Iraq Shi'ites Say Late Polls Will Lead to Violence

[qedx]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=586&e=2&u=/nm/20040212/wl_nm/iraq_shiites_dc

for people who profess to uphold democracy, its pretty hard to deny the iraqis what they want neh? do comment on this please :P

[qedx]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=586&e=2&u=/nm/20040212/wl_nm/iraq_shiites_dc

for people who profess to uphold democracy, its pretty hard to deny the iraqis what they want neh? do comment on this please :P

[Thirdshifter]

It's stupid how the western media is trying to potray Islam as heavily divided to two sects. Sunni and Shia.

First of all Saddam Goverment wasn't an Islamic one either. How are these Shi'tes getting oppressed? The only thing i know Saddam did was to disallow people from Walking 300 miles to the Najaf city on barefoot.

Also he disallowed self inflicted body mutilation during one the shi'ites rituals honoring Ali, the Son in law of Muhammad.

As far i'm concerned Saddam was secular.

Also i think the Iraqi aren't ready for a take over. They are in deep poop and need everyone to help them. I say at least 2 years in an interim goverment would be good.

[Thirdshifter]

It's stupid how the western media is trying to potray Islam as heavily divided to two sects. Sunni and Shia.

First of all Saddam Goverment wasn't an Islamic one either. How are these Shi'tes getting oppressed? The only thing i know Saddam did was to disallow people from Walking 300 miles to the Najaf city on barefoot.

Also he disallowed self inflicted body mutilation during one the shi'ites rituals honoring Ali, the Son in law of Muhammad.

As far i'm concerned Saddam was secular.

Also i think the Iraqi aren't ready for a take over. They are in deep poop and need everyone to help them. I say at least 2 years in an interim goverment would be good.

[aquila]

Well, the truth is there is a lot of sectarian violence in Iraq. Although Saddam was secular, he favored the Sunnis and disempowered the Shiites. That's why there's a lot of ill will right now in Iraq.

I would like to see Iraqis of all sects (Shiite, Sunni and Kurd) unite on a common front to fight terrorists who are trying to create chaos in the fragile country. Bombing innocent civillians is not the answer. I have no idea what the fundamentalists are thinking. Besides. most of the suicide bombers are foreigners and not Iraqis themselves. So the trouble comes from outside, people who clearly have no idea and don't care about what's happening in Iraq.

Iraq, with all the violence going on right now, is not ready for elections. The UN envoy to Iraq clearly stated that the earliest date is DEc this year and it has been accepted by Ayatollah Sistani. I think Sistani is really powerful and wise. I think he's the most peaceful leader in Iraq by far. US officials should definitely listen to what he has to say.

[oxherd]

I would like to see Iraqis of all sects (Shiite, Sunni and Kurd) unite on a common front to fight terrorists who are trying to create chaos in the fragile country.

Technically, Kurds are not a sect of Islam, but a group of people living around the border regions of Turkey, Iran and Iraq. There are both Sunni and Shiite Kurds, although most are Sunnis.

Bombing innocent civillians is not the answer. I have no idea what the fundamentalists are thinking.

I think one of the top al-Qaeda officials has said that the idea is to create chaos and civil war in the country. Such a situation will clearly indicate the failure of US in its supposed mission of 'liberating Iraq'. Also, a lot of the bombing attacks were targeted at the fledgling Iraq police force, the intention being to sabotage the formation of a law-maintenance force that is necessary to maintain civil order and prevent random theft and looting.


Besides. most of the suicide bombers are foreigners and not Iraqis themselves. So the trouble comes from outside, people who clearly have no idea and don't care about what's happening in Iraq.


Exactly, and don't forget countries like Iran and Turkey who might be eyeing a piece of Iraq if it ever broke up.

US officials should definitely listen to what he has to say.

With Bush having a direct line to God, why would the US officials need to do that ?

[aquila]

Technically, Kurds are not a sect of Islam, but a group of people living around the border regions of Turkey, Iran and Iraq. There are both Sunni and Shiite Kurds, although most are Sunnis.


That is correct. What I meant was that the Western media at least often divide them by those three categories. even among Kurds themselves, they have two major political parties that are not exactly united. So a lot of friction there.

With Bush having a direct line to God, why would the US officials need to do that ?

well, there's definitely sarcasm in that... Let's leave Bush's beliefs to himself.. to each his own beliefs... fair? anyways, the truth is US officials like Sistani because he represents the moderate view of Shiites... AND he commands a lot of respect among Shiites... He actually condemned Al-Sadr and asked for elections... altho he called for mass demonstrations in january for a quick election, so far he has been willing to compromise with US officials, bearing a rational view and US officials love him for that...

[oxherd]

With Bush having a direct line to God, why would the US officials need to do that ?

well, there's definitely sarcasm in that... Let's leave Bush's beliefs to himself.. to each his own beliefs... fair?


I am sorry, I guess I have been around the British for too long :) But seriously, while Bush is more than entitled to his beliefs, he has a tendency of stating them publicly which may cause problems for himself as well as misunderstanding across the Muslim world.

http://www.montereyherald.com/mld/montereyherald/news/politics/8469675.htm

anyways, the truth is US officials like Sistani because he represents the moderate view of Shiites... AND he commands a lot of respect among Shiites... He actually condemned Al-Sadr and asked for elections... altho he called for mass demonstrations in january for a quick election, so far he has been willing to compromise with US officials, bearing a rational view and US officials love him for that...

As I understand it the US officials only fell in love with Sistani after Sadr came on the scene. Prior to that when he was asking for elections, the Americans weren't too happy with him. Moral - you never appreciate what you have until you lose it.

But I would agree very much with you, Sistani would represent the best way out, AND some UN intervention to lend an air of legitimacy to the whole handover process. With the battering that their reputation has taken recently, they need any kind of international support that they can get. And it does seem that (hopefully!) the Bush admin is beginning to read the writing on the wall.

[qedx]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=1&u=/ap/20040920/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq

Guess, what? Another beheading. I guess this old thread is related to this topic. don't want to make a new thread :P

Arabs... one of the few ethnic groups I rate above Malays in terms of bullheadedness and stupidity, and only because they tend to act on their misguided beliefs. Malays are too lazy to actually do anything. Gross generalization of course :P

I wonder what the hell is going through their dumb heads when they cut off people's heads? Are they doing this intentionally to smear Islam's image? Don't they realize that most people don't usually empathize with people who cut off people's heads? And er, don't they think kidnapping random people to be killed is just a touch cowardly? Damn idiots.

[jiinjoo]

Rationality is a logical framework that fits the individual's mind. What you think might "work", other might think not. One man's "stupidity" is another man's "genious". Hope we'll all look back in history and be smarter.

Do you remember sometime ago in history, when beheading was cool?

Say, I wonder why US's 6 year occupation of Japan after WWII worked out much better and the country actually went somewhere in a short period of time...

[qedx]

Oh, don't get me wrong! I have nothing against beheadings per se - it's a very efficient and foolproof way to kill someone. No one survives a beheading. It'd be very nice if Malaysia beheads people for the death penalty. "Drug trafficking? Off with her head!" :D

It's that they are killing civilians are bothering me, and the fact that the people they kidnap for these web-beheadings seem to be random, upsets me even more....

[Thirdshifter]

I don't know what they'd want but I am pretty sure they don't want anybody meddling in their affairs.

You know...unwanted interference? Arbitrarily deciding to "liberate" some country and then playing hurt when the population starts killing soldiers/Worker?