Corruption

[chenchow]

After Felcra, a state assemblyman were nailed down by Anti Corruption Agency, Tan Sri Eric Chia from Perwaja and now Datuk Kasitah Gaddam, a Federal Minister were nailed down by ACA.

What do you think about these latest happenings?

[chenchow]

After Felcra, a state assemblyman were nailed down by Anti Corruption Agency, Tan Sri Eric Chia from Perwaja and now Datuk Kasitah Gaddam, a Federal Minister were nailed down by ACA.

What do you think about these latest happenings?

[sim_min]

+ve thinking: A good start for Malaysia
- ve thinking: er....is that another kind of political tricks? :roll:

[sim_min]

+ve thinking: A good start for Malaysia
- ve thinking: er....is that another kind of political tricks? :roll:

[screw3d]

I am ashamed. Corruption has been the downfall of many governments.

[screw3d]

I am ashamed. Corruption has been the downfall of many governments.

[topdog]

i think sim_min nailed it.

[topdog]

i think sim_min nailed it.

[__earth]

I am ashamed. Corruption has been the downfall of many governments.

Corruption is unavoidable. The only way we could do is to minimize it.

[__earth]

I am ashamed. Corruption has been the downfall of many governments.

Corruption is unavoidable. The only way we could do is to minimize it.

[topdog]

Pak Lah's credibility and popularity will reach the moon if they go after the really big fish...like samy vellu, ling, daim, etc. i guess i would rather think positive. let's hope pak lah is the real deal.

[topdog]

Pak Lah's credibility and popularity will reach the moon if they go after the really big fish...like samy vellu, ling, daim, etc. i guess i would rather think positive. let's hope pak lah is the real deal.

[Thirdshifter]

{sarcasm]I am shocked!! so shocked! i never saw this coming[/endofsarcasm]

I hope the corruption, nepotism, cronism would end in malaysia.

[Thirdshifter]

{sarcasm]I am shocked!! so shocked! i never saw this coming[/endofsarcasm]

I hope the corruption, nepotism, cronism would end in malaysia.

[jiinjoo]

Nah it won't "end", we're all humans after all (with a hint of legalism flavor here).

But it can be more transparent - i.e. not so much "corruption" but "donation", with amount known to public etc. More importantly, people need to care, instead of turning their face away.

Fishing, as it turns out, has been a new fad amongst the powers that be these days :)


Also note that pak lah is smart to not shake UMNO / barisan too much as he proceeds (or instruct people to proceed). First the anchovies, then the old fish (71 years old on a wheel chair... man!), then probably some unimportant ones, and slowly he will build momentum. Just hope that by the time he operates those big sea vessels, the government won't be empty... hehehe

[jiinjoo]

Nah it won't "end", we're all humans after all (with a hint of legalism flavor here).

But it can be more transparent - i.e. not so much "corruption" but "donation", with amount known to public etc. More importantly, people need to care, instead of turning their face away.

Fishing, as it turns out, has been a new fad amongst the powers that be these days :)


Also note that pak lah is smart to not shake UMNO / barisan too much as he proceeds (or instruct people to proceed). First the anchovies, then the old fish (71 years old on a wheel chair... man!), then probably some unimportant ones, and slowly he will build momentum. Just hope that by the time he operates those big sea vessels, the government won't be empty... hehehe

[__earth]

hey,
another arrest has been made - a close associate of kasitah.

[__earth]

hey,
another arrest has been made - a close associate of kasitah.

[__earth]

any, check yahoo! news, asia section.

this headline -> China Executes Former Vice Governor

is directly above ->Malaysia Minister Denies Criminal Charges

both concern corruption. LOL! what a coincidence!

[__earth]

any, check yahoo! news, asia section.

this headline -> China Executes Former Vice Governor

is directly above ->Malaysia Minister Denies Criminal Charges

both concern corruption. LOL! what a coincidence!

[DecentMerson]

all these arrests are a good sign.... at least this will let the ppl know that the corruption problem in the country is really serius...not like some leaders who always say....

as corruption really hinders progression of the country... it is really important to minimize its detrimental effects...

[DecentMerson]

all these arrests are a good sign.... at least this will let the ppl know that the corruption problem in the country is really serius...not like some leaders who always say....

as corruption really hinders progression of the country... it is really important to minimize its detrimental effects...

But it can be more transparent - i.e. not so much "corruption" but "donation", with amount known to public etc. More importantly, people need to care, instead of turning their face away.


I support 100% for more transparency. The association of power and money is not going away, but the public have the right to know who's influencing policy.

Although it would be very unpopular, a voting system based on money makes sense and would be more optimal that the current system one vote per person; the more taxes you pay, the more votes you get. After all, it's your taxes that is used to run the country. And it's absurb that in a democratic election a 80-year old uneducated person would have the same say with people whose lives depend on sound policies (for example, people of our younger generation - if bad policies are made, we are screwed).

But it can be more transparent - i.e. not so much "corruption" but "donation", with amount known to public etc. More importantly, people need to care, instead of turning their face away.


I support 100% for more transparency. The association of power and money is not going away, but the public have the right to know who's influencing policy.

Although it would be very unpopular, a voting system based on money makes sense and would be more optimal that the current system one vote per person; the more taxes you pay, the more votes you get. After all, it's your taxes that is used to run the country. And it's absurb that in a democratic election a 80-year old uneducated person would have the same say with people whose lives depend on sound policies (for example, people of our younger generation - if bad policies are made, we are screwed).

[chenchow]

Prince, I am just wondering whether if we allow those with more money paid to tax to have more votes, wouldn't it be a lot of those rich businessmen who are in their 70s and 80s, that would have more votes and isn't it would contradict your idea of having younger generation for more voice?

On corruption, Rais Yatim mentioned about 18 more high-profile cases will be revealed soon...


3 more news on this corruption issue in ReCom

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1160&mode=&order=0&thold=0

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1161&mode=&order=0&thold=0

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1162&mode=&order=0&thold=0

[chenchow]

Prince, I am just wondering whether if we allow those with more money paid to tax to have more votes, wouldn't it be a lot of those rich businessmen who are in their 70s and 80s, that would have more votes and isn't it would contradict your idea of having younger generation for more voice?

On corruption, Rais Yatim mentioned about 18 more high-profile cases will be revealed soon...


3 more news on this corruption issue in ReCom

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1160&mode=&order=0&thold=0

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1161&mode=&order=0&thold=0

http://recom.org/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=1162&mode=&order=0&thold=0

[__earth]

Although it would be very unpopular, a voting system based on money makes sense and would be more optimal that the current system one vote per person; the more taxes you pay, the more votes you get. After all, it's your taxes that is used to run the country.
a voting system based on money will only give the communist more bullet. it also violates the idea of equality.
If you remember, the French Revolution happened for very same reason - the wealthy had too much power.
and it sounds like legalization of bribery to me.

And it's absurb that in a democratic election a 80-year old uneducated person would have the same say with people whose lives depend on sound policies (for example, people of our younger generation - if bad policies are made, we are screwed).
an uneducated 80 yr old granddad may have more wisdom and experience than a highly educated 20 yrs old.

[__earth]

Although it would be very unpopular, a voting system based on money makes sense and would be more optimal that the current system one vote per person; the more taxes you pay, the more votes you get. After all, it's your taxes that is used to run the country.
a voting system based on money will only give the communist more bullet. it also violates the idea of equality.
If you remember, the French Revolution happened for very same reason - the wealthy had too much power.
and it sounds like legalization of bribery to me.

And it's absurb that in a democratic election a 80-year old uneducated person would have the same say with people whose lives depend on sound policies (for example, people of our younger generation - if bad policies are made, we are screwed).
an uneducated 80 yr old granddad may have more wisdom and experience than a highly educated 20 yrs old.

[littlebigone]

I like that term "legalization of bribery". I think it is only fair that an uneducated 80-year-old's vote be counted the same as an educated 20-year-old's. After all policies affect everyone and so everyone has a right to vote for what they want.

[littlebigone]

I like that term "legalization of bribery". I think it is only fair that an uneducated 80-year-old's vote be counted the same as an educated 20-year-old's. After all policies affect everyone and so everyone has a right to vote for what they want.

[wawa]

i think one vote per person is pretty fair.. I mean, who are we to judge who has enough sense to make a good choice?
Some people vote according to their benefit rather than the benefit of the entire country or community.
Rich people would vote so that they get richer and the poor people become poorer :D

[wawa]

i think one vote per person is pretty fair.. I mean, who are we to judge who has enough sense to make a good choice?
Some people vote according to their benefit rather than the benefit of the entire country or community.
Rich people would vote so that they get richer and the poor people become poorer :D

[Diesel]

perwaja? huh, they've been whining about it since mahathir's era. i wonder why our so-called "hero" didn't do anything about it.

[Diesel]

perwaja? huh, they've been whining about it since mahathir's era. i wonder why our so-called "hero" didn't do anything about it.

[trishotiwuth]

Corruption seems to be part and parcel of many south east asian countries...sad, isn't it? I don't think we can completely eliminate corruption. It's too idealistic to think that human beings would one day say No to making easy money.

[trishotiwuth]

Corruption seems to be part and parcel of many south east asian countries...sad, isn't it? I don't think we can completely eliminate corruption. It's too idealistic to think that human beings would one day say No to making easy money.

[Yeogolas]

Our country is save for tourist. But not save for Vip in this country. Many case like Anwar Ibrahim, Vip killed at Sabah. Many case by vip

Must be help for other.......

[Yeogolas]

Our country is save for tourist. But not save for Vip in this country. Many case like Anwar Ibrahim, Vip killed at Sabah. Many case by vip

Must be help for other.......

[hungwei]

maybe we should send these corrupted ppl to NS for as long as the judge decides...hehe

[hungwei]

maybe we should send these corrupted ppl to NS for as long as the judge decides...hehe

[tree007]

i think singapore should serve as a role-model in combating corruption. u dun c any anit-corruption campaigns there (rite? )..'cos i think they fight money with money. as in, they prevent corruption in civil department by paying civil servants good money.. of course, i'm toking about corruption at the low-level, not the big fish yet.. but, that'll be a good place to start... for starters, Singapore's PM is the higest paid premier in the whole world rite? i heard his salary is more than that of Bush's... hehe...

so, if they're so well paid, then why risk bribery?

[tree007]

i think singapore should serve as a role-model in combating corruption. u dun c any anit-corruption campaigns there (rite? )..'cos i think they fight money with money. as in, they prevent corruption in civil department by paying civil servants good money.. of course, i'm toking about corruption at the low-level, not the big fish yet.. but, that'll be a good place to start... for starters, Singapore's PM is the higest paid premier in the whole world rite? i heard his salary is more than that of Bush's... hehe...

so, if they're so well paid, then why risk bribery?

[MarquisX]

i can't believe some Malaysians actually *shocked* by the state of corruption in Malaysia. And i am not surprised that my stateman, Kasitah Gadam got nailed either (he TOTALLY deserve that).

One good example; you are applying an international passport but having difficulties due to the fact that your parents didn't have state's birth certificate (the ICs are valid but parents are born BEFORE the state exists, so no BC). What did the Jabatan Imigresen said,

"Adik memang susah nak dapatkan paspot ni. Tapi, kalau kena harganya, adik mungkin akan dapat paspot adik dalam masa seminggu. "

**What goes around comes around.

[MarquisX]

i can't believe some Malaysians actually *shocked* by the state of corruption in Malaysia. And i am not surprised that my stateman, Kasitah Gadam got nailed either (he TOTALLY deserve that).

One good example; you are applying an international passport but having difficulties due to the fact that your parents didn't have state's birth certificate (the ICs are valid but parents are born BEFORE the state exists, so no BC). What did the Jabatan Imigresen said,

"Adik memang susah nak dapatkan paspot ni. Tapi, kalau kena harganya, adik mungkin akan dapat paspot adik dalam masa seminggu. "

**What goes around comes around.

[chenchow]

MarquisX, report it up to the authority. Go to PM Website or some gov or ACA website and report it up!

Below is the page of Anti Corruption Agency.

http://www.jaring.my/bpr/English/acamain.html

Post any complaint you have on corruption. Include the necessary details.

[chenchow]

MarquisX, report it up to the authority. Go to PM Website or some gov or ACA website and report it up!

Below is the page of Anti Corruption Agency.

http://www.jaring.my/bpr/English/acamain.html

Post any complaint you have on corruption. Include the necessary details.

[Yeogolas]

Relax's bebeh what the nice project if you being a police.

[Yeogolas]

Relax's bebeh what the nice project if you being a police.

[littlebigone]

i think singapore should serve as a role-model in combating corruption. u dun c any anit-corruption campaigns there (rite? )..'cos i think they fight money with money. as in, they prevent corruption in civil department by paying civil servants good money.. of course, i'm toking about corruption at the low-level, not the big fish yet.. but, that'll be a good place to start... for starters, Singapore's PM is the higest paid premier in the whole world rite? i heard his salary is more than that of Bush's... hehe...

so, if they're so well paid, then why risk bribery?

I think everybody has their price...hehehehe

[littlebigone]

i think singapore should serve as a role-model in combating corruption. u dun c any anit-corruption campaigns there (rite? )..'cos i think they fight money with money. as in, they prevent corruption in civil department by paying civil servants good money.. of course, i'm toking about corruption at the low-level, not the big fish yet.. but, that'll be a good place to start... for starters, Singapore's PM is the higest paid premier in the whole world rite? i heard his salary is more than that of Bush's... hehe...

so, if they're so well paid, then why risk bribery?

I think everybody has their price...hehehehe

[chenchow]

Based on the latest survey of expatriate by Political And Economic Risk Consultancy in HK, Malaysia was ranked 6th in Asia Pacific on its corruption level.

The ranking for Asia Pacific is:-
1. Singapore
2. Japan
3. HK
4. Taiwan
5. South Korea
6. Malaysia, China, Thailand
9. Phillipines
10. Vietnam
11. India
12. Indonesia


I still think that we have a long way to go in this case. We should hopefully try our best to be in the top 5 of least corrupted in our region at least by next year. I find the performance of our country still very poor. This is a survey done with about 1000 expatriates.

[chenchow]

Based on the latest survey of expatriate by Political And Economic Risk Consultancy in HK, Malaysia was ranked 6th in Asia Pacific on its corruption level.

The ranking for Asia Pacific is:-
1. Singapore
2. Japan
3. HK
4. Taiwan
5. South Korea
6. Malaysia, China, Thailand
9. Phillipines
10. Vietnam
11. India
12. Indonesia


I still think that we have a long way to go in this case. We should hopefully try our best to be in the top 5 of least corrupted in our region at least by next year. I find the performance of our country still very poor. This is a survey done with about 1000 expatriates.

[luke]

chenchow, are you sure the list is not the other way around ... up till now I've been watching Hindi movies and most of the movies show government officers siding to some bad rich villains after being bribed .. I'm not sure if that is just fiction but if it's based on reality then India should be somewhere on the top of the list ...

[luke]

chenchow, are you sure the list is not the other way around ... up till now I've been watching Hindi movies and most of the movies show government officers siding to some bad rich villains after being bribed .. I'm not sure if that is just fiction but if it's based on reality then India should be somewhere on the top of the list ...

[chenchow]

What I mean is 1st as being most not-corrupted

[chenchow]

What I mean is 1st as being most not-corrupted

[__earth]

i agree with luke. I think that list is about the most transparent govt instead of corrupt. I cmon, Indonesia as the most uncorrupted?

[__earth]

i agree with luke. I think that list is about the most transparent govt instead of corrupt. I cmon, Indonesia as the most uncorrupted?

[wesleyanne]

http://www.rsi.com.sg/english/newsline/view/20040212161111/1/.html

[wesleyanne]

http://www.rsi.com.sg/english/newsline/view/20040212161111/1/.html

[mercsinc]

these people deserve the time that they're getting for what they've done. they've affected so many people with their corruption and what not.

i agree with the idea that we should start with paying the civil servants more. they're the ones helping run the country. so, if they're in the right track, all the others will follow. this reminds me of an old malay saying:

"bapak borek anak rintik (think of it in a positive way)"

:wink:

[mercsinc]

these people deserve the time that they're getting for what they've done. they've affected so many people with their corruption and what not.

i agree with the idea that we should start with paying the civil servants more. they're the ones helping run the country. so, if they're in the right track, all the others will follow. this reminds me of an old malay saying:

"bapak borek anak rintik (think of it in a positive way)"

:wink:

[hungwei]

The only way we can really curb corruption is to make all these ppl realized that they are responsible for everything that has been trusted to them. You see, the more power that one is given, the more likely that he will be lured to be a puppet for someone who wants to abuse that power using money. They should know that many will suffer as a result of their irresponsibility. Unfortunately, humans are slow learners. They are only aware of their mistakes after something bad happened to them.

[hungwei]

The only way we can really curb corruption is to make all these ppl realized that they are responsible for everything that has been trusted to them. You see, the more power that one is given, the more likely that he will be lured to be a puppet for someone who wants to abuse that power using money. They should know that many will suffer as a result of their irresponsibility. Unfortunately, humans are slow learners. They are only aware of their mistakes after something bad happened to them.

[littlebigone]

I think that accepting bribes should be on the same level as treason to the country. I mean if you look at it, the chain-reaction of events is detrimental to the country.

My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

[littlebigone]

I think that accepting bribes should be on the same level as treason to the country. I mean if you look at it, the chain-reaction of events is detrimental to the country.

My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

[mercsinc]

My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

hmm...this is a little extreme but if thats what it takes to set this problem straight, lets give it a try...lol...just kidding...
:P

[mercsinc]

My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

hmm...this is a little extreme but if thats what it takes to set this problem straight, lets give it a try...lol...just kidding...
:P

[topdog]

just a random, late-night thought on corruption...sometimes i wonder if corruption is really that bad. for example here in michigan i got slapped with a speeding ticket which not only cost me 90 bucks...i get charged double for car insurance for the next 2 years! in malaysia, no problem. 30 ringgit, i scratch my back you scratch my back, everybody's happy.

[Panda]

[quote=littlebigone]My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

Hmm.. Too extreme. But in China, curroption do cause death penalty!! Very scary? But the corruption is still so rampent in China. So, don't think is very effective! This is why I say earlier, humans are greedy!!!Greed and fame can cause us to do anything!! :twisted:

[DecentMerson]

[quote=littlebigone]My proposal. Death penalty. While we're at it, maybe we should go after their families too since maybe some people accept bribes to help provide for their families.

Hmm.. Too extreme. But in China, curroption do cause death penalty!! Very scary? But the corruption is still so rampent in China. So, don't think is very effective! This is why I say earlier, humans are greedy!!!Greed and fame can cause us to do anything!! :twisted:

err... only those corruption which involves huge amount of money will be tackled by death penalty... and corruption in China is common but usually in small amount....

check this links out....

http://www.transparency.org/pressreleases_archive/2003/2003.10.07.cpi.en.html

http://www.transparency.org/pressreleases_archive/2004/2004.03.25.gcr_relaunch.html

[chenchow]

I have found a news article in NST regarding the new approach ACA uses to try and educate the young about anti-corruption, where they incorporate the message into songs etc.

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Monday/National/20041213081146/Article/indexb_html

What do you guys think?

[DecentMerson]

I have found a news article in NST regarding the new approach ACA uses to try and educate the young about anti-corruption, where they incorporate the message into songs etc.

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Monday/National/20041213081146/Article/indexb_html

What do you guys think?

i dun think this is a good idea... the problem of corruption is not really on the youngs... it is the current "MAJIKAN".... and if they are not educated about it.... they will be going to keep this "tradition of corruption" going on and on...

songs.... no point... they are not helping when they are not addressing the right group of people... no point punishing the youngs when the problems is not with the them rite?

it doesn't make sense too that it takes them so long to notice that we are not so uncorrupted after all... i wonder how long does it take for them to notice that our country is very corrupted....

[chenchow]

I would say that it should be a multi-pronged action, and the youth is a very essential target group, as this group of people are the ones eventually going to shape the nation. If the youth are not well-educated in ensuring that they would reject all kinds of corruption, the problem would not get to be solved in the long run.

Of course, we need to educate the public, be it the government servants or the general public, as if there is no supply, there would not be any demand. If there is no demand, there would be no supply. So, we need to get our acts right into this.

ACA has been taking quite a lot of actions this year, including bringing more than 300 people into court actions for accepting bribery. Although 300 is a small number, a staggering 10,000 people are being investigated currently. And to bring someone to court, it requires the government to bring up with substantial prove.

So, if anyone has any experience of being asked to give bribe, please contact ACA~! This would help the nation in eradicating this menace. If the public is united in reporting the incidences, call
1-800-88-8844 or 03-88867000 or email info@<hidden> or go to Anti-Corruption Agency Malaysia, 1st - 7th Floor, Block D6,
Federal Government Administrative Center, P.O Box 6000, 62502 Putrajaya, Malaysia and you can write anonymous letter to that address too for ACA to initiate the investigation, if you are afraid to show up.

Or the best way is go to:-
http://www1.jaring.my/bpr/English/acamain.html
Click "Information" and fill up the complaint.

They require as much info on the following aspects:-
Detailed Information on Corruption

Date of incident
Time of incident
Place of incident
Brief account of the incident
Person/witnesses connected in the incident
Relevant documents
Type and amount of gratification
Any other leads such as identification number, car registration number, receipt number etc.

Lets work together to solve this menace. Complaining that there are corruptions happening in Malaysia is not going to help it.

First, we must be 100% sure that we do not condone any corruption, i.e. we must not give any bribe and not receive any bribe. We must ensure that if we hear of any corruption happens, we should strongly encourage or even "force" the person to report it using the methods above.

Second, we must spread the anti-corruption info to others and lets cooperate in solving this menace.

[chenchow]

I just submitted a letter to editor to NST on this issue. Hopefully it would be published. I hope that my little action could create a little more awareness among Malaysians on corruption, even if only 3 or 5 people refrain from giving or receiving bribes after reading it, it would be a success. And if this action is replicated by others, it would mean a lot.

[ElansarGelmir]

I have found a news article in NST regarding the new approach ACA uses to try and educate the young about anti-corruption, where they incorporate the message into songs etc.

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Monday/National/20041213081146/Article/indexb_html

What do you guys think?

i dun think this is a good idea... the problem of corruption is not really on the youngs... it is the current "MAJIKAN".... and if they are not educated about it.... they will be going to keep this "tradition of corruption" going on and on...

songs.... no point... they are not helping when they are not addressing the right group of people... no point punishing the youngs when the problems is not with the them rite?

it doesn't make sense too that it takes them so long to notice that we are not so uncorrupted after all... i wonder how long does it take for them to notice that our country is very corrupted....

Like throwing rubbish on the favorite "Denda RM 500" sign even though moral education has taught them many many times not to litter. Quote my high school moral teacher, "Aku ajar moral, tapi tidak amalkan."

Quote me: "Aku belajar moral, tapi tidak amalkan."

[chenchow]

Hence, my proposition would be that we should take action, and not merely educate or claiming that a certain problem is serious.

If we are serious to help solve corruption problem, we should take the lead in bringing issues to ACA. If we are serious in combating against taxi drivers that cheat passengers, we should report those cases to the authority and boycott the particular taxi drivers. I would say that if say we get cheated by a particular taxi driver, say ABC 1234, we can just write to media, saying that a cab with licence plate ABC 1234 is cheating, I am sure that cab driver would get boycotted by the public and this will teach a serious lesson to other taxi drivers never to cheat.

On the throwing rubbish on "Denda RM500 Sign", it is very sad that this is happening.

Quote ElansarGelmir "Aku belajar moral, tapi tidak amalkan", the question is why you choose not to amal the right moral when you know that is right.

[ElansarGelmir]

Hence, my proposition would be that we should take action, and not merely educate or claiming that a certain problem is serious.

If we are serious to help solve corruption problem, we should take the lead in bringing issues to ACA. If we are serious in combating against taxi drivers that cheat passengers, we should report those cases to the authority and boycott the particular taxi drivers. I would say that if say we get cheated by a particular taxi driver, say ABC 1234, we can just write to media, saying that a cab with licence plate ABC 1234 is cheating, I am sure that cab driver would get boycotted by the public and this will teach a serious lesson to other taxi drivers never to cheat.

On the throwing rubbish on "Denda RM500 Sign", it is very sad that this is happening.

Quote ElansarGelmir "Aku belajar moral, tapi tidak amalkan", the question is why you choose not to amal the right moral when you know that is right.

Wait wait... I was just being sacarstic (ok, that didn't work)... :wink:

Hehehe!

[Jia_Hong]

Yes, corruption is one of the worst menace for a nation.

Look at the current surveys on Indonesia. I had a bad impression when I stepped down the Jakarta airport - I had to bribe the immigration office because I can show my return ticket (and I'm not obliged to show anyways...was on a rush), have about 5 toll stations before reaching the Jakarta city (nothing related to corruption - but more towards ineffeciency of the government - for example, we are doing the same for our monorail-PUTRA-STAR systems)...

Check out the recent survey on Indonesia in Economist. There is an article about the corruption - and you realise how much more we need to go to compare with the governance of Singapore, Finland...

Even in 'noble' institutions: education-related/discipline-oriented (yes - those uniform bodies) have corruption. If the 'teachers' of the youth can't show a good example, how can we expect a good future free of corruption?

[weich]

hmm...i think corruption cannot be solved overnight...so u gotta be patient with it....

I think it's moving in the right direction now...with more corruption cases being brought up, it's a very obvious move to warn the big-wigs....but notice the fact is that to take the big fishes on in such cases could be political suicide isn't it?

Also, the 'small' fishes' situation is a bit difficult too isn't it? Let's say if all your colleagues accept bribes...and you're the only 1 that don't...& they all don't get caught doing it...would u be tempted to wonder if your integrity has served any purpose? Of course, at this stage when we're not working & have less worries like kids, family, etc.....it would be easy to say NO.....but I wonder about later...

Anyway, how do you define corruption?

Now, lotsa ppl "bribe" in different ways....

Would helping your sons/daughters/nephews/nieces to get businesses and becoming partners considered corruption? Would a hamper on Hari Raya/CNY/X'mas considered one as well? And there's lots of other action which may or may not be considered corruption....

[DecentMerson]

i think according to law... there are definitions for uniform forces in accepting gifts and even a lunch.... abt how much the lunch shld not be ....

while for personal business... it is up to others interpretation... just like our ex PM giving out nice timber and stuff...

for giving hamper.... if it is an ordinary gift hamper.... which most companies exhange during festive season... i dun think it can be considered as bribery... but if the hamper contains cash incentive and other money like incentive, then, it is considered as bribery....

anybody in law know about these??

I think it's moving in the right direction now...with more corruption cases being brought up, it's a very obvious move to warn the big-wigs....but notice the fact is that to take the big fishes on in such cases could be political suicide isn't it?

this is the problem that we are facing....the ACA is afraid to take the big fishes to the court.... and even our political leaders are trying to threaten the ACA.... well done... Mr. Samy... keep up the good work.....

Also, the 'small' fishes' situation is a bit difficult too isn't it? Let's say if all your colleagues accept bribes...and you're the only 1 that don't...& they all don't get caught doing it...would u be tempted to wonder if your integrity has served any purpose? Of course, at this stage when we're not working & have less worries like kids, family, etc.....it would be easy to say NO.....but I wonder about later...
not getting caught doesn't make accepting and giving bribery something legal to practice.... it is true that it is very tempting... just pray hard that u won't be framed even if u are not accepting any bribery... it's a dog-eat-dog world...

[Jia_Hong]

Bribery in terms of gift. I think we can put it this way::

- a bribe is when a person is been required to give something so that he can get something in return or favour - in which, according to law - he should be getting the 'something' or whatever services without the gift/ money etc.

- if a person receive a gift (or let's call it 'bribe'), in which he is pressured or persuaded to return an act whereby favouritism (or doing) is required; then he is considered being bribed.

Eventually it ends up with whether is 'persuasion' involved is in terms of gift/ money/ or anything material.

In fact, bribery (or favour money) sometimes it's pretty scary that it involves kids. For instance, some businessman when they visit another businessman - the angpow that they give to the kids generally relates to the level of interest/ favour between each other. (so much for the kid to say:"oh yeah!! I got 1000 ringgit ang pao!!!"...but the truth is the person giving the angpao is saying: hey, I'm giving u 1000 bucks, get it done)

In this society today, there are so much to read between the lines - and to play smart - we can't totally stick to the ground and say:"I'm not going to do any favour or accept any favour".

It's just how bad it can be, as political theorists said: all human are political animals, selfish but chained to the social contract.

[tempe]

[quote="weich"]hmm...i think corruption cannot be solved overnight...so u gotta be patient with it....

Yea? corruption had being practise since the earlier civilization?. No matter from east or the west?? to some people it is nothing wrong coz to them it just a culture?? when you want something from me?.. you have to pay the price?..

Maybe we all too na?ve to hope tat others people will just do their job and responsibility as according to their company customer service?.

like for example; what would you do if u encounters this situation:
1. you are public servant and you really need some $$$ for your family interest n you had no others sources to get it?.. then come some one and tell you ?tolong la Encik? and give you some hint; tell me what will you do while you desperately need $$$.... (end up you will get used to get this easy $$$)

2. you are public people that being summon by the authority for some silly offence?. While you want to settle the summon?. Somebody offer you to settle it for about half of the $$$ only?. What will you do if you can save the money (don tell me you hate $$$)

so whatever your answer? you know best; and if you want to eliminate corruption in short period ?. Well?. you are day dreaming!

Don?t misjudge me?. I do hate bribery!

[digimushu]

on a side note...

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Tuesday/NewsBreak/20050201161559/Article/indexb_html

Pahang police beating bribery with reward scheme


...
the incentive has been automatically given to those offered with bribe of less than RM200, while those offered with more than that would be rewarded on case-to-case basis.

"For instance, if a policeman arrest someone offering him RM50, we will reward him with RM100...

[el_empty]

prisoner's dilemma:

if the cop takes the bribe and doesn't arrest the dude - both are happy.

if the cop arrests the dude who bribed, the cop's happier, the dude's screwed.

if the cop asks for a bribe, and the dude reports it, the cop's screwed, the dude's happier.

if the dude bribes, and the cop takes it, and both get caught, they're both screwed.

-- i dont' see how this scheme is going to work.

[digimushu]

if the cop arrests the dude who bribed, the cop's happier, the dude's screwed.


Pardon my ignorance, isn't this the point?

[theT]

if you ask me about this issue back when I was in middle school, I would agree with most of you.

But before 'fighting' bribery, I think we should understand why it happens. Get first person point of view.

Sometimes, you need a push for that extra mile. That's why you bribe the person to let you get the post, or job or anything. You won't regret about it. Coz you work hard for it. And to secure your position, sometimes you gotta do what is thought as unethical.

And sometimes, you agree to pay it because you don't wanna deal with a lot of hassle. I know my next example doesnt apply to most people here, but just consider.

You and your friend were caught by some police for 'berkhalwat', which was not true. Your friend try to provoke the police, and the police insist of doing a search in your car. Suddenly they found weed, which belong to another friend of you.

You have to option there. To face the charge for khalwat & possesing illicit drug. Or they give you an offer to pay some amount of money. They might be greedy and insist of RM10, 000. But if you surrender, you will have to pay more than that. You can offer lower price with the police. But if you take it to court, only god knows how much you time, energy, money you will waste.

Don't get me wrong, I hate this stuff more than anybody else.

[Thirdshifter]

the best way to curb bribery is to make people who deal with bribery be paid enough that taking a bribe will see to be risky.

Pay the police better. I think if they can get about 3-4K a month it would definately make them less likely to take bribes.

[DecentMerson]

the best way to curb bribery is to make people who deal with bribery be paid enough that taking a bribe will see to be risky.

Pay the police better. I think if they can get about 3-4K a month it would definately make them less likely to take bribes.

I concur...... that's how Singapore and HK police forces are much less corrupted. With higher pay, and much stricter law and ENFORCEMENT..., ppl tend to avoid taking bribe becoz it is not worth the risk.

As far as I know, a cop (fairly ranked) in HK can earn about HK $10k ... which is considerably high paid job.... as compared to an office job...

[qedx]

if the cop arrests the dude who bribed, the cop's happier, the dude's screwed.


Pardon my ignorance, isn't this the point?
i thought the point was to stop bribery altogether...

[el_empty]

if the cop arrests the dude who bribed, the cop's happier, the dude's screwed.


Pardon my ignorance, isn't this the point?

oop didn't explain properly

if the dude's arrested, how will the cop proof the dude's crime? we give the copy the benefit of the doubt? then conversely, the cop can choose to screw the dude over by claiming to have been bribed. does that solve the problem?

i really should start sleeping...

[qedx]

i guess it really is a case of the dude's word against the cop's word or fists or feet or cota...

sorry, but learning to trust cops is not very high on my priorities list heh.

[Thirdshifter]

if the cop arrests the dude who bribed, the cop's happier, the dude's screwed.


Pardon my ignorance, isn't this the point?

oop didn't explain properly

if the dude's arrested, how will the cop proof the dude's crime? we give the copy the benefit of the doubt? then conversely, the cop can choose to screw the dude over by claiming to have been bribed. does that solve the problem?

i really should start sleeping...

Thats why in USA whenever an officer is writing a ticket there should be another officer present as the witness. If not, if you contest the ticket and the officer was by himself the case gets thrown out just like that. Sort of like in Islam where there have to be atleast 4 witnesses..

Installing cameras on patrol cars is also needed.

There's many things that need to be revamped in the way our law is being enforced. As it is right now, the citizens could easily get framed for anything.

[sabishii]

Installing cameras on patrol cars is also needed.


I think that wouldn't really help at all, it's easy to find angles where the camera couldn't see or the police could intentionally park the car such that the camera wouldn't be able to see what he's going to do. humans are cunningly smart. :) besides, it would cost the government loads of money to do that, and in the process, more bribes would be used by contractors who wants the jobs.

there's no easy way of solving thing, takes lots of education and change of mentality. like in Japan, a police taking bribe is considered as highly immoral and he would be looked down by his collegues. the social pressure is one of the strongest mechanism used to govern human behavior.

the approaches our government are taking now is still not solving the root of the problem, it'll only force them to think of smarter, more advanced techniques to accept bribes. :(

[Ryosuke]

What i will say is Corruption is so hard to get over with...
Paying more to the government workers may be preventing CORUPTION from happening but its hard...

Nowadays say a process to apply for a permit or what ever stuff had to be through the Government Office and it usually takes ages for them to complete them..... What happens next ? The people got the idea if i give the officer some PRESENT may be he can speed up my application......

Where as for Big Powers, It would be harder they should serve as the role model but they dont.... They simply do have the opportunity to involve in CORRUPTION and mostly they are too smart however "Sepandai-pandai tupai melompat, akhirnya jatuh ke tanah juga" but it usually take ages ..... Sigh i dunno if i got the idioms correct lolz

beside some of the big powers, BPR cannot check their account if i am not mistaken cause its like they are you know being protected or something... but The PM is doing a good job at the moment lets hope it stays forever

Its just my point of view... Everyone got the nature to bribe honestly....

[zqax]

Hang those who have been founded corrupt in the pasar!!!!
Scared away corruption from our motherland!

[pringles]

What would you do if you have 100 million? Recently, it is reported that our parliament repair cost about 1 billion ringgit. 1 BILLION ringgit!!! How many aditional students can be sent to UK to study medicine by JPA?? 200. How many mercedes E-class can you buy?

And ridiculously, the repair which cost 80million ringgit can't even hold durimg a rainy day. Parliament debate has to be postponed because of water leaking. Does it mean that we cannot have parliament debate from November to March which is a rainy season?

I don't mind if our country is very rich and is not recovering from economy depression(we still pack our currency) and there will be no water leaking after the repair. But the opposite happens.

[jackfook]

I do not think the corruption in Malaysia will decrease.Although there were a few people were sued for corruption after the new Prime Minister want to solve corruption before 2020,he still face problems as he fights corruption by himself while the others notice nothing.This campaign needs cooperation from whole Malaysia in order to reach the stage of zero corruption.

[jackfook]

Mr Lee Kuan Yew suggested that paying more salary to public service workers can reduce corruption but our PM disagree with it as people would involve in this dishonest activities if he or she intends to do so regardless high salary for them.My opinion is increasing salary is one way to overcome this problem.
Why I say so?The police,soldiers,and firemen are getting low salary which are hardly to afford their home financial.The only way to increase home income is doing part time jobs.The economy of Malaysia seems not very good and everything hikes.What are they going to do?Is it getting money faster by doing such dishonest activities rather than suffering part time jobs? What do you think for this solution?

[Salvation]

Have to agree, their wages are too low, cannot live a dignified life without earning kopi duit. (as I mentioned before, basic salery of a warden is around RM550, come on, still living in the 1980s ? )

[yen_05]

I do not think the corruption in Malaysia will decrease.Although there were a few people were sued for corruption after the new Prime Minister want to solve corruption before 2020,he still face problems as he fights corruption by himself while the others notice nothing.This campaign needs cooperation from whole Malaysia in order to reach the stage of zero corruption.

I believed that this anti-corruption campaign will help to decrease corruption in Malaysia but it is a bit impossilble to reach the level of zero corruption. With the "red-tape habit" or known as "karenah birokrasi" going on in most government firm, corruption indeed will not end. It takes time for an application to be approved by the government as the documents go from one table to another as well as going from one officer to the other. What if the application is really urgent? Who will not be frustrated when they have to wait months before their application for something to be considered? That is why people tend to involve in corruption in order to get things done in a short period of time. Why not change the attitude of civil workers first??
Just some opinion and comments on it after learning PA from my teacher who is a lecturer in the political field... :)

[jackfook]

yen05wrote:
I believed that this anti-corruption campaign will help to decrease corruption in Malaysia but it is a bit impossilble to reach the level of zero corruption. With the "red-tape habit" or known as "karenah birokrasi" going on in most government firm, corruption indeed will not end. It takes time for an application to be approved by the government as the documents go from one table to another as well as going from one officer to the other. What if the application is really urgent? Who will not be frustrated when they have to wait months before their application for something to be considered? That is why people tend to involve in corruption in order to get things done in a short period of time. Why not change the attitude of civil workers first??

I agree with changing behaviour of local civil workers.However,it is easy to say but difficult to do it. Our former PM,Tun Mahathir advised civil workers to change their bad habit for many times and they noticed nothing.There are too many civil workers in Malaysia!

[jackfook]

It is not easy to make people realize of their responsibility especially people who have money and political power.They can use their power to get money faster as the relevant department does not take legal action against them.Enforcement power is more important and play a vital role to curb corruption.Anti-Corruption Departmant should be given more enforcement power in order to fight corruption effectively.Anti Corruption Department should be an independent derpartment like ICAC in Hong Kong who can investigate suspicious people without disturbance of other political power.The department only reports corruption cases in Parliament but not a person who has vital power in politic before charging a person to help in investigation.I do not think such department is independent in Malaysia because it is still influenced by other political power.

[coolstudy]

The top problems in Malaysia are corruption, corruption and corruption. Get rid of corruption you get rid of all the problems associated with it.

Corruption can be broadly defined as the misuse of public office for private gain. Abuses by government officials such as embezzlement and nepotism, as well as abuses in bribery, extortion, fraud and influence peddling.

The effects of corruption:

1. Corruption in elections and legislative bodies reduces accountability and representation

2. Corruption in the judiciary suspends the rule of law

3. Corruption in public administration results in unequal provision of services

4. Corruption in selecting or promoting officials without regard to performance will stifle progress

5. Corruption siphons off the resources needed for development

6. Corruption undermines democracy and good governance

7. Corruption undermines democratic values in trust and tolerance

8. Corruption undermines the legitimacy of government

9. Corruption undermines national economic development

10. Corruption weakens government institutions by disregarding official procedures

Corruption generates economic distortions in public sector by pulling investment from essential projects such as education, health care and low cost housing into projects where bribes and kickbacks are more plentiful.

Corruption lowers compliance with construction, environment, or other regulations.

Quality of government services are reduced due to inefficiency as the result of corruption, thus budgetary pressures on government increases and ultimately, the citizens foot the bill and are denied the share of the national resources as well.

In the public sector, corruption undermines economic development. In private sector, corruption increases the cost of business and stifles healthy competition.

Corruption shield companies with connections from fair competition, thus making our country less efficient and less competitive in the global market.

[iQing]

I think our country economy is not doing well and the standard of living is getting higher but the salary is still the same.

Have we voted for the right leaders?

[youngyew]

I don't mind if our country is very rich and is not recovering from economy depression(we still pack our currency) and there will be no water leaking after the repair. But the opposite happens.
A bit out of topic here.. just a little correction, the correct term would be peg our currency, not pack. :P

[youngyew]

I do not think the corruption in Malaysia will decrease.Although there were a few people were sued for corruption after the new Prime Minister want to solve corruption before 2020,he still face problems as he fights corruption by himself while the others notice nothing.This campaign needs cooperation from whole Malaysia in order to reach the stage of zero corruption.

I believed that this anti-corruption campaign will help to decrease corruption in Malaysia but it is a bit impossilble to reach the level of zero corruption. With the "red-tape habit" or known as "karenah birokrasi" going on in most government firm, corruption indeed will not end. It takes time for an application to be approved by the government as the documents go from one table to another as well as going from one officer to the other. What if the application is really urgent? Who will not be frustrated when they have to wait months before their application for something to be considered? That is why people tend to involve in corruption in order to get things done in a short period of time. Why not change the attitude of civil workers first??
Just some opinion and comments on it after learning PA from my teacher who is a lecturer in the political field... :)
Just a clarification: Is red-tape a type of corruption? All the while I thought corruption means a misconduct in terms of doing actions based on monetary or other rewards.

[Randomphantom]

Red tape isn't a type of corruption, however I infer from yen05's post that he claims red tape causes corruption to happen. I don't think thats the main reason for corruption though.

Wonder how is the anticorruption campaign as proclaimed by Abdullah is going nowadays - any new fall guy?

[youngyew]

From a redundant thread (http://recom.org/modules.php?name=Forums&file=viewtopic&t=2752).
corruption..history shows that corruption can lead government to nothing and ended with fall of government...malacca dynasty has showed it...for the latest information,tan sri isa has been questioned umno disciplinary board about his wrong doing during umno party elections last year...the question is,government hasn't put in effort to put down corruption,am i correct?
I think they are doing something.. maybe not much yet.. it takes a lot of time of course.. as long as they're doing something about it (and try to be as transparent as possible) i think we should support the effort..

but if they do nothing.. they will/should go down

[taufiq]

I was not aware that there was already a forum discussing about this issue.. and my opinion is still the same.. hope everything will work out well soon and people's money will not go into one person's pocket only

[iQing]

here is another H joke from http://hokkienlang.blogsome.com/






Haha, Ah Lun koh hor ma ta saman. Yi sibeh sueh eh ler, huah chia beh hiao huah hor hor, song song tiok hor ma ta orr kong. Wa, Ah Peng ka Ah Lun ai ki jiak dim sum (hee kang boh jio yi jiak, yi tulan), yi huah sibeh kin. Ah Lun macam sibeh ku boh jiak dim sum liao, macam jin high anneh kuan. Kanneh. Dim sum nia mah.

Ma ta : ?Tadi u tao u pandu berapa pantas??

Ah Lun : ?Tak pantas leh Bang, 80 saja.?

Limpeh : ?Oi Ah Lun, puek chap jin kin liao leh. An cua lu annneh gong??

Ma ta : ?? Apa kau cakap??

Limpeh : ?Oh, tadak tadak??

Ma ta : ?U jangan cuba tipu saya ah! Saya tao u pandu melebihi had tadi. Mana IC??

Limpeh : ?Aiyo, bang, gua tak arak cuba tipu lu ler? lu pakai ini macam kelip kelip pya uniform gua takut ler??

Ah Lun : ?Eh, mai ka yi kuai lan ler??

Ma ta : ?Apa lu cakap??

Ah Lun : ?Er? tadak tadak??

Ah Peng : ?Mai ka yi sih suah kong wueh lar. Wa patt tor sibeh yiow liao.?

Ma ta : ?Oi, ini amaran terakhir! Jangan kao cuba tipu aku!?

Limpeh : ?Eh, yi tulan liao.?

Ma ta : ?Lu mau bagi I lu punya IC tak?! Aku ni tak ada masa mau sembang dengan u!?

Limpeh : ?Nah, Lun. Hor yi gor chap kor settle.?

Ah Lun : ?Bang, ini? sedikit hadiah? untuk keluarga? ? ?

Limpeh : ?HAIYAH. Bang! Ini boleh settle??

Ma ta : ?Mm. Jalan.?

[crosshatched]

+ bad la that chinese, bribe the officer

- bad la that malay officer, accept the bribe from that chinese

:wink:

[iQing]

it is quite common.

do you remember how you get your driving lecense?

[digimushu]

A sidetrack...

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Thursday/Columns/20050707075223/Article/indexb_html



A candidate vying for a senior position, for example, would have more than one campaign manager to do the legwork and courier?s job. Some had up to 20, each assigned to cover specific party divisions (usually according to geographical areas).

For instance, a campaign manager assigned to cover all 24 divisions in Perak would start by identifying the delegates representing these divisions at the voting assembly. Once this was done, the wooing would begin.

The money to be spent would usually come from sponsors (mainly businessmen) who would remain in the background. These were people who were either looking for future gains by backing a certain politician, or who were simply paying back this certain politician for gains they had already accrued.

It is understood there would be "several rounds" of wooing in the short period preceding the election, the amount of money spent increasing on each occasion.

A head-count assessment would then be made and through this exercise, the campaign managers would rank their bosses? chances by giving the odds against the other contestants.

If the odds were dropping, the campaign managers would redouble their efforts and more money would be pumped in by the sponsors.






Former Umno supreme council member Datuk Paduka Ibrahim Ali, in his weirdly-titled book Dilema Neraca Retak (Dilemma of a Cracked Balance) says it costs between RM30,000 and RM50,000 to be division chief and much much more to be elected to the supreme council or a vice-presidency.

The widespread use of money in the elections has made some people cynical. One of them is the party?s former deputy president, Tun Ghafar Baba, who said recently that the way things were going, Umno might as well introduce a tender system for its positions. He said tenders for division chief, for instance, could start at a reserve price of RM50,000.



If even the leaders we elect are buying their way up...there is no tellin ghow high the corruption goes.
*whistling*

[digimushu]

an interesting read:

http://www.corrupted-malaysia.blogspot.com/

...What started out as a regular night out will turn into something ugly. Where the two of us and two dozen others will be detained, hand cuffed, jailed, degraded, stripped of clothing, extorted and shamed. This will be a story of corruption and of police mishandling...

I have had my share of extortions by the men in blue in their kancil as well. Judging by this story...things have only gone from bad to worse...

[digimushu]

No opinions on this?

[DecentMerson]

an interesting read:

http://www.corrupted-malaysia.blogspot.com/

...What started out as a regular night out will turn into something ugly. Where the two of us and two dozen others will be detained, hand cuffed, jailed, degraded, stripped of clothing, extorted and shamed. This will be a story of corruption and of police mishandling...

I have had my share of extortions by the men in blue in their kancil as well. Judging by this story...things have only gone from bad to worse...

a fren's fren of mine is involved in this too... and i came across this @<hidden> Malaysiakini
http://www.malaysiakini.com/opinionsfeatures/41813

i wonder what's worse... politicians not recognizing the corruptions or people numb of the corruptions

and what rights do one have when he/she is detained by the police... and I wonder whether the police know their rights?

We were later told to sign a document. When I tried to read the document, I was told off by a policeman. ?No need to read the document,? he said. ?Just sign!?

and, corruptions have been rooted in the system, as, they are doing it with such 'pride'...

We were placed in the prison yard and made to sit in rows of three. We had not eaten or drank since last night, but we were not hungry. Then a policeman showed up, a good ?samaritan?. He offered us some bread and water and proceeded to collect RM10 from all of us.

Not only did we have to bribe them for food, but a single phone call cost RM150, which must be paid by the visiting relative or friend. Jack got away with RM50, supposedly credited to the policeman?s pre-paid line by his mother. Somehow the policeman missed it and even dared to SMS Jack?s mother after we got out, asking ?where?s the money?. Not only was it daylight robbery, it was daring and I guess he must have felt invincible while wearing the police badge.

Are we going to be protected by such people? I'm really afraid...

My parents always tell me not to go to such places(bars and all), because there are 'bad people'... but back then, i think the term 'bad people' refers to robbers, gangsters, and drug pushers... now, i think i have to be careful of another group... corrupted policemen... they are bolder, fiercer and worse, they are armed...

[gonjeng]

the question now is, knowing that these policemen are corrupted, what can we, as the citizens do? i have ideas, which are, IMO, theoretically okay but not practically. it would be nice if ACA (anti-corruption agency) put up sth like a reward thingie for those who send info to them about corrupted government agents, be it MPs or down to policemen. obviously, some proofs are required. for this, maybe each of us can go around mesia with a tape recorder and whenever 'shit' happens, we deal with these corrupted guys with the recorder being switched on...

but then again, i do not see that the problems are with the policemen and politicians, but with the citizens also. some of us (mesians) say we do not condone bribery, but we bribe to get our driving license, we bribe to get away from traffic offenses and we bribe MPs to get tenders, projects...

assuming pak lah is doing what he promised he will be doing (fight corruption), he can only takes care a few top-level corrupt craps. it is up to us to somehow 'take care' the corruption that happens at the low level.

first step in solving a problem is to recognize there is a problem. i would say, amongst us citizens, we have passed this stage (although some, if not most, politicians may deny this). the next step is to come up with the solutions... which i said earlier, rather hard... any ideas???

[budakkerek]

well, accrdg to my PS experience, fr the conversations i got, the cops will come n they tell the ppl, ok today i want this much cd, this much money or sthg like dat. if u cant gv it to them, u hv to pay la to make up for the difference in the amount.

or, they would come n point, "i want this, this this," and they would take the CDs or DVDs as 'gifts', without paying. So the sellers would hv to pay the cost themselves la. They dun like it also, but they hv to comply with it, if not, in the future if they got into trouble, they got no 'org dalam to help them.' Same goes for DBKL officers.

One time, i went out w my bf (my ex now), and 3 of his frenss. We went for supper, then went on to Subang, to watch the race la. Normal la, saturday nite. Went to PJ to makan, at one mamak restaurant there, then came back about 4 am, to the restaurant we went earlier coz one of his friends left his car there. Then, we were juz about to leave la when 2 police officers came on motocycles,

i was asleep at the time, coz it was so late, and very tired whole day went out. then when i woke up, i saw the policeman peering into the car, and start to ask questions la

Where we're going,
whr were we fr,
what r we doing at this time of the night,
why we r out so late.

To all these questions, my bf's fren told him,
we're going back to cheras
fr PJ
juz go out for mkn

he seemed to very suspicious of us, and then he started asking, "hv u guys been drinking" (which i found to be very offensive.)
They said no, but my ex said, "Not yet. nak balik minum la nih."
which got the cop angry i guess.
then, he asked for our ICs and asked us to get out of the car.

All of the guys were chinese, i was the only Malay. I could get into trouble and they could get into trouble as well, for taking me out so late at night.

my ex's dad is someone with 'access', so he mmg never scared when he has to deal w police etc. Then the cop took our ICs etc, then my x said, "look at it properly", coz beside his IC is the name of his 'access' (contact la). Then the police asked him,"u ingat saya takut ke? U ingat kita tak boleh bwk you masuk ke?"

then my x answered, "no, i'm juz asking you to tengok betul betul."

he pissed the cops off. His frens were talking to him in Chinese, dat he shudnt be talking to them in such a way. he told them, dat he has nothing to be afraid of, that he is innocent, why shud he be afraid. I felt very annoyed and pissed me off with what the police officers were doing, a blatant misuse of power.

Anyway, the cops took our ICs, i gv my Uni card instead. and they contacted the main police station, then they discussed sthg, then they returned our ICs back.

i was quite shaken by the experience, bzoa my flight back to Oz was later that day Sunday, 3pm. If we were arrested, that would mean i'll be in deep shit, coz new sem starts the next day.

i was in the police cadet platoon before when i was in school. I used to hv very high respect for police officers, but now that i've known how they work, i feel so terribly dissapointed and wish sthg can be done so we can trust them again.

anyway, my 2 cents.

[Penny]

I had an unpleasant encounter with 2 policemen today.

It's gonna be Raya tomorrow.
Everyone knows that we have to be extracareful when this kind of festival is coming.
We know very well that police will be out to 'cari makan', don't we?

As we drove out frm the public library today (the one in Seberang Perai), we went into a road, which is claimed to be "One Way".
Right at the end stood 2 policemen, they stopped all the coming cars. There were 5 cars in a row, included ours, 2 cars.

One police collected the drivers' IC and license. We asked politely, "Ya, encik?" He said, "Ini One Way, tak boleh keluar sini." And he proceeded to the 3rd car. We waited in the car, and the other police came. We asked, "Encik, kami tak nampak ada sign board?" He said, pointed towards another far end, "Ada, tu, sana, bawah pokok tu."

So we got out of the car. We saw the 3rd driver got out of his car and approached the first police, whilst we're trying to beg for pardon frm the 2nd police. After a while, we saw the 3rd driver got into his car, and he made an u-turn, and he left!
Then, I saw the police spoke to the 4th driver. Guess what? The 4th driver gave him a piece of RM 10 note, and he left.

We continued talking to the police. His attitude was bad.
My friend raised her voice asking, "Kenapa 2 kereta itu boleh pergi?"
I guess so he was kinda annoyed as we questioned his authority.
He simply said, "2 kereta tu, nanti saya pi rekod sana."
My friend asked again, "Kenapa mereka boleh pergi?"
He said, "Jangan cakap banyak! Sign sini!"

He wrote the number plate wrongly, I told him about that.
He said, "Tak apa, tak apa.. Pi bayar dah, jangan cakap banyak!"

I didn't understand the words he wrote no the summon that he issued, I asked about it.
He said, "Jangan tanya banyak!"

I asked some questions and he refused to answer.
Perhaps my questions were silly :p
I've never seen how a summon is like.
I asked him, "Encik, macam ni kami kena bayar berapa?"
It's not stated there.
It wrote things like, so and so is demanded to go to the majistreet court and blah blah blah.
I didn't understand the handwritings. I am not sure if it's date/time.
He said, "Jangan cakap banyak sini, pi makahmah cakap."

So I said, "Encik, ini kali pertama kami kena. Kali pertama kan amaran saja?"
(Frankly, I'm not sure if the kali pertama is amaran only, my friend told me so.)
He said, "Okay la, amaran lah! Pi bayar sana."
He took back both the summons, and we didn't understand what does the 'pi bayar sana' mean.
Was he trying to give us a hint to 'rasuah'?
My friends thought so.
Anyways I refused to.
We were discussing among ourselves. After a while, both the police left.
So we're left with no summons. And I don't know what's the consequence. Many said if they took back the summon, means nothing already lar.
We'll see.

As we left, we drove to the junction. So well, there's a "No Entry" sign on the right side of the road. We got off the car, and saw another "No Entry" sign in the drain, on the left hand side.
Well well well, as I driver, I don't normally pay attention to the sign boards on the right hand side. Now I know I have to.

I'm okay being summoned.
I admit it's our fault to go into a 'One Way' lane.
Summon, so be it.

But I can't stand their attitudes.
And it's so obvious that they were out to 'cari makan'.
Shameful!

Malaysians, can we do something about it?

PS: I did write down both the names and 'codes' of the police. Can I launch a report or whatsoever? Hrm... :P

[jackfook]

Penny,you did the right thing by refusing to sign any documents before knowing the reasons of being caught.As we have studied Pengajian Am,police have to tell the reasons to the persons they detain as fast as possible.The police you had mentioned seemed reluctantly to so.It means that they are looking for excuses to obtain bribe.Actually you can complain to the police station nearby regarding their attitude.

You are right.Malayisan are shameful of having police like them.Why the other drivers can be released easily?You know it.
Again,the quetion of corruption arises,the government put a lot of effort to eliminate this ill.However,corruption becomes one of Malaysian culture.BPR or Anti corruption agency is a white elephant.
What does this matter imply?How much the people support our Prime Minister to fight against corruption?

[lotus]

Hi Penny, not to worry. If they took back that piece of 'summons' it means no summons for you. You are "rewarded/pardoned" for your courage on insisting clarification.

Once I turned into a road crossing double white lines, somewhere in Damansara Uptown, the road fronting Kedai Telekom. Somehow, I did not realise it as I saw cars before me doing the same. It was a crazy place with cars double-parking and the speed reduced to a slow crawl. Soon, as I drove along some policemen appeared in front of me and flagged me to double park at a space in front.

I'm really hopeless at parking. Tried as I would, I could not manage to get into the spot indicated. Two policemen were seen talking to the drivers who were caught and had parked their vehicles. One of them moved up to me, and asked for my IC and license. I almost died of fear then as I realised that I had forgotten my purse (with my IC & license)when I changed my bag! So I explained the situation. The policeman told me in not many words that it was a serious 'triple' offence and asked me how would I want to settle it. I replied innocently that I would phone my mum nearby to send my documents.

Meanwhile, the irate drivers behind were honking at me and it was quite a din. The policeman tried directing me to help me to park. I fumbled again and again and suddenly he just waved me to go! I was pleasantly surprised. I told my friends that I was lucky that he pitied me and gave me a chance. Everybody else who heard my story insisted that he rather lose me "one customer" then building up the traffic alerting the rest of the would be 'customers'. Cynical or what?