams while few STPM students which got GPA 4.0 in their exams. matrik students study for a year while STPm student study for 2 years. Even i have to agree that IMU medical degree is better than CSMU medical degree. Even if my parents r eligble for d loans. they will be high interest rates. my parents have other siblings to consider too. overall CSMU is still a cheaper option. Believe me i have looked further n thought carefully. this is my life afterall. why wouldn't i think carefully. i have no plans to mess up my life. by d way, where r u studiying medicine? Wat year r u in?

libran_mei

02-06-2005, 02:40 PM

Of course, we shouldn't just go all out and trust some stories or rumours told by mere strangers or even tabloids. But, would you dare dismiss them entirely?without even batting an eyelid? CSMU is not gettin any cheaper by the way, with the constant increase in hostel fees and other miscellaneous stuff. When I was there, the hostel fees got increased double from what it was just one year before. And with the locals understanding the profit they could rake in with the sudden jump in the number of m;sian students there, definitely everything is going to be more expensive. Even now, my friends are complaining already. The same applies everywhere. So, best to have a long term planning, financially whatever. And also, a back up plan. Nobody wants to screw up his own future for sure, but when things go wrong, they can go way wrong. Anyhow, if you are absolutely certain you are made up for it, then go for it by all means. I am very sure nothing could stop one from pursuing his dreams anytime, anywhere. So, best of luck to you, Selvi and others who have the same determination. As for myself, I am going to continue my studies in IMU, this coming August. If you want to find out more about your next destination for medical, feel free to ask. Or even check out my other posts under the topic "medicine in ukraine, russia and other countries". there, you can most probably tell what i have been through. But just to summarise them all, the journey was unforgettable. Like a dream, abruptly interrupted but lingers on for almost forever.

selvi

02-06-2005, 08:24 PM

CSMU is not gettin any cheaper by the way, with the constant increase in hostel fees and other miscellaneous stuff. When I was there, the hostel fees got increased double from what it was just one year before. And with the locals understanding the profit they could rake in with the sudden jump in the number of m;sian students there, definitely everything is going to be more expensive. So, best to have a long term planning, financially whatever.

i might have to agree wit you d cost of livin in ukraine is gettin higher by d year n i heard d food there isnt as good m'sia but im ready for a good adventure. all d best to you too, libran_mei. my cousin is in IMU too. i have another relative who gratuated from IMU. By d way libran_mei, i wouldnt exactly say i have financial prob but i love studyin abroad where u can learn their culture n experience a lot of new n different things. if i had a choice, i would like to do medic in ireland or uk or india. it is out of my parent s budget as there r other siblings to think of.those who wan to study medicine in burma n indonesia but d environment, more or less is like m'sia. it is a cheaper option too.

skyguy

06-06-2005, 07:36 AM

CSMU is ok. About the increase of living cost, i can say that in any part of the world right now the cost of living has increased due to the rise in fuel prices. I dont see this as an issue in Ukraine only, even Malaysian student's in Australia and UK are having a tough time to cope the increase of fees and living cost, even in Malaysia quite a number of private college and private uni's has increased their fees ranging from 5-15 %.

selvi

06-06-2005, 05:20 PM

CSMU is ok.

wat r u doin now? have u joined d pre-u at ukraine last year? or r u joinin this year?

skyguy

07-06-2005, 12:52 PM

i'm 100 % NOT GOING

skyguy

07-06-2005, 12:52 PM

i'm 105% not going

cooldog

09-06-2005, 10:08 AM

i dont know if u heard of d cases where even d STPM students who got GPA 4.0 cant get a place for medic in d government universities. they have to compete wit d matrik students to earn a place in d government universities. they r too many matrik students who got GPA 4.0 in their exams while few STPM students which got GPA 4.0 in their exams.

It's true that there are many STPM GPA 4.0 students who couldn't get into medic. Not only that, it seems that matrik students find it hard to enter that course too. My housemates are STPM 4.0 and matrik top scorers. But, the local uni gave them dentistry instead. Quite a number of them are in IMU now.

Lee

11-06-2005, 04:56 PM

Hey can i know any STPM candidate 2004 that apply for CSMU from any agent and have actually gotten an official offer letter of admission by CSMU. thanks

libran_mei

13-06-2005, 12:39 PM

hey, i heard from a couple of my friends that csmu just got derecognised.is tht true? it is definitely worrying.let me knoe if theres anything else you have heard of. thnks.

Lee

13-06-2005, 08:26 PM

yup, that's also wat i heard from my friends. i called up one of the representative of csmu. they told me that it might happen but let's look in the newspaper on wednesday or thursday cause mmc and the health ministry is having meetings on this matter. so lets wait and see. any more news please do post and let all of us know.

14-06-2005, 11:10 AM

I dont think CSMU will be derecognised. If it happens, what's the reason? can anyone tell.

flibbertigibbet

16-06-2005, 02:24 PM

No to medical courses from Ukraine's Crimea State Medical University

PUTRAJAYA: Medical undergraduate programmes offered by the Crimea State Medical University in Ukraine will no longer be recognised.

Malaysian Medical Council president Datuk Dr Ismail Merican said it would be withdrawing its recognition of the programmes to any student being registered and admitted after Dec 31 this year.

Among the reasons cited for the withdrawal included the dubious qualifications of students admitted for the institute?s medical studies, the difficulty of its medical graduates in using technical jargons in English and the possible strain on the quality of teaching due to the sudden increase in intake.

?For those who are enrolled in the first year of their medical studies in this institute, they can continue. But for those who are going to enter pre-medical studies in September, I would advise them not to go,? he told reporters today.

?The council will not compromise on patient's safety and shall always ensure that medical undergraduates have the required knowledge and skills to practice medicine safely,? said Ismail.

Please take note of this and think twice before pursuing medical course there.

selvi

17-06-2005, 12:39 PM

i saw this piece of news too. my original plan was to do pre-medical there. now it seems like a change of plan

masdie

17-06-2005, 02:22 PM

i saw this piece of news too. my original plan was to do pre-medical there. now it seems like a change of plan

so selvi, what're you plans? what are you going to do now?

skyguy

17-06-2005, 03:54 PM

nwx86

17-06-2005, 04:14 PM

Volgograd and Niznhy? really? where did u get that information from? I guess there is a chance for that too, since there are so many things said about medic courses in russian uni's, if what said are true.

nwx86

17-06-2005, 04:14 PM

masdie

17-06-2005, 04:25 PM

fu yoh, lucky. My dad just cancelled the payment check to my agent. Anyway look's like only Indon is the safest place now from getting derecognised. I heard that Volgograd and Niznhy is the next target of MMC.

What about those who've made the payment? Can they get back their money? Or are they stuck with that track? Haha, csmu just got recognised in 2001, the ones who went in in 2001 haven't even graduate and this news came. What a pity.

libran_mei

17-06-2005, 05:46 PM

yeah.my aunt just called the russian embassy, education department. and she bluntly told her that only two unis in russia are recognised, rsmu and mma.so, the rest are big no-nos.

Lee

17-06-2005, 09:20 PM

alamak what is mmc trying to main la. hey is there anyone still planning to continue with their first year medical degree this september in csmu. have anyone actually gotten their offer letter.

18-06-2005, 11:07 AM

According to some insiders, the main reason of this derecognition is racial issue between the breakdown of the 1300 Malaysian students there . Dont know how true is this. But there is no use for people now planning to join even 1st year there this september. Unless you are planning to go UK, USA, Canada, Australia or Canada after graduation to start your career.

Pity those who already paid your deposits. I sure that all of the CSMU agents will "GULUNG TIKAR" after this and probably run away with all the money paid by students planning to go there.

Anyway just for information, Niznhy and Volgograd will not be derecognised because the whole 6years of the programme is conducted in english unlike the 3years english 3years ukrainian/russian programme in CSMU.

pandaboy

18-06-2005, 12:09 PM

I wonder how about those who are still studying there....

Will they be put under observation upon graduation as doctors?

18-06-2005, 06:50 PM

hey people, according to the information that i gather. the 6 year medical degree in csmu is conducted fully in english. except for the clinical year we must know how to speak russian in order to communicate with the patient..

pringles

19-06-2005, 08:34 AM

With reference to News Straits Times dated 19 June 2005, , MMC president, Datuk Dr Ismail Marican gave the reason( for deregistration of CSMU ) that lecturer-student ratio was too great and therefore cannot produce good quality doctors.

19-06-2005, 09:18 AM

According to some insiders, the main reason of this derecognition is racial issue between the breakdown of the 1300 Malaysian students there

That is true, Datuk Seri Samy Vellu is very angry about MMC's decision. It seems 60 % of malaysians there are indians and MMC can take it. I wonder why indians in malaysia are always the victim. If the main reason is language and lack of english medical jargon MMC should derecognised even japanase , taiwan , middle east and medical degrees from other countries which use their native language during clinical years. MMC IS MAKING A FOOL OUT OF THEMSELVES AND OUR COUNTRY

csmurulez

19-06-2005, 09:23 PM

Well, I think if CSMU is derecognised, then russian med schools should be derecognised as well. They have similar syllabus and the common language used is russian. Their technologies should also be similar as they came from the same soviet root. Maybe our Samy Vellu is right? Maybe the MMC is really racist?

but then again, i heard that these ex-soviet med schools were first recognised in 2001 due to a G2G relationship. Russians sell fighter jets to m'sia while m'sia sends students there. If anyone remember, these med schools were recognised only in a matter of weeks (if i'm not mistaken) right after our Tun Mahathir voices out to our agencies to consider recognising these schools. Maybe these schools were recognised because the mmc 'gives face' to mahathir?

i personally think there won't be any problem even if csmu is derecognised. csmu is said to be a top med school in europe producing quality doctors. so if that is the case, why not just go over there, complete your 6 years and come back for the qualifying test? it should be a breeze to these quality doctors right?

20-06-2005, 01:09 PM

Looks like now only students funded on their own can study med at csmu.. becos since our watchDOG (MMC) derecognised CSMU no instituition will give loans or scholarship for students intending to study over there.

By the way to every one who is reading this post, if you'll think MMC is right reply this post by saying (MMC IS RIGHT) and if MMC is wrong post (MMC MADE A MISTAKE).

aerenkima_1028

22-06-2005, 03:40 PM

hi there.. im 18 this year, recently just finished my spm in 2004. all this while i was planning to further my studies in CSMU, where my brother is also doing his first year. after what the government did.. (de-recognition of csmu) i was really sad. i wanted to persue my medical degree in medical. anyways, now i have to choose between sticking to CSMU or change to Kursk...but in oreder to make this decision, i need all of your help.. please advice me on all about csmu.... i would like to know whether the teaching language would be all in english for my seven years there.. including pre-U.. i would also like to know more about CSMU.. thank you so much guys.. hope to get a reaply soon... thanks alot...

youngyew

22-06-2005, 04:10 PM

From a redundant thread (http://recom.org/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2517&highlight=).

hei there! R there any of d SPM school leavers interested in joinin d pre-u/pre-medical in ukraine in this Sept 2005? And then continue pursuing d medical degree at CSMU, ukraine. im joinin d pre-u/pre-medical in ukraine in this Sept 2005 and then continue pursuing d medical degree at CSMU, ukraine. Feel free to ask n share anyhting concerning this topic.
hi, can i know have u actually received ur offer letter from csmu or izzit just ur agent that actually confirm ur application and said that u will confirm a place in csmu verbally. can i know who is ur agent. for my case my agent told me that i'll only get my offer letter on 1st july but he also said that i will be confirmed a place in csmu verbally. thanks

PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2005 10:16 pm Post subject: csmu Reply with quote Edit/Delete this post Delete this post View IP address of poster
Lee wrote:
hi, can i know have u actually received ur offer letter from csmu or izzit just ur agent that actually confirm ur application and said that u will confirm a place in csmu verbally. can i know who is ur agent. for my case my agent told me that i'll only get my offer letter on 1st july but he also said that i will be confirmed a place in csmu verbally. thanks

i havent receive my offer letter from csmu. im not sure if d agent has confirm a place for me in csmu. i will tell u as fast as possible wen i know. who's ur agent by d way Question mine is Rarula. r u a chinese girl or guy Question did u just finish your SPM last year like me? then, u wil b doin ur pre-u there too. just curious. after all we wil meet in ukraine. Wink
hi, i am a chinese girl and am stpm candidate 2004. so the course i applied in csmu is the 1st year MD. My agent is CSMU Consultant sdn bhd. they actually told me that i will get my offer letter during mid may then now they tell me that my offer letter will only be out on 1st july as the ukraine government haven reply them yet. so i am quite worry. How about u, r u also chinese.

no, im not a chinese. i can write n speak decent english. im a indian girl. i was hopin that i will get to know anybody who is planning to do their pre-u in ukraine this sept 2005.
are they any more students planning to do pre-U in csmu even after the gov has de-recognise the uni.. ???

selvi

22-06-2005, 04:11 PM

hi there.. im 18 this year, recently just finished my spm in 2004. all this while i was planning to further my studies in CSMU, where my brother is also doing his first year. after what the government did.. (de-recognition of csmu) i was really sad. i anyways, now i have to choose between sticking to CSMU or change to Kursk...but in oreder to make this decision, i need all of your help.. please advice me on all about csmu.... i would also like to know more about CSMU.. thank you so much guys

hi. im 18 too. my plan was also to go to CSMU 4 pre-medic. if u r stickin with CSMu u have 2 take d an exam before practising in m'sia. if dont plan to work i m'sia, then it wont be a prob. u can find out everthing u wan from ur bro at CSMU. Besides Russia ( Kursk ), u can do ur pre medic in indonesia. Or u can do ur pre u here, then decide where to go. after doin ur pre u, u can do medic in burma too. i too havent decided wat am i goin to do. i thought of Kursk but im very concern about my safety (dont wan 2 live in fear all d time )[/url]

aerenkima_1028

22-06-2005, 04:22 PM

thanks for your reply.. yeah, i've heard things about russia.. the way of life as an ex-communist country.. right now there are still punk head groups that would beat us foreigners just to get us out from their soil.. are you still going ahead with csmu.. i was wondering if the 65 students that applied to go to csmu is still going to persue medic there... my parents did say if our country would not accept me as a doc, i would have to work some where else too.. further more discrimination from other doc would be a problem as we all graduate according to them" a cheap UNI"....

masdie

22-06-2005, 04:26 PM

.....right now there are still punk head groups that would beat us foreigners just to get us out from their soil....

They're called skinheads.

youngyew

23-06-2005, 03:38 PM

From a redundant thread (http://recom.org/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2732).

Have you guys read about this thing?

Rather interesting twist with the suspension of a minister. At the same time, I find Nazri very offensive. I hope he would never be a foreign minister, much less anything higher.
I'm curious about the words exchanged that lead to his suspension, something which hasn't been done before in parliament. And why would Nazri call him a racist. Unjustified allegations that cannot be questioned only raise questions whether such ppl are capable of being wakil rakyat.

As what jeffooi labels
UMNO - U Must Not Object!

kelvinlym

23-06-2005, 03:42 PM

Yes, I read through the hansard and it seems Nazri just started saying the word "racist" for no reason.

It's totally uncalled for and shows his lack of maturity very prominently. It looks like he went amok or had a very limited vocabulary. OR both.

I think he really wants to get home REAL bad because it's past 5.30

Randomphantom

23-06-2005, 03:48 PM

I don't think that thread was so much about CSMU as about the parliamentary incident (with focus on the suspension and that "word"). So IMO it might not suit this thread.

I think we all know how to use the word "racist" very well. But we don't know its definition that well. So here's something from the dictionary.

1. The belief that race accounts for differences in human character or ability and that a particular race is superior to others.
2. Discrimination or prejudice based on race.

Datuk Dr. Abdul Latiff bin Ahmad: Tuan Yang di-Pertua, yang saya hendak
terangkan sebab ada orang kata yang MMC ini tidak profesional, lihat kulit. Jadi saya
kena terangkan bahawa yang ditekankan oleh MMC adalah kualiti. Kalau hendak ikut
kualiti, 200 pelajar, majoriti pelajar perubatan yang sudah graduate daripada
unscheduled university sepatutnya mereka sudah tidak diberi peluang selepas tiga kali
gagal. 200 pelajar ini, Tuan Yang di-Pertua, saya terangkan semuanya etnik India tetapi
kita bagi peluang. Walaupun mereka sue kerajaan...

What are the 200 students referred to here? The major point of contention.

What are the "medical qualifying exams", and from what I understand, are students from unrecognised universities forced to take it? How is it regulated, what are the pass rates?

Dato? Seri Mohamed Nazri bin Abdul Aziz: Duduk, perkauman, you are racist, racist, you are racist, you have got no place in this country. Malaysia tidak hendak racist, you are racist.

Youch.

__earth

23-06-2005, 03:52 PM

Yup. I'm with random. This thread doesn't suit this SIG. It's more about current issue than about medicine.

Wanna move this to front page?

aerenkima_1028

24-06-2005, 04:20 PM

right now there are around 150 students being sponsored by the jpa to persue medic, whether ireland, russia, indonesia or somewhere else... not to say i'm a racist but from 150 students, 20 are chinese and three are indians. dun misunderstand me.. i'm not trying to insult the other race or something.. but the results for chinese and indian student are much more higer than the malay students.. still they manage.. about 120 to persue medic. and when they entered "intec", just recently, all the students that are persuing medic have to take an english test.. and when the marks were out, the malay students score marks figuring from 10-15, while the chinese and indian students score more.. way more.. and to compare our spm results.. there are more people who deserve a place for medic.. the malays there are taking everything for granted.. even the scholarship.. i just hope in the future, students will be picked accordingly by their results.. not jus because they are bumiputra's... our country are already short of doctors.. still they are chasing us away from this country.. never did understand this country...sorry if my words have offended anyone.. but this is really wats happening..

24-06-2005, 04:39 PM

~speechless~

wow.... is that true????

masdie

24-06-2005, 08:44 PM

What are the 200 students referred to here? The major point of contention.

I think they're refering to the 200 doctors graduating from unrecognised med schools overseas who did not pass our medical qualifying exam and these 200 doctors then complained to the media about it. Maybe you should check your old newspapers again, I don't really remember what the case was about.

What are the "medical qualifying exams", and from what I understand, are students from unrecognised universities forced to take it?

This medical qualifying exam is the exam taken by those doctors who graduated from unrecognised med schools. This exam is something like the PLAB in UK or USMLE in US. If they do not pass this exam, they will not be granted the license to practice in M'sia by the MMC. Doctors graduating from recognised med schools are exempted from this exam. If I'm not mistaken, this exam is something like the final year MBBS exam taken by our final year medical students in UM, UKM or USM.

How is it regulated, what are the pass rates?

I have no idea.

noneedname2

24-06-2005, 10:45 PM

I support MMC's move. I would be happy to see russian med schools derecognised as well. Haha :twisted:

I remember a newspaper article saying those ex-soviet med schools offered to 'help' malaysia improve on the physician:patient ratio and they applied for MMC's recognition hoping to be recognised for a good cause.

Frankly speaking, I think these med schools just want your money. They don't care who you are or how good you are. As long as you bring them money, they'll take you in. Universities in US and UK also love our money but at least they are of better quality.

You people might think hey, the Soviet Union were the first to send human to space, they're high-tech dude! I say high-tech your A-S-S! So what if they were the first to send human to space? That was so long ago. Did they make any breakthroughs recently? Are you sure they are high-tech for the present moment? Or are they just high-tech for 50 years ago? Did they improve at all after their man-sending project? Ask any students there and all of them will tell you that their equipments are all very old.

Accept the fact, they are poor. They want your money.

libran_mei

25-06-2005, 10:11 AM

Before you laud the actions of MMC, best if you start searching deep within yourself and see if you even have a conscience. To hell with your happiness and satisfaction upon the derecognition of these universities.

Spare some thoughts to those who are involved, for God's sake. Have you seen parents mortgaged their homes, used their goverment servant gratuity and taken loans from banks just to see their children through a good education? And to think that you even had the guts to proclaim how happy it would do you, should the other universities in Russia suffer similar fate.

Frankly speaking also, have you been there? Qualities?You trying to tell me that the rest of the world goes for money as well, but the quality is there compared to these "ex-soviet' med schools? My, you have seen the quality eh? You have been to one of these schools and actually have the rights to compare? why don't I enlighten you on what you actually do know? Nuts. That's all.

You wanna talk about improvement. Why don't you start from somewhere nearer. For example, home? Wow, sure thing. Malaysia just made some breakthroughs recently and oh yeah, what was it? High-tech..mm.So, when a country is capable of all these, only then it could be recognised for its medical degree? My F-O-O-T. Hell you know about the knowledge and skills of the professors there. Equipments old? Tht gonna hinder the studies of medical students entirely? Seriously, you are not going to be tht dumb to think that's all needed to be considered when you enrol for a university. And a medical one, mind you.

Oh sure, the fact is accepted. Let's accept another fact, shall we? EVERYONE wants money, regardless whether you are poor or rich. Don't even pass preconceived ideas when you know nothing. Singling out others, just because your uni might be more reputable or pricey doesn't make you better. Take a trip there first before you judge. Or else, keep your thoughts and factless details to yourself.

Lee

25-06-2005, 02:58 PM

i support u libran_mei. Why is Datuk S. Sothinathan being suspended because of the csmu case while datuk dr abdul latiff is not suspended instead. crmiea state medical university has got 100 years of history and also are very well known in europe countries. i believe they can produce good doctors. MMC is complainning that in csmu people use jargon english. ok fine. then how about those graduate from malaysia public unversity (IPTA). are they english that pro too? let's think for urself.

26-06-2005, 01:14 AM

Okay, I can't say that the council's actions are impeccable and perfectly thought out. But I do believe that there must be a reason for them to do what they did, and i doubt that it is for as frivolous a reason as preventing indians from becoming doctors.

I do sympathise with those parents who have spent their nest eggs on a Ukraine medical education, however, I do not feel that this makes a good argument towards keeping CSMU on the register. I have paid my money so give me my recognition? I don't know about that.

Oh, and btw, Malaysian unis aren't really recognized elsewhere either, so maybe it's not so weird that we don't recognize some foreign ones. Thing is, the type of medicine practised here and in the Ukraine is, to my mind, vastly different, and it does seem practical to ask returning students to have a test before practising. Think of like tropical diseases for instance which rarely happen in the ukraine.

And though I think that you're right in saying that equipment does not hinder ones medical education entirely, I do feel that at a certain point it begins to matter. I mean compare a class in a small town without computers and teaching aids to a big new state of the art school in KL. Of course no one ONLY considers equipment, but really it does matter.

I'd be the first to admit that I know little about CSMU and their teaching and equipment, but i feel that if the MMC thinks that it is necessary to strike them off the list especially with the shortage of doctors being widely proclaimed in the country right now, they must have good reason to.

And actually, a thought just passed my mind. How do you know what CSMU is like compared to other universities? I mean what do you base your opinion on? What do you know about the knowledge and skills of the professors as compared to other unis? May I suggest taking a trip round the WORLD before you judge?
I think that it's likely that the only people that can make this kind of judgement is the MMC, not lay people like us. If you happen to be a member of the MMC and are complaining about your decision, then... I have nothing to say. I feel sorry for you if you are.

Oh, and i thought that MMC complained that CSMU graduates couldn't understand the English jargon used in Malaysia? NOt sure bout that though. Anyway, maybe the situation is that malaysian graduates may not have perfect grammatical english, but they understand the english terms used in hospitals. Maybe, just maybe. I don't know.[/i]

libran_mei

27-06-2005, 06:17 PM

First of all, when I mentioned about sharing some thoughts for those who are involved in this CSMU recognition thingy which has obviously garnered plenty of attention from everyone, I really did mean it, as in morally speaking. It ain't an argument nor a solid reason to force MMC to revert their decision, it was merely directed at those who are inconsiderate enough to wholeheartedly support the move without having second thoughts. And to state how happy it would do one, it was almost unbearable to say the least.
As to what you have stated, money paid doesn't mean recognition guaranteed. True, but I can safely say this on behalf of most students, the recognition isn't something just to make one feel good, it is simply so that they can come HOME after six years, and serve the people without worrying about nuts. Get the drift now? Try to understand the current depressing situation they are in, faraway from home ground. Not all is about money, indeed.

Qualifying exams? No problem of course, if there's just not so many controversial issues clouding the idea. If you disagree, well, show us the proof that there is just one piece of standardised exam for all. Then most probably, we are able to rest the case. Why is it that anyone should get upset over the derecognition of CSMU?Simple actually. The reasons given for the action just cannot sink in. If I were to state why so for all of the so-called problems given by MMC, I would need the extra time, which sadly I don't have at the moment. How would I know what CSMU is like? Well, that's because I HAVE been there. The fact is, I was there to do my first year last september, right after my A-levels. Trust me. I DO know alot about the skills and knowledge of the professors there. And to say that my anatomy teacher was superb, I am seriously not giving him his due credit. And we learned more than what the students here have. I was even told that they barely scraped the surface. well, now that's a thought to ponder on, don't you think?

English jargon used in Malaysia a huge problem for CSMU graduates? ONLY them, you would think? What about graduates from other universities such as Taiwan, China, Indonesia and oh, Russia? Doesn't make much sense to penalise just one university when I am pretty sure the rest aren't that good either, does it? Ah, another thing worth mentioning about, first year medical students in UM learn their stuff in BM. Wow, tht was an eye opener for me, when I first heard about it. Sure, don't go travelling around the world just to judge universities, but insulting and degrading one by what you barely know about, that's really sad. Refute all you like, perhaps some statements made were uncalled for, but I just have to stress on, the disappointment amongst students and parents is heart wrenching to say the least. By adding salt to fresh wounds, is genuinely unnecessary.

guest

29-06-2005, 02:06 PM

dear libran_mei,

pertaining to the derecognition, i feel sad too. however by arguing and lamenting it definitely will not help you. as you are among those who would be recognised should you graduate later, you should not feel worry.

obviously, the reputation and image of csmu has been partially tarnished in the heart of malaysians. the only thing you can do should you wanna practise in malaysia is to prove yourself. show your capability and knowledge when you practise later and earn the respect of others. the other way is you practise medicine in ukraine if u opt to escape but this is surely not a wise choice.

i do believe that there are some highly intelligent students over there. don't get upset or feel sad about it. let bygones be bygones. accept it that due to some reasons, mmc decided to do that and it's not your fault by any means.

by the way, i have no idea where you heard about the medium used in UM is BM. BM is used in some lectures only. however, i am not very sure about it. i am from USM and apparently English is the medium used and in hospital, there is no other languages but English.

to clear your doubt, graduates from mainland china as well as taiwan have to undergo qualifying assessment before the commencement of housemanship.

i hope you can be one of my colleagues one day. dun give up. :D

29-06-2005, 03:23 PM

Sigh. It is down-right frustrating to hear this kind of news, and honestly speaking, I haven't really gotten the slightest clue why it has to be that way till now. I shouldn't be that upset seriously, because I am home anyway. I am actually starting afresh at IMU this coming Aug. If you had read my previous postings, you would most slightly be able to understand why I did what I did. I came home months ago before the news broke out. So, there were other reasons to why I am home again. Anyhow, it was encouraging to hear your utmost support and I couldn't be more honoured to be able to work beside you one day. who knows? :D

libran_mei

29-06-2005, 03:26 PM

Oops, I wasn't signed in properly just now. Hehe.

aerenkima_1028

29-06-2005, 03:27 PM

to librian_mei.. i jus wanna noe whether when you do return to M'sia after your 6 years course in CSMU.. do you think that other doc graduates from other Uni around the world are going to look down at you.. because you graduated from a Uni that was not recognise by our own government.. and are you prepared to face all the critism by malaysian doc's.. and not being preferrend by hospitals and patients compared to those that graduate from India, ireland.. or even indonesia???

libran_mei

30-06-2005, 01:35 PM

my dear, read the previous posts please. I came back before even completing my course there, and I am going to resume my studies this coming Aug.Locally. But just to clear your doubts, if I had stayed on, would I be bothered about all that you have mentioned? Why yes of course, after all, such mentality runs in our society, sad to speak. However, I always believe that when one door shuts, another window opens. So, jump. I woudn't wait for anyone for that matter to receive me with open arms.

I will most likely do whatever I have been trained to, and use my knowledge and skills where ever needs me to. The sky is indeed the limit, so why would I mourn? This is the exact same advice I gave my friends who are still studying there. And you want to know what they think? The same. They have evidently stopped sighing and moved on from where our country has left them. The attitude they have shown thus far puts everyone back home to shame. And I am proud to let you know, they will one day make fine doctors, and well it's our loss. Unfortunately.