what can we learn from hikaru?

[masterof_none]

yes, I mean, Utada Hikaru, the Japanese pop singer.
or is she a Japanese? (or Americans?..) or both?

I'm not sure what's her citizenship.

My friend told me that you have to choose whether you want to be American or Japanese , not both . (My friend chose to be an American, but he's still a Japanese).

Anyway, what's up with Hikki?

I know some of us know her...she was born in NYC , but end up becomes a Japanese pop singer.. isn't it amazing?.

how many people, if they live in America, want to compose their motherland's song?
and become a pop singer?

I can't even reply a formal email in Malay anymore...

[masterof_none]

yes, I mean, Utada Hikaru, the Japanese pop singer.
or is she a Japanese? (or Americans?..) or both?

I'm not sure what's her citizenship.

My friend told me that you have to choose whether you want to be American or Japanese , not both . (My friend chose to be an American, but he's still a Japanese).

Anyway, what's up with Hikki?

I know some of us know her...she was born in NYC , but end up becomes a Japanese pop singer.. isn't it amazing?.

how many people, if they live in America, want to compose their motherland's song?
and become a pop singer?

I can't even reply a formal email in Malay anymore...

[budakkerek]

I can't even reply a formal email in Malay anymore...

*sigh*
:( seriously, too much of a foreign language can ruin your ability to se your own mother tongue.

We're on the same boat, man. i hv like real difficulty expressing myself in BM, that's why when i'm mad, i'd rather use English coz i feel that i can express how i'm feeling better.

Utada Hikaru? Hmm..she's big..never knew she was born in NYC...

[budakkerek]

I can't even reply a formal email in Malay anymore...

*sigh*
:( seriously, too much of a foreign language can ruin your ability to se your own mother tongue.

We're on the same boat, man. i hv like real difficulty expressing myself in BM, that's why when i'm mad, i'd rather use English coz i feel that i can express how i'm feeling better.

Utada Hikaru? Hmm..she's big..never knew she was born in NYC...

[fish]

Yeah, I think I am going crazy too. The best is when you meet your Malaysian friends, we mix Mandarin, Cantonese, English, Bahasa Melayu and spice it up with some Japanese.

Then when I meet with my best friend from Indonesia, we speak to each other in Indonesian mix Malay.

Somehow, my English grammar suffered badly as a result of learning Japanese. Not that I am blaming Japanese but their grammar is just so different......
pening, pening.

There was once I in which I had spoken Mandarin to my Japanese friends. They look at me with their eyes wide open and I told them that I was going crazy.

Then my Cambodian friend spoke to me in Khmer. I think she went bonkers as well.
Whatever it is, just nodd and say yes.

And whatever the Japanese people tell you, even if you don t understand, just say
1. sou desu ka
2. hai, hai
3. wakarimashi ta/ wakarimasen

If you tell them wakarimasen, they will try to explain to you in Japanese, much more slower/ louder, but you may/ may not understand in the end. Therefore the best to use is sou desu ka.

[fish]

Yeah, I think I am going crazy too. The best is when you meet your Malaysian friends, we mix Mandarin, Cantonese, English, Bahasa Melayu and spice it up with some Japanese.

Then when I meet with my best friend from Indonesia, we speak to each other in Indonesian mix Malay.

Somehow, my English grammar suffered badly as a result of learning Japanese. Not that I am blaming Japanese but their grammar is just so different......
pening, pening.

There was once I in which I had spoken Mandarin to my Japanese friends. They look at me with their eyes wide open and I told them that I was going crazy.

Then my Cambodian friend spoke to me in Khmer. I think she went bonkers as well.
Whatever it is, just nodd and say yes.

And whatever the Japanese people tell you, even if you don t understand, just say
1. sou desu ka
2. hai, hai
3. wakarimashi ta/ wakarimasen

If you tell them wakarimasen, they will try to explain to you in Japanese, much more slower/ louder, but you may/ may not understand in the end. Therefore the best to use is sou desu ka.

[budakkerek]

isn't it like saying, honto?

hmm..aren't we kinda going off topic here? what's the thread's about anyway? i thought we're talking about utada? hehehe..sowi syamsul!!

[budakkerek]

isn't it like saying, honto?

hmm..aren't we kinda going off topic here? what's the thread's about anyway? i thought we're talking about utada? hehehe..sowi syamsul!!

[luke]

*sigh*
:( seriously, too much of a foreign language can ruin your ability to se your own mother tongue.
It depends ... of course you lose it if you don't use it, that's why once in a while try to produce something in you native language other than oral conversations ...

memang nampak jelik menulis dalam bahasa Melayu setelah sudah tidak lama menggunakannya selain daripada menggunakannya dalam perbualan.

anyway, a bit off-topic here (this is a foreign language SIG I tell you :P) .. let's get back to business ...

hmmm utada hikaru .. anyone still remembers one of her songs which was once a HitzFM top charter -- "First Love"? I like that song very much ... let's learn from its lyric:

(to make it easy to point out when asking question, I put numeric labels to each stanza)

1
Saigo no kisu wa
-- the last kiss
Tabako no flavor ga shita
-- tasted like tobacco
Nigakute setsunai kaori
-- a bitter and sad smell

2
Ashita no imagoro ni wa
-- tomorrow, at this time
Anata wa doko ni iru n' darou
-- where will you be?
Dare wo omotte 'ru n' darou
-- who will you be thinking about?

3
You are always gonna be my love
-- you are always gonna be my love
Itsu ka dare ka to mata koi ni ochite mo
-- even if I fall in love with someone once again
I'll remember to love
-- I'll remember to love
You taught me how
-- you taught me how
You are always gonna be the one
-- you are always gonna be the one
Ima wa mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Atarashii uta utaeru made
-- until I can sing a new song

4
Tachidomaru jikan ga
-- the paused time is
Ugoki-dasou to shite 'ru
-- about to start moving
Wasuretaku nai koto bakari
-- there's many things that I don't want to forget about

5
Ashita no imagoro ni wa
-- tomorrow, at this time
Watashi wa kitto naite 'ru
-- I will probably be crying
Anata wo omotte 'ru n' darou
-- I will probably be thinking about you

6
You will always be inside my heart
-- you will always be inside my heart
Itsu mo anata dake no basho ga aru kara
-- you will always have your own place
I hope that I have a place in your heart too
-- I hope that I have a place in your heart too
Now and forever you are still the one
-- now and forever you are still the one
Ima wa mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Atarashii uta utaeru made
-- until I can sing a new song

7
You are always gonna be my love
-- you are always gonna be my love
Itsu ka dare ka to mata koi ni ochite mo
-- even if I fall in love with someone once again
I'll remember to love
-- I'll remember to love
You taught me how
-- you taught me how
You are always gonna be the one
-- you are always gonna be the one
Mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Now and forever...
-- now and forever...

[luke]

*sigh*
:( seriously, too much of a foreign language can ruin your ability to se your own mother tongue.
It depends ... of course you lose it if you don't use it, that's why once in a while try to produce something in you native language other than oral conversations ...

memang nampak jelik menulis dalam bahasa Melayu setelah sudah tidak lama menggunakannya selain daripada menggunakannya dalam perbualan.

anyway, a bit off-topic here (this is a foreign language SIG I tell you :P) .. let's get back to business ...

hmmm utada hikaru .. anyone still remembers one of her songs which was once a HitzFM top charter -- "First Love"? I like that song very much ... let's learn from its lyric:

(to make it easy to point out when asking question, I put numeric labels to each stanza)

1
Saigo no kisu wa
-- the last kiss
Tabako no flavor ga shita
-- tasted like tobacco
Nigakute setsunai kaori
-- a bitter and sad smell

2
Ashita no imagoro ni wa
-- tomorrow, at this time
Anata wa doko ni iru n' darou
-- where will you be?
Dare wo omotte 'ru n' darou
-- who will you be thinking about?

3
You are always gonna be my love
-- you are always gonna be my love
Itsu ka dare ka to mata koi ni ochite mo
-- even if I fall in love with someone once again
I'll remember to love
-- I'll remember to love
You taught me how
-- you taught me how
You are always gonna be the one
-- you are always gonna be the one
Ima wa mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Atarashii uta utaeru made
-- until I can sing a new song

4
Tachidomaru jikan ga
-- the paused time is
Ugoki-dasou to shite 'ru
-- about to start moving
Wasuretaku nai koto bakari
-- there's many things that I don't want to forget about

5
Ashita no imagoro ni wa
-- tomorrow, at this time
Watashi wa kitto naite 'ru
-- I will probably be crying
Anata wo omotte 'ru n' darou
-- I will probably be thinking about you

6
You will always be inside my heart
-- you will always be inside my heart
Itsu mo anata dake no basho ga aru kara
-- you will always have your own place
I hope that I have a place in your heart too
-- I hope that I have a place in your heart too
Now and forever you are still the one
-- now and forever you are still the one
Ima wa mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Atarashii uta utaeru made
-- until I can sing a new song

7
You are always gonna be my love
-- you are always gonna be my love
Itsu ka dare ka to mata koi ni ochite mo
-- even if I fall in love with someone once again
I'll remember to love
-- I'll remember to love
You taught me how
-- you taught me how
You are always gonna be the one
-- you are always gonna be the one
Mada kanashii love song
-- it's still a sad song
Now and forever...
-- now and forever...

[luke]

let me start:

1) in 1st stanza, 2nd line: why is "shita" used here? how does "do" relate to flavor?

2) in 3rd stanza, 2nd line: "ochite" comes from "ochiru" which means "to fall" right? so is japanese also using the term "fall" to show the budding of love? compare: "fall in love", "jatuh cinta" ...

thanks in advance :)

p/s: good news! I have done some tweakings to stop any words ending in -shite and -shita from being censored ...

[luke]

let me start:

1) in 1st stanza, 2nd line: why is "shita" used here? how does "do" relate to flavor?

2) in 3rd stanza, 2nd line: "ochite" comes from "ochiru" which means "to fall" right? so is japanese also using the term "fall" to show the budding of love? compare: "fall in love", "jatuh cinta" ...

thanks in advance :)

p/s: good news! I have done some tweakings to stop any words ending in -shite and -shita from being censored ...

[wwhong]

nice jobs luke...

i think lyrics is one of the good ways to learn a language..

keep more coming

[wwhong]

nice jobs luke...

i think lyrics is one of the good ways to learn a language..

keep more coming

[fish]

Wau, good work Luke. You translated the whole thing?

Here are the answers to some of your questions,

Suru, shi ta

In some ways, they use shi ta when you did something (as in the suru verb).

Tabako no flavor ga shi ta probably carries the meaning that the person had smoked previously (action could be controlled and thus carries the suru verb).

Compare with Tabako no flavor ga aru.

いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I guess this line koi ni ochi te mo is nearly the same with falling in love. But somehow, it sounded a little sad to me, the way she put it. It is as if love is so painful and yet she was falling in love.....as she put it in

今はまだ悲しい　love　song

まだ悲しい　love　song　Yeah

mada, mada, kanashii no kotoba wo tsukateiru.

By the way, the song sounded like someone is having 恋の病(koi no yamai) or love sick :o

First Love宇多田ヒカル

最後のキスは
タバコの　flavor　がした
ニガくてせつない香り

明日の今頃には
あなたはどこにいるんだろう
誰を想ってるんだろう

You　are　always　gonna　be　my　love
いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I'll　remember　to　love
You　taught　me　how
You　are　always　gonna　be　the　one
今はまだ悲しい　love　song
新しい歌　うたえるまで

立ち止まる時間が
動き出そうとしてる
忘れたくないことばかり

明日の今頃には
わたしはきっと泣いてる
あなたを想ってるんだろう

Yeah
You　will　always　be　inside　my　heart
いつもあなただけの場所があるから
I　hope　that　I　have　a　place　in　your　heart　too
Now　and　forever　you　are　still　the　one
今はまだ悲しい　love　song
新しい歌　うたえるまで

Ah　Ah
You　are　always　gonna　be　my　love
いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I'll　remember　to　love
You　taught　me　how
You　are　always　gonna　be　the　one
まだ悲しい　love　song　Yeah
Now　and　forever　Ah

[fish]

Wau, good work Luke. You translated the whole thing?

Here are the answers to some of your questions,

Suru, shi ta

In some ways, they use shi ta when you did something (as in the suru verb).

Tabako no flavor ga shi ta probably carries the meaning that the person had smoked previously (action could be controlled and thus carries the suru verb).

Compare with Tabako no flavor ga aru.

いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I guess this line koi ni ochi te mo is nearly the same with falling in love. But somehow, it sounded a little sad to me, the way she put it. It is as if love is so painful and yet she was falling in love.....as she put it in

今はまだ悲しい　love　song

まだ悲しい　love　song　Yeah

mada, mada, kanashii no kotoba wo tsukateiru.

By the way, the song sounded like someone is having 恋の病(koi no yamai) or love sick :o

First Love宇多田ヒカル

最後のキスは
タバコの　flavor　がした
ニガくてせつない香り

明日の今頃には
あなたはどこにいるんだろう
誰を想ってるんだろう

You　are　always　gonna　be　my　love
いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I'll　remember　to　love
You　taught　me　how
You　are　always　gonna　be　the　one
今はまだ悲しい　love　song
新しい歌　うたえるまで

立ち止まる時間が
動き出そうとしてる
忘れたくないことばかり

明日の今頃には
わたしはきっと泣いてる
あなたを想ってるんだろう

Yeah
You　will　always　be　inside　my　heart
いつもあなただけの場所があるから
I　hope　that　I　have　a　place　in　your　heart　too
Now　and　forever　you　are　still　the　one
今はまだ悲しい　love　song
新しい歌　うたえるまで

Ah　Ah
You　are　always　gonna　be　my　love
いつか誰かとまた恋に落ちても
I'll　remember　to　love
You　taught　me　how
You　are　always　gonna　be　the　one
まだ悲しい　love　song　Yeah
Now　and　forever　Ah

[wwhong]

quick question, how come sometime japanese write their name in katakana? isn't that katakana is just used for foreign words?

[wwhong]

quick question, how come sometime japanese write their name in katakana? isn't that katakana is just used for foreign words?

[luke]

Wau, good work Luke. You translated the whole thing?
masaka! I just copied, pasted and edited there ... mada sonna ni jouzu ni natta n da yo ...

n, the song is kinda sad ... kanashisou ...

so Utada Hikaru is spelled 宇多田ヒカル? I thought it was 歌(uta)田(da)光(hikaru) .. why 'Hikaru' in katakana?

ermm ... no need to worry about the word censors anymore .. I've fixed it ... just use "shita" instead of "shi ta" :) :) :)

anyway, doumo arigatou :D

[luke]

Wau, good work Luke. You translated the whole thing?
masaka! I just copied, pasted and edited there ... mada sonna ni jouzu ni natta n da yo ...

n, the song is kinda sad ... kanashisou ...

so Utada Hikaru is spelled 宇多田ヒカル? I thought it was 歌(uta)田(da)光(hikaru) .. why 'Hikaru' in katakana?

ermm ... no need to worry about the word censors anymore .. I've fixed it ... just use "shita" instead of "shi ta" :) :) :)

anyway, doumo arigatou :D

[retroque]

quick question, how come sometime japanese write their name in katakana? isn't that katakana is just used for foreign words?


err...why eh?i've been wondering bout this too.what i know is that sometimes their names consists of kanji that is really hard(hard as in to remember..or to write...or seldom used) so instead..they write it in hiragana/katakana.(to make it easier for other pple to read)

plus if u've been watching anime...or reading manga..u'll notice that katakana is also used to when something needs expression.

example

normally is だめ！！

in manga ...or anime ダメ！

[retroque]

quick question, how come sometime japanese write their name in katakana? isn't that katakana is just used for foreign words?


err...why eh?i've been wondering bout this too.what i know is that sometimes their names consists of kanji that is really hard(hard as in to remember..or to write...or seldom used) so instead..they write it in hiragana/katakana.(to make it easier for other pple to read)

plus if u've been watching anime...or reading manga..u'll notice that katakana is also used to when something needs expression.

example

normally is だめ！！

in manga ...or anime ダメ！

[fish]

The katakana is used to put emphasis on certain words. Like what Retroque had mentioned, if you write dame in katakana, it means that the person which is saying 'dame' is stressing on this word. This is normally used for manga, stories, advertisement, etc. but very seldom used formally for reports or in the newspapers.

Other than that, Japanese have lots of different readings for a single kanji. Therefore, sometimes they put katakana on their names to inform other people on how to read it (furigana), so that you read it correctly.

[fish]

The katakana is used to put emphasis on certain words. Like what Retroque had mentioned, if you write dame in katakana, it means that the person which is saying 'dame' is stressing on this word. This is normally used for manga, stories, advertisement, etc. but very seldom used formally for reports or in the newspapers.

Other than that, Japanese have lots of different readings for a single kanji. Therefore, sometimes they put katakana on their names to inform other people on how to read it (furigana), so that you read it correctly.

[luke]

while we are on the topic, how do japanese people choose names for their children? I mean, when they choose a name in general, do they choose it because of its meaning, its sound or other attributes? one of my friends told me about government list of kanji allowed to use for people's names .. is that also related to how they choose names?

also, pardon for my ignorance, how do last names work? As a Malay, I do not have 'last name' but I use "bin <father's name>" instead ...

so I'm wondering, when a son gets married, does he inherit the last name of his father (western culture) or the wife's last name (Japanese culture, if I'm not mistaken) or does he assume a new last name? if it's the former then I would imagine that most of the families have the same sets of last names (since they all get the same last name from their great great great great grandfather) but that's not the case here ... I wonder ...

[luke]

while we are on the topic, how do japanese people choose names for their children? I mean, when they choose a name in general, do they choose it because of its meaning, its sound or other attributes? one of my friends told me about government list of kanji allowed to use for people's names .. is that also related to how they choose names?

also, pardon for my ignorance, how do last names work? As a Malay, I do not have 'last name' but I use "bin <father's name>" instead ...

so I'm wondering, when a son gets married, does he inherit the last name of his father (western culture) or the wife's last name (Japanese culture, if I'm not mistaken) or does he assume a new last name? if it's the former then I would imagine that most of the families have the same sets of last names (since they all get the same last name from their great great great great grandfather) but that's not the case here ... I wonder ...

[Schye]

I think that Japanese choose whatever name that they want and there is no limit for it. Of course they choose those which sound nice and with good meaning. About the government list, i think that is for their last name.

about the last name, the son and the daugther inherit it from their father and female will change their last name to their husband`s last name when they get married(and change it back when they get divorced). So, basically children will have the same last name as their father and mother except those single mothers or those who married to other foreigners and still want to have a Japanese name.

[endoru]

As a Hikki fan as well, the time when she got married to that CG director, Kiriya Kazuaki, it was rather a heart break. (aww ... hehe)

Anyway, Hikki is still Hikki. I guess we fans just love her songs which simply stay in our head. I like her newest single "誰かの願いが叶う頃" (read as ... Dareka no negai ga kanau koro) which means "The moment when one's hope is being realized ... ". Long but meaningful. It is the theme song for her hubby's first movie "Casshern". It is based on an anime which is rather famous in Japan.

Soon, the DVD "Hikaru 5" and "誰かの願いが叶う頃" will be out. I will definitely get it. I have all her albums and own many DVDs of her MTVs (?), the promotion videos.

About how she could do well with both English and Japanese is like how we Malaysians get along with English, Malay, Mandarin and Tamil.

Rojak.
The best way to describe a Malaysian's linguistic ability.
Yeah, I don't deny that we cannot be entirely perfect but I bet that we can still change into the many modes which we know.


I use English when I chat and write mails or when I blog.
I use Japanese every single day of my life here in Japan.
I use Mandarin when I talk with my family.
I use Malay when I have to do official tasks with JPA or the Malaysian Embassy.


Not entirely perfect though, but the people in Japan do really get surprise to hear that we know so many languages. For the Japanese, English is something tough for them for they basically do not use it in their daily life at all. Well, to me, if I can communicate with someone in the language and they do understand me, then it is good enough. Learnt German here last year but hehe, nothing really remained in my head besides "Guten Morgen, Tag, Abend" and "Ich liebe die" and some other simple expressions like "Danke schon" and all. Hehe. I guess the key to master a language is to be in the environment where it is spoken.

About the naming part, lately, parents would just simply pick a Kanji they like and name it differently from what it is supposed to be pronounced. I can't think of any examples now but yeah there are such cases. Back to Hikaru, why is it Katakana ? Well, same reason to why some people only have Hiragana names. Simply the parents' will to do so. Hehe.

Interesting topic.
Hope to hear more from you guys.
Auf widersehen !
Peace !

[sabishii]

Wau, good work Luke. You translated the whole thing?
masaka! I just copied, pasted and edited there ... mada sonna ni jouzu ni natta n da yo ...

n, the song is kinda sad ... kanashisou ...

so Utada Hikaru is spelled 宇多田ヒカル? I thought it was 歌(uta)田(da)光(hikaru) .. why 'Hikaru' in katakana?

ermm ... no need to worry about the word censors anymore .. I've fixed it ... just use "shita" instead of "shi ta" :) :) :)

anyway, doumo arigatou :D

no no.. i think 宇多田光 is correct.. cuz that's what i see in all taiwanese/chinese media.. they never ever change the words unless when it's equivalent word doesn't exist in chinese. (which is extremely rare)

[luke]

no no.. i think 宇多田光 is correct.. cuz that's what i see in all taiwanese/chinese media.. they never ever change the words unless when it's equivalent word doesn't exist in chinese. (which is extremely rare)
boo! it's actually 宇多田ヒカル .. the kanji 光 is not used here :twisted:

anyway, there's not so much point quoting/replying to a one-year-old post (the post you quoted was posted on March 7, 2004)...