The importance of Chinese

[KobeBryant]

hi , everyone
do u all realise the importance of chinese though english is still in the first place.....i am talking about this not just based on the fact that , u know, china the economic powerhouse has gone into the World Trade Organisation and is becoming the world's factory.
yes, this is one of the factors too........but u just need to observe the economic trend and the market in not only malaysia but other countries as well, and u will find the importance of chinese although it is still not very prominent.u can definitely see that and some jobs already need chinese speaking applicants
2 years ago, i thought that no matter how bad are u in academics or any fields , as long as u are proficient in spoken english u will survive.my english is not good at that time , but i still place my top priority in english and i was of opinion that chinese is useless.
but now, i can see the important role of chinese already , of course it needs time to materialise...............

do u all agree with me?
Plz feel free to bombard ur views in this thread.............thanks

[naturesimple]

how significant is chinese???
it is as important as english.

[KobeBryant]

how significant is chinese???
it is as important as english.

yes, but in the years to come

[__earth]

how significant is chinese???
it is as important as english.

i must say that would only be true once China passed the bubble test. An economic bubble is definately building up in China. Inflation is record breaking, investment high with artificially low interest rate - recipe for recession.

we'll see how things go from there on.

[pandaboy]

if i'm not mistaken, chinese is the most spoken language in this world...not english.....

[__earth]

if i'm not mistaken, chinese is the most spoken language in this world...not english.....

yes but most issues related to business and politics are still conducted in english.

[topdog]

if i'm not mistaken, chinese is the most spoken language in this world...not english.....
so? as earth pointed out, that in itself does not make chinese important.

don't get me wrong, i know that chinese is becoming increasingly important. all things being equal, those with a good command of chinese have an advantage over those who don't. but don't tell me that chinese is important because it's the "most spoken language in the world," because china is not the world.

[phantom]

u can definitely see that and some jobs already need chinese speaking applicants
2 years ago, i thought that no matter how bad are u in academics or any fields , as long as u are proficient in spoken english u will survive

i'm sorry if i sound harsh,but those employees who are seeking: candidates who can speak chinese are looking for chinese workers alone.yeap,maybe if you could speak chinese they may consider you but then,how many non-chinese care to learn chinese?i think that phrase drawn this banal metaphor : only chinese candidates can apply.yeap,race's card players in the house.

india is powerhouse in IT,but then again,there's no rules and regulations that coaxed you to read any of their language.english is more than enough.

learning chinese is not useless at all.indeed it will allow you to be a multi-linguist.and some sociologist believe having more languages allow you to express yourself much better.so go for it.

IMHO,english will stay as the most respected language in this world.the moment english became the international's lingua,it doesn't belong to the english anymore.it belongs to e'body and anybody.

if ppl care to learn chinese,arabic or france or any other language,go for it.dont just learn something for the sake of pay-cheques.the world change.you'll keep regretting.

[pandaboy]

if i'm not mistaken, chinese is the most spoken language in this world...not english.....
so? as earth pointed out, that in itself does not make chinese important.

don't get me wrong, i know that chinese is becoming increasingly important. all things being equal, those with a good command of chinese have an advantage over those who don't. but don't tell me that chinese is important because it's the "most spoken language in the world," because china is not the world.

hey....i just telling out the facts...not trying to say that chinese is imporartant bcos it is the most spoken language...

btw, i read from a newspaper that learning science and mathematics in chinese is a lot more efficient and easier than in other languages.... and that is why most students from chinese school are very good in science and maths. Any comment about this?

[phantom]

man,what does one's ability to answer a math problem or figuring a science rubric has to do with one's skin tone,or one's language or one's blood?

i think the key here is the method of teaching.my add math teacher made sure we do tonne of practises.my physics' pedagogue forced us to do thousand and thousand of phyiscs' question,mind me from SPM 1973 to SPM 1999.and the crux here is the method.not the language.sure when you understand the language it's much easier to grasp something.

i dont know what language is being used in taiwan to teach sciences and maths at their school but singapore used english.singapore is ranked 1st,taiwan is ranked second.malaysia is ranked 15th. go figure!!

not that i am debasing any race or any language here,but seriously,i'm bored living with the pun that only students from certain schools,or those having the precise physical attributions do well in maths or sciences.

i believe in sheer hard work.languages make life easier.but dont forget at those who flunked too amid the language being bombarded at them.

[topdog]

hey....i just telling out the facts...not trying to say that chinese is imporartant bcos it is the most spoken language...
ok, i assumed that was what you meant, judging from the title of this thread.:)


btw, i read from a newspaper that learning science and mathematics in chinese is a lot more efficient and easier than in other languages.... and that is why most students from chinese school are very good in science and maths. Any comment about this?
don't know about science, but it's hard to ignore the fact that in malaysia, chinese ed students tend to be better at math. how you define "better" is up to you, but for me, it's how they fare in the math olympiad. i don't think it's solely, or even largely, because they use chinese - although i know many chinese subscribe to this view. i think that work ethic and the approach to learning/teaching math is a bigger factor than merely language.

as an aside, we have a recommer here, prince, who is malaysia's best ever performer in the Intl Math Olympiad. he's a banana. there's also this guy from mrsm, suhaimi ramly, now in mit - malaysia's second best ever performer in the IMO.

some of the perennial top scorers in IMOs are the romanians, russians, vietnamese and chinese. so out goes the myth that learning math in chinese produces superior mathematicians.

erm...you actually read this from a newspaper? curious to know which one, since i'm a banana.

[pandaboy]

man,what does one's ability to answer a math problem or figuring a science rubric has to do with one's skin tone,or their language or their blood?

i think the key here is the method of teaching.my add math teacher made sure we do tonne of practises.my physics' pedagogue forced us to do thousand and thousand of phyiscs' question,mind me from SPM 1973 to SPM 1999.and the crux here is the method.not the language.sure when you understand the language it's much easier to grasp something.

i dont know what language is being used in taiwan to teach sciences and maths at their school but singapore used english.singapore is ranked 1st,taiwan is ranked second.malaysia is ranked 15th. go figure!!

not that i am debasing any race or any language here,but seriously,i'm bored living with the pun that only students from certain schools,or those having the precise physical attributions do well in maths or sciences.

i believe in sheer hard work.languages make life easier.but dont forget at those who flunked too amid the language being bombarded at them.

why everyone got the wrong interpretion of what i've written? what i wrote is that learning science and maths is a lot easier in chinese as reported in a newspaper... This means that they can understand easily.....and learning is more efficient.... This doesnt implies that learning science or maths in chinese will make u the smartest student in asia or things like that. But as phantom wrote...singapore is 1st (in asia??) and taiwan second... Taiwan should be using chinese??

[littlebigone]

learning in chinese makes math and science easier? That's interesting. Did the papers say why or how? Where was this study conducted? More info please.

I am a banana and I must say that growing up, I had a lot of pressure from parents and grandparents to learn chinese. I tried but I gave up soon enough.

Now I'm comfortable speaking in my first language, english and I don't give a camel turd what people think. If they're not satisfied, I opt for the easy way out and say I'm straits born and my whole family speaks in Malay :p

I however think that chinese would be an added advantage if you're doing business. Many small businesses are owned by chinese taukeh's or so I observed when I was working in telemarketing. I noticed that if you say you can't speak chinese, they almost shut off to your sales pitch. But if you can speak to them, especially in their dialect, they feel like they're talking to an old friend. This is obviously a broad generalization. Does anyone share this point of view?

[topdog]

I however think that chinese would be an added advantage if you're doing business. Many small businesses are owned by chinese taukeh's or so I observed when I was working in telemarketing. I noticed that if you say you can't speak chinese, they almost shut off to your sales pitch. But if you can speak to them, especially in their dialect, they feel like they're talking to an old friend. This is obviously a broad generalization. Does anyone share this point of view?
i do. my father's business would have died an early death if he were a banana.

you don't need to be doing business to feel this. try buying wares from petaling st. - there are 3 price levels: ang moh, non-chinese-speaking local, and chinese-speaking local. try going to a car mechanic - different price levels again.

i know enough chinese to not feel totally out of place buying stuff from these small taukehs, but there's no mistaking that i'm a banana. like littlebigone, my parents forced me to learn chinese, even paid for chinese lessons, but i couldn't do it. it was just too hard. unfortunately, i couldn't claim that i'm straits born though:D

[sanghanuman]

I'd love to learn mandarin, not because of the advantages that it would bring upon me, but just because it is a beautiful language. I don't buy the argument that know chinese=good at math. The credit should go to the incessant practice and self-determination..maybe talent too..

I think that in learning language, what is important is to take it lightly. Make jokes, go learn swear words (favorite illegal topic in language classes) if those would compell you to use your language skill. If you feels that you're forced into learning it cos there's no really an environment that you can practice the language, then maybe it's not a good idea to stuff yourself with it.

Learn chinese.
Et n'importe quelle langue.
It's fun.

[ydho_6]

according to a report released by neurologists, learning chinese is like learning music because the different 'intonation' and 'key' of each word. so the benefits of learning music can be 'transferred' to learning chinese too.

agree that mandarin is becoming important ever since china is opening up to the world. notice how MASSIVE the market in china is! no kidding... look at all the US companies and factories reallocating their plants and operation centres to china. and how they have been ' recruiting' chinese faces in advertisement sector and modelling sector to appeal to chinese in their product. (take guess model for example, etc etc) the hype over mandaring is now high among westerners. but whether it is another short-lived phenomena or a great revolution in human international language history depends on how that language can apply into daily life practicality and suitability.

Personally, to me, chinese is a beautiful language. Chinese language is my passion and the wonder in it can be found even in a single word. take a simplest example, a single word can mean a thousand feelings.

however, i have to say for chinese language to develop into an international language, it still need to overcome some barriers. the ease and simplicity to pick up the language is a main barrier. cuz chinese language is not easy. and learning up chinese language since small in a chinese language and learning up chinese language by language class is totally different. if it is not easy to learn, it faces the challenge of getting acceptance from global community.

also, the practicality counts. for chinese to gain importance in world, it need to be appplicable in all sectors. for example the main important thing like computer, programming languages, laws and legislation (in this area seems english laws still dominates... hm...) there is a challenge for it to overcome the practical usage and acceptance from professional commuinity to adopt chinese language.

wow... boy... i have been LECTURING!!! can;t believe i m turning into a BORING lecturer! omigosh must be the effect of hours of lectures...

anyway, just wanna say chinese language rocks! and whether it is going to be important or not, do feel welcome to learn up and explore its wonder! it would fun, even just for social entertainment! :D

[deaf-knee]

Mandarin is SO. HARD. TO. LEARN.

It's like looking for a death sentence....

8O

[chenghau]

Yes, I strongly agree it is, considering a primary school student needs to spend 6 years to learn before he/she is able to remember more than thousands of characters, each with different shape and pattern, unlike abcde...xyz.

But, you know it is worth it when you are able to read the menu in Chinese Restaurant here.

=)

[sanghanuman]

College-level mandarin..6 credits oy!

[chenghau]

College-level mandarin..6 credits oy!

6 credits? a lot...

[Moozy]

Agree with ydho_6. Chinese language is such a beautiful language. All the things that come with it, chinese calligraphy, chinese culture, chinese art...etc. I'm not saying this merely because I'm a Chinese, because other races have adored chinese culture too. I'm just glad that I'm a chinese. I'm especially fond of Chinese History. It's so ... grand and amazing....

*Slaps self*AiKs! Sorry digressed from the topic . Before starting on the topic, let me introduce a very good book "A Thousand Pieces od Gold" by Adeline Yen Mah to You all. Don't worry, it's not in Chinese but in English, so, to those who want to know a little bit about Chinese history, why Chinese always think in proverbs(mostly 4-characters) , u shold start with this book. Because it's written for westerners so it's pretty easy for non-Chinese to understand what Adeline wants to share. Mdm Adeline YenMah must be pleased if she knows I promoted her book here.


OK, on the importance of Chinese language, have u all heard of a joke. I can only recall it vaguely, something like:

2 men, one Chinese and one Malay want to sky-jump(jump fr the aeroplane), the Chineseinstructor told them to count to 10 before pulling open the parachute. They nodded and jumped from the aeroplane together, guess who didn't open it on time? Yes, the malay(no offence to Malays). Because to count from 1 to 10, the chinese needed to say, yi, er, san, si .. and so on, all monosyllabic but the malay had to say, satu, dua, tiga, empat.... so, u know what i mean?Maybe it's this reason why they said math is easier when taught in Chinese Language.

Chinese is very effective when u wan to express something. We learn proverbs. Along the way, we learn history, what our ancestors learned from their mistakes. So, I think those 'ming ju jing hua' they forced us to memorise are actually much more better that the 18 main moral values and numerous(96, if i'm not mistaken) sub-values.

I'd like to think that Chinese language would be the most important language in the future but it still has a very long way to go. And I read from a report that malay language is the 4th most-spoken language in the world! Go, Bahasa Kebangsaan. Even some universities in China are having Malay L. courses.

[KobeBryant]

Moozy........
just want to know how long did u take to type ur last reply ?

[luke]

College-level mandarin..6 credits oy!
at Cornell Univ that's normal ... I have been taking 6-credits japanese courses for 2 semesters ... and when I 1st came here, I took an Indon language placement test, which also gave me 6 credits ... chill ~

[tree007]

chinese language (or should i say mandarin), will only becom very important if and only if CHina succeeds in becomin a stabil world super power.. otherwise, i tihnk it will just remain as the world's most spoken language, thanks to China's population and the fact that chinese are everywhere.. hehe...but too bad Mandarin is tough to learn... especially the text... heck, the Chinese Governemnt implemented the "jian ti" text which IMHO, is to enoucrage ppl to learn Chinese.. but fortuantely, i think this "jian ti" text tarnishes and erodes the beauty of Chinese text.. agree? :P


And I read from a report that malay language is the 4th most-spoken language in the world! Go, Bahasa Kebangsaan. Even some universities in China are having Malay L. courses.


regarding Bahasa Kebangsaan, i would like to clarify that this is mainly becos of Indonesia's immense population. i dun tihnk it iwill becom popular any time soon, unless once again, if somehow Malaysia and/or Indonesia becom Asia's powerhouse... ohya, FYI, Indonesia is also the worlds largest Muslim country...

[USSDefiantNX74205]

I'm a self confessed and much criticized banana, so normally I would try to avoid debates on English vs Chinese. Just to give my two cents on it this time tho...

I think Chinese is the world's most spoken language simply because China is the worlds most populous country and everyone there speaks some form of Chinese. English on the other hand, is only popular in former British colonies, where it has to compete with local languages there (like Malaysia, India, etc.). So it is pretty obvious why English is not spoken as much as Chinese worldwide. But since English has already established itself as the international intermediary language, it's hard to see how Chinese or any other language for that matter, can take over its role anytime in the future. Remember, a language spoken by a lot of people doesn't necessarily mean that it will become the international language.

[pandaboy]

hey....i just telling out the facts...not trying to say that chinese is imporartant bcos it is the most spoken language...
ok, i assumed that was what you meant, judging from the title of this thread.:)

wrong assumption...haha....


don't know about science, but it's hard to ignore the fact that in malaysia, chinese ed students tend to be better at math. how you define "better" is up to you, but for me, it's how they fare in the math olympiad. i don't think it's solely, or even largely, because they use chinese - although i know many chinese subscribe to this view. i think that work ethic and the approach to learning/teaching math is a bigger factor than merely language.

as an aside, we have a recommer here, prince, who is malaysia's best ever performer in the Intl Math Olympiad. he's a banana. there's also this guy from mrsm, suhaimi ramly, now in mit - malaysia's second best ever performer in the IMO.

some of the perennial top scorers in IMOs are the romanians, russians, vietnamese and chinese. so out goes the myth that learning math in chinese produces superior mathematicians.

erm...you actually read this from a newspaper? curious to know which one, since i'm a banana.

read that from the star (cant remember which issue...but the topic is about vernacular school)....

[ElansarGelmir]

what i wrote is that learning science and maths is a lot easier in chinese as reported in a newspaper...

I think i've read it from the Star too, somewhere this week or last week. but no, they didn't say how, or to which extend, and so on. They just merely stated that Chinese will make learning Sc and Math easier.

IMHO, I think Mandarin is important to me not because it's the most spoken language in the world nor because it's going to be the world's lingua franca because of China's aggrandizing into one of the world's super power (so said Iceberg beside me) but because it's my LIDAH IBU, oops, mother tongue... as a banana, i feel a lost or something amiss in me - and that's not being able to converse in my own language... Hmm... Well, I dunno, but i feel a little inferior, compared to my counterparts. It's like you know that you are a human, but you dunno how to behave like one. Just my opinion.

[naturesimple]

. I'm especially fond of Chinese History. It's so ... grand and amazing....


me too ... but i no the surface of the whole thing onli...also i'm trying to get myself into the history of china...thanks for ur recomment on the book.



2 men, one Chinese and one Malay want to sky-jump(jump fr the aeroplane), the Chineseinstructor told them to count to 10 before pulling open the parachute. They nodded and jumped from the aeroplane together, guess who didn't open it on time? Yes, the malay(no offence to Malays). Because to count from 1 to 10, the chinese needed to say, yi, er, san, si .. and so on, all monosyllabic but the malay had to say, satu, dua, tiga, empat.... so, u know what i mean?Maybe it's this reason why they said math is easier when taught in Chinese Language.


n not only in numbers....
when we say chicken where in chinese is 'ji'. but when wan to say male chicken, in english we never say 'male chicken'. but we say 'gong ji'. just like small tiger..in english is cub instead of 'xiao hu' ........that's y chinese educated trained to think fast.

[topdog]

to those who believe that learning math in chinese makes one better at math, how do you define "math"? spm results? math olympiads? speed counting? ability to use the abacus? business acumen? what??

[Moozy]

To Kobebryant: I don't know how long it took me to type that post. When it comes to a topic I'm interested in, I'll open my big mouth and talk non-stop,even if someone hinted me to stop! Haha... guess it's the same with virtual forum.

me too ... but i no the surface of the whole thing onli...also i'm trying to get myself into the history of china...thanks for ur recomment on the book.

naturesimple, you're welcome.

n not only in numbers....
when we say chicken where in chinese is 'ji'. but when wan to say male chicken, in english we never say 'male chicken'. but we say 'gong ji'. just like small tiger..in english is cub instead of 'xiao hu' ........that's y chinese educated trained to think fast.

Yeah, totally agree! Chinese is more straight forward.
Sometimes, I wonder why we M'sian Chinese(is it M'sian Chinese or Chinese M'sian, because we have African American where the origin is in front and the country they stay now is at the back) speak rojak Mandarin. I admire Beijing people's accent. They speak mandarin just like music! Maybe because mandarin(pu tong hua)is based on the dialect of Beijing. That's why they speak pure mandarin. Not like us, always add on lah, mah , things like that. But that's part of our identity, so I guess it's ok. I prefer movies from Mainland China because there's where I could listen to those beautifully spoken mandarin. They add an "er' after every sentence.

[USSDefiantNX74205]

I admire Beijing people's accent. They speak mandarin just like music!

What a coincidence! My friend once told me that Indonesians speak Indonesian Malay (is it the same as Bahasa Indonesia?) with an almost musical rhythm. It's as if they're singing more than talking. Anyone know why our very own BM or Chinese seems less rhythmic?

[ElansarGelmir]

Hmmm.... Indonesia's BM are way super fast. In fact, they can stuff in about 12 to 15 words in 5 seconds (considering that BM's syllabus are often very long). That's why they can understand our BM rather easily (coz it's like listenning to a slower version of their own language). Once I tried to speak like them, but it resulted in getting my tongue knitted together.... Hehe.... Very embarassing ler...

Same goes for China's mandarin. However, their mandarin is more "melodious" than ours. Dunno why. Even their voice became lower and more hoarse when they speak in mandarin than when they speak in English. Perhaps they like inject their emotion into their conversation in Mandarin, like emphasizing certain syllabus...

[tree007]

Same goes for China's mandarin. However, their mandarin is more "melodious" than ours. Dunno why.


regarding the diferneces of how chinese, malay are spoken, i tihnk it's 'cos of how we learn the language...

i'll take chinese for instance... u noe y our mandarin dun sound melodious? it's cos when v r tot chinese by our local teachers, v r not really~~ learning the actual, accurate pronunciation of eah word.. instead, v r influenced by the "fang yan".. or dialects' pronunciation.. that's wat i think lah.. if v DO pronounce everything correctly n string them into a sentence, i think v're not far off.. i have a fens who r fomr chinese independent skool.. n as u all noe, the mandarin there rox.. n really.. they speak like real taiwanese! (not far off from beijing ppl lah.. oklah~~.:P ).. i think it's the same for English.. it's how v r tot.. v r tot of the pronunciation.. but no of the emphasis of the syllables of each word... that's y our english accent can nvr be the same as those who studied under guai low teacher.. (e.g., students from international skool).. 'cos v aren't tot how to pronuonce the words correctly...

that's just wat i think lah.. correct me if i'm wrong...

[ydho_6]

regarding the diferneces of how chinese, malay are spoken, i tihnk it's 'cos of how we learn the language...

i'll take chinese for instance... u noe y our mandarin dun sound melodious? it's cos when v r tot chinese by our local teachers, v r not really~~ learning the actual, accurate pronunciation of eah word.. instead, v r influenced by the "fang yan".. or dialects' pronunciation.. that's wat i think lah.. if v DO pronounce everything correctly n string them into a sentence, i think v're not far off.. i have a fens who r fomr chinese independent skool.. n as u all noe, the mandarin there rox.. n really.. they speak like real taiwanese! (not far off from beijing ppl lah.. oklah~~.:P ).. i think it's the same for English.. it's how v r tot.. v r tot of the pronunciation.. but no of the emphasis of the syllables of each word... that's y our english accent can nvr be the same as those who studied under guai low teacher.. (e.g., students from international skool).. 'cos v aren't tot how to pronuonce the words correctly...

that's just wat i think lah.. correct me if i'm wrong...


agree. different environment results in different accent.

but i would like to add. it does not really matter whether whose mandarin is more melodious or nice to hear. waht is important is the correct intonatioin and pronounciation. cuz take for example china, even some places in china you can't decipher the mandarin cuz it is mixed with local 'fang yan'/ loghat.

for malaysian, our mandarin may not sound really standard. but we have to be aware of the fact that we are in Malaysia. n that is malaysian style.

i believe, there is no need to imitate any accent from any place. just speak the way we normally speak. that makes originality and uniqueness. that, is the beauty of any language.

[soul_out]

to those who believe that learning math in chinese makes one better at math, how do you define "math"? spm results? math olympiads? speed counting? ability to use the abacus? business acumen? what??

First of all, i do think that learning Math and Science with your mother tongue will make things easier than using a language that you don't feel comfortable with. For instance, i do math in Hokkien, which is my mother tongue. :lol:

People used to say that "learning math in chinese makes one better at math", should be due to the overall results of public examination. Look at the standard of the Mathematic paper of a Chinese private school, SMJK and SK then you will know. For instance, my school (SMJK Jit Sin) math's paper during class test and semester exam is much harder than the public examination paper.

Nevertheless, results is merely results.

During my Pre-u, the top student of Math and Physics is a banana boy as well, although there were some top SMJK students from Penang studying there.

Personally, Chinese is not vitally important. But somehow it's an advantage.

P/S: Topdog & littlebigone, i understand your frustration when you hear people saying that. It's unfair to genaralised every non-Chinese speaker with that. Just like those English Ed Chinese used to say that Chinese Ed Chinese are ah beng & ah lian... :lol: There are always exceptions.

[topdog]

First of all, i do think that learning Math and Science with your mother tongue will make things easier than using a language that you don't feel comfortable with.
ahh...that makes much more sense to me.

so, if it's true that some newspapers are claiming that learning math in chinese makes one better at math, aren't they perpetuating a myth? would someone whose mother tongue is, say, swahili suddenly be better at math if he switches to chinese for math?

[soul_out]

Yes Topdog. I think i lost count how many times i read that claim in Chinese newspaper and heard from adults around me while i'm growing up.

I would say if you do the statistical test, you might find that Chinese schools are better in maths and science results in public examination. As i say, results is merely results. But you can only use the results from public examination to make the comparison.

Maybe they should change the claim to "learning math and science in Chinese will get better results in Malaysia public examination".

[topdog]

msian public exams is all about drilling and regurgitating. no thinking required. i think a lot of chinese schools really push their students to do well in exams. i know for a fact that their workload is much heavier than sek keb. if upsr, pmr and spm results are indicators of math prowess, i'm not buying that. any sek keb can achieve the same results if they have the same work ethic as chinese schools. after all, we always argue that msia's edu system is too rigid and doesn't promote thinking - why should this not apply to chinese schools if they follow the same syllabus?

i think newspapers should say that students are more comfortable learning math in their own mother tongue, and that would ease the path to success in math. saying that chinese language is better for math smacks of self-congratulatory linguistic (maybe even racial) superiority if you ask me.

[masterof_none]

I learn a little Chinese last year. ALthough I think the newspapers' claims (or whoever, ) that learning chinese would make someone a better math student does not make much sense, I guess it is something worth to ponder.

here's the thing that I found when I learn chinese: it takes less time to count 1, 2 ,3 4,... in Chinese than English (yi, er, san....). So, Chinese students tend to calculate a lot faster. That's how I think the chinese can perform better in Math and science than other people.
(uh, reminds me of Chinese Remainder Theorem).
of course, with the exception of the elites.

anyway, I don't know more than that since I just learn very little (and forgot some more...aiyoh) .

But, I think the language itself is a fascinating language. What motivates me to learn chinese is that the chinese characters could store so much information (although usually, we kinda guess what the character would look like if we transform it into picture).
When it could store more meaning, I think, Chinese people can imagine more, when they do math and science.., hence, make them a better math/sci students.

[widagdo]

I am not saying that Chinese(language) makes learning Math easier.

But to read "9x9"

Chinese - jiu x jiu

Malay - Sembilan x Sembilan

to read "19x19"

Chinese - shi jiu x shi jiu

Malay - Sembilan belas x Sembilan belas

See?

[USSDefiantNX74205]

Okay, so the argument here is that learning math in Chinese is more effective because their numbers come in only one syllable (is this the correct term?) as opposed to languages like Malay? If we go according to this logic, then shouldn't learning math in English have the same effect? One. Two. Three. With the exception of seven, all numbers from one to ten have only one syllable.

Seriously, I believe learning math in whatever langauge makes no difference. You want to excel? Then practice a lot. That's what the Chinese schools are doing. Even the F6 pupils in my class now who are used to working according to the ethics of Chinese schools are doing exactly that. No matter where they go, they'll always be carrying a book with em, memorizing facts, doing exercises. It's just a matter of work ethics. Forcing yourself to do more exercises will certainly make you better in math. But knowing the effect that our education system has on youths nowadays, I would say that excelling in public exams doesn't really mean that you're smart. You need to be able think outside the box to truly be an all rounder. So even if these peole were to learn math in Chinese and excel in their math papers after that, its of no use if they don't know what's happening in the world around them. That unfortunately, is what's happening to most of the Chinese ed students now. They drown themselves so completely in the paper chase that they seem almost ignorant to whatever's happening in the world around them.

[tree007]

That unfortunately, is what's happening to most of the Chinese ed students now. They drown themselves so completely in the paper chase that they seem almost ignorant to whatever's happening in the world around them.


errrrr.. sez who? better not make any sweeping statements here..

but personally, i do agree with u that languange dun really play a role in err.. maths? the fact that chinese students perform better in maths and science generally, it's due to practice practrice n more pratice.. n not only just practice, but practice on super tough challenging questions that require thinking, n not blinkd repetition of wat's taught..... IMHO, that's wat make chinese ed students stand out... language? nah~~..... :P

[USSDefiantNX74205]

errrrr.. sez who? better not make any sweeping statements here..

Not a sweeping statement. Just an opinion based on my observations. Notice that I say 'most' Chinese ed students, so I'm not saying that all of em are like that. Am I right or wrong? That depends on what others can tell me, since I may not know about Chinese ed students inside out.

[ElansarGelmir]

errrrr.. sez who? better not make any sweeping statements here..


Uhm... I used to think of tat (coz the Chinese Eds in my school are like wat u had just said). However, my perception changed since I made friends from Chung Ling HS, and others, and especially from UiTM. These people are not only interested in their immediate concerns like academics, but they are fantastic in their general papers and logics as well. Rather put me to shame.

I think each students will perform in their optimum level when taught in certain languages. Depends on what they are comfortable with. Like me, the best academic language for me is pictures, diagrams and imaginations.

[calibre2001]

Hmmm.... Indonesia's BM are way super fast. In fact, they can stuff in about 12 to 15 words in 5 seconds (considering that BM's syllabus are often very long). That's why they can understand our BM rather easily (coz it's like listenning to a slower version of their own language). Once I tried to speak like them, but it resulted in getting my tongue knitted together.... Hehe.... Very embarassing ler...

Same goes for China's mandarin. However, their mandarin is more "melodious" than ours. Dunno why. Even their voice became lower and more hoarse when they speak in mandarin than when they speak in English. Perhaps they like inject their emotion into their conversation in Mandarin, like emphasizing certain syllabus...

Malaysians/Singaporeans speak with an almost flat tone (think of a horizontal sine wave graph) unlike Americans/Chinese/Germans whose tone is accented (think of a proper sine wave graph). This gives Malaysians the advantage of being adaptable to many languages aside the environment. Of course, the usual outcome is a rather bastardized form of the original language just like our pidgin Mandarin and English.

But let us not forget that our funny accent will still sound inteligible compared to say a Hubei resident speaking English. The 'shing shang shong' allows his/her Mandarin to sing like a harpy but the English mispronounced all the way. In short, Malaysians are jacks of all trades and masters of none.

[retroque]

would like to learn chinese......if it's not for its kanji...aaarghhh....10 000 kanjis to be remember??

[ydho_6]

Okay, so the argument here is that learning math in Chinese is more effective because their numbers come in only one syllable (is this the correct term?) as opposed to languages like Malay? If we go according to this logic, then shouldn't learning math in English have the same effect? One. Two. Three. With the exception of seven, all numbers from one to ten have only one syllable.

Seriously, I believe learning math in whatever langauge makes no difference. You want to excel? Then practice a lot. That's what the Chinese schools are doing. Even the F6 pupils in my class now who are used to working according to the ethics of Chinese schools are doing exactly that. No matter where they go, they'll always be carrying a book with em, memorizing facts, doing exercises. It's just a matter of work ethics. Forcing yourself to do more exercises will certainly make you better in math. But knowing the effect that our education system has on youths nowadays, I would say that excelling in public exams doesn't really mean that you're smart. You need to be able think outside the box to truly be an all rounder. So even if these peole were to learn math in Chinese and excel in their math papers after that, its of no use if they don't know what's happening in the world around them. That unfortunately, is what's happening to most of the Chinese ed students now. They drown themselves so completely in the paper chase that they seem almost ignorant to whatever's happening in the world around them.

yup yup... learning math in whatever language is not the sole factor determining the result. i would say, the style of learning, or the environment matters much much more.

take the olympiad math defending champion chunghwa high school. it is their style of learning math, and their hardwork that counts. not just becoz they speak mandarin. a friend of mine do great in math. n i personallly think is their way to think and learn that makes them score distinction. they learn math in a math way. not due to using any language. cuz a good mathematician can do well in whatever language. becoz... it is MATH.

[KobeBryant]

we , students in east coast, dun have the opportunity to meet any mathematics olimpiad winners.....

the A1 in MM and MT in SPM is small matter "sup sup water" only for those olimpiad winners ?

their standard is very very HIGH ???

[ydho_6]

haha from what i know... even A-level is just 'sup sup' for them... what i admire is that they can come up with own integration formula which is much faster than what teachers teach...

hm... should brush up my own math...

[ElansarGelmir]

haha from what i know... even A-level is just 'sup sup' for them... what i admire is that they can come up with own integration formula which is much faster than what teachers teach...

hm... should brush up my own math...

I have a friend who generates his own progression formulae. Different from the one that we use, but proven to be accurate as well.

Compared to my school (national school) to Jit Sin (Chinese vernacular school), our maths homeworks were like pieces of cake. Do 3 exercise a month. That's all. Where as my friends from Jit Sin always practise and practise with their given assignments and self-exercises. Perhaps they've already developed the habit of practising. But i salute those who do not have to practise very hard and yet is still able to score in any subjects.

[gal_flower]

hmm...i donno the 'matlamat' of the discussions here but i'd juz like to share my story...
i come from a chung hua primary school...at first, ok la...then when i went to primary 4 i juz couldnt do well...everything was in chinese n my chinese is the kind ppl say no biao zun (no standard) one. haha...i suffered man. my science n kajian tempatan was horrible...
then i went to gov sec school...only then did my studies became not too bad...but i did continue to take chinese for pmr...

now thinking back, i'm glad i did learn chinese. it's useful n it's always good to be conversant in another language. no offense to either side, banana or not. but i do admire those bananas tad make an effort to learn chinese.

[naturesimple]

let's dun say from the angel of maths....talk about our own identity.
being a chinese but dun study the mother language, contrary "mengagung-agungkan' other languages, accepted??? if answer yes give me reasons.

just look at our famous malaysian singer ,siti norhaliza who was invited to the 'music award day' in taiwan choose to perform TWO chinese songs ('zheng fu n yue liang dai biau wo de sin(duet with wang li hom)') instead of malay songs even she was allowed to do so!!!honestly i'm proud of her effort cause she have to work doubly hard since she dun have the basic skill.

n the responds from taiwanese were too good!!! claming that she sang very accurately in terms of pronouciation of words. this not only showed that the importance of chinese but also the awareness n actions towards mastering the language. she have prove to the world that malaysia is good in chinese too but not 'ulu-ulu' 1 !!! but this was done by a malay! now look wat WE chinese have do??? we should be embarass for that.

some said the chinese language will only become important in next 10 years , dont u need a long period to grab the language n use it efficiently??? 6 years in chinese primary scool onli allow me to learn it superficially.

i'm not blaming those bananas because every1 live in different environment. maybe they dun reared under such condition. but the effort to study it or at the least able to communicate with it after knewing the truth should be invest instead of being ignorant.

frankly i'm not very good in chinese already since not talking it for a long time. but i now try to recall back by reading newspaper, chat with friends who r bananas also n ......let's develop together!!!

[calibre2001]

What is the definition of a banana?

Is it:

a) An English-educated Chinese who knows zero Mandarin and dialect

or

b) An English-educated Chinese who knows zero Mandarin but at least one dialect

[ElansarGelmir]

Not to generalize here, but i think every Chinese in the world should have at least one dialect. Else, how do they communicate in their region?

I think banana is coined for Chinese who knows 0 about Mandarin only.

[calibre2001]

What about foreign born chinese people a.k.a xbc people like American born chinese? Most of them know nuts about their dialect or Mandarin since their like 5th generation people.

[ElansarGelmir]

Just as the same as language, we learn our dialects from the region in the country we live in. However, i think language is more for a nation, instead of community. For the American born Chinese, i think they are banana enough not to know mandarin. Even they know their dialects but not mandarin, I think they are still bananas.

[calibre2001]

So you reckon the old folks who know no Mandarin at all yet fluent in several dialects, chinese customs, culture are bananas?

And some of the more westernized younger generation who know nothing about chinese culture except Mandarin (which was forced down their throats from schooling) which they hate so much not bananas?

[ElansarGelmir]

I know my dialect, but not my language. yet, I'm still termed as a banana.

Mandarin is like a general language for the Chinese nation, while a dialect in an area could be different from another. So, it is impossible for them to master all dialects, right?

[KobeBryant]

actually , those 'banana' should be proud of themselves.......
because u all have a good grasp of english and are proficient...
and english still rules the world

[ElansarGelmir]

actually , those 'banana' should be proud of themselves.......
because u all have a good grasp of english and are proficient...
and english still rules the world

Being bananas doesn't necessarily mean that we are good in our English. MY SAT verbal and SAT2 writing is like one of the lowest compared to my Chinese Educated counterpart. It's just that we are used to speaking English. In my case, Manglish...

[KobeBryant]

ok lar.....let's learn to together and strive for excellent english

[DramaQueen]

Don't inderestimate tyhe importance of the language Chinese,or Mandarin...i've stopped studying the language since primary 6,so it's been 6 years since i've learnt it,and now that i'm studying in Singapore i'm taking it up again...As a Chinese,i think it's important to be able to speak the language fluently,what's the use of being able to master English yet stutter or stumble when speaking your own mother tongue?

[calibre2001]

Mandarin can be argued to not be the true 'mother tongue' of all Malaysian Chinese since they are mainly descendants of various Southern chinese dialect groups.

In any case, Mandarin is useful for uniting the various different chinese dialects, thus uniting the chinese people whilst giving a comparative economic advantage in the climate of today's Sino- maniac global economy.