BioChemistry

[CyberJaya]

Can you make money with this degree? Is there an abundance of jobs out there for graduates. Can you work in the biotechnology sector with such a degree?

[widagdo]

LOL. Same kind of question again. I bet later he would come out with the career of doctor, lawyer, accountant, businessman, politician...

I really wonder who bothers to answer this question (again).

[CyberJaya]

whats so funny. Isnt it good to know about different careers? Maybe i want to become a careers advisor? heheh

[windy_city]

OMG, I have seen you asking the same question of different careers again and again.
I think you should get the general idea by now, that no matter what degree or major you pursue, if you are good at it, you will have no problem making money.
Plus money is not the most important thing, people rank job satisfaction as the number 1 priority when seeking a job rather than wage (I am not making this up, can show you the stat if you wan, just that I dun have the stat in my hand now, if you really wan it, I can try to find it and show it to you)

It is very superficial to ask question about how much money and wage each major can earn, because getting an education is more than making money. I understand that you want to find the perfect money making career, but there is none, it all depend on how good you are, not matter what degree you get. You can become rich even you are a doctor, economist, scientist, contractor?????.writer too, as long as you are good in whatever you specialize in.

[chenchow]

Fully agree with windy_city. Cyberjaya, since you are majoring in computing, you should seek out inner details within that field and ensure that you have a holistic all-round education!

[ElansarGelmir]

Well, i'm glad that you guys bring this up now. Cyber Jaya, we've told you many many many times that if you depend on money alone to choose your career, then you may fail and end up jobless in the future, coz there's no certainty which job will be the most profitable. There could be a mistake in statistics, or a shift in global interest, and cause the "most profitable" job to be the "least profitable" job. Who knows? If you really want a job that can make big money, i suggest your becoming a loan shark. They earn millions each day.

[chenchow]

I think this article in The Star sums it all.

Graduates have been advised not to depend solely on their qualifications but to cultivate other qualities in order to secure a good job.

Deputy Minister in the Prime Minister?s Department Joseph Entulu said a degree or diploma was only a passport towards achieving one?s ambition.

?When you enter the job market, you will be competing with graduates of other institutions and universities.

?You need other qualities such as communication skills, teamwork, innovation and creativity which employers are looking for"

For more, go to http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/5/16/nation/7996281&sec=nation

[ElansarGelmir]

Btw, does anyone of you know what's the future of JPA's sponsored students who majored in Biochem? Where did they end up working? Palm oil research centers? I'm afraid of getting that job.

[chenchow]

Perhaps Biovalley~! I am not too sure about this, but I think you can negotiate with JPA.

ElansarGelmir, what you think will be the ideal job for you?

[morpheous]

Can you make money with this degree?
biochemistry degree is a specialized degree from biology field.most scientists' jobs are created by Malaysia government.so their salaries are based on government employees scale.should be good enough for you to make a comfortable living in msia.
scientists in developing countries like Malaysia mostly end up at public unis or national laboratories(SIRIM,PORIM,FRIM,etc..)
unless you want to set-up your own company or work for foreign biotech company(if they really come to Malaysia),then your salary will be different...maybe u can really make lots of money,who knows?
Is there an abundance of jobs out there for graduates
since jamalludin already said "we are going big in this field".i take it that he is saying lots of jobs in this field will be created by Malaysian government.so why not?
Can you work in the biotechnology sector with such a degree?
Yes!

[gal_flower]

Perhaps Biovalley~! I am not too sure about this, but I think you can negotiate with JPA.

ElansarGelmir, what you think will be the ideal job for you?

erm...tads wad everyone tells me:work in biovalley. haha...but i guess there r other options...biotech_gizmo told me there's a more business side to biochem, as in not so research-based. tads probably more my kind (i'm majoring in biochem too!). i prefer to meet n interact wif ppl rather than facing the microscope most of the time. anyways, cyberjaya, u shud noe by now tad the degree u obtain wif ur intended major may not be necessary to apply for a particular job. a bit ambiguous ya, but i'm sure i can persuade others to hire me for jobs like erm, pr officer, not bcoz i majored in tad but coz of my studying experience in US tad will give me an edge in handling ppl. tads juz an example.

[ElansarGelmir]

Perhaps Biovalley~! I am not too sure about this, but I think you can negotiate with JPA.

ElansarGelmir, what you think will be the ideal job for you?

Hmmm.... One of those reasons why i choose Biochemistry is because i'm interested in drugs. Not in taking drugs, but to handle them, create them, discover a new species/cure, and stuffs. Pharmacy was my initial choice of career path, but i realize that as a pharmacies, all i can do is to mix chemicals, label and sell them. Not that exciting to me though.

[pandaboy]

Perhaps Biovalley~! I am not too sure about this, but I think you can negotiate with JPA.

ElansarGelmir, what you think will be the ideal job for you?

Hmmm.... One of those reasons why i choose Biochemistry is because i'm interested in drugs. Not in taking drugs, but to handle them, create them, discover a new species/cure, and stuffs. Pharmacy was my initial choice of career path, but i realize that as a pharmacies, all i can do is to mix chemicals, label and sell them. Not that exciting to me though.

why not pharmacology?

[ElansarGelmir]

Hmm... Dunno... Maybe studying Biochem is more interesting?

[pandaboy]

Hmm... Dunno... Maybe studying Biochem is more interesting?

why do u think biochemistry is more interesting?

[ElansarGelmir]

Hmmm... Coz maybe i am stronger in Biomolecules of life? I dunno, but compared to studying DNA or eco, i think i'm stronger in this area of subject.

[pandaboy]

Hows everyone in Biochem doing?

After two months studying this course, now I realised why everyone is saying that Biochemistry is one of the toughest course. The bad thing is I have to study Chemistry...(I dont know why, I used to like Chemistry all the while...up to Alevels, but now I dont have the interest in it at all). Chemistry is really making me stress man.

Anyway, kinda worried about the job prospect. I asked a person related to biotech sector, and he said a Biochem degree is better than Biotech because it has a wider scope as compared to Biotech.

I'm thinking of taking business as my optional unit in my 2nd year....feel like wanna involve in a business related biochem job... But what type of jobs will I end up with? To get a research based job, a postgraduate qualification is compulsory I guess.....dont feel like continue studying any higher anymore.... :(

[gal_flower]

To graduate as a Biochem major in University of Chicago is one of the hardest things to do. All you have to tell people is that you're majoring in Biochem and they'll give you that 'oh my gosh, you're crazy' look and wish you good luck! It has the most major requirements to fulfill so one basically has not much options to do other electives because one simply has no time! egad! Electives are the most interesting parts of education in the States! Sigh~ of course, the endless strings of different variants of chemistry to take, not to mention physics and bio and also math. I hope I survive my 4 years!!!

p(^^)q
To everyone who's majoring in Biochem, don't give up!!!

[ElansarGelmir]

To graduate as a Biochem major in University of Chicago is one of the hardest things to do. All you have to tell people is that you're majoring in Biochem and they'll give you that 'oh my gosh, you're crazy' look and wish you good luck! It has the most major requirements to fulfill so one basically has not much options to do other electives because one simply has no time! egad! Electives are the most interesting parts of education in the States! Sigh~ of course, the endless strings of different variants of chemistry to take, not to mention physics and bio and also math. I hope I survive my 4 years!!!

p(^^)q
To everyone who's majoring in Biochem, don't give up!!!

So to speak, I think Biochem majors in other universities are suffering from the same fate as well. Especially in Brandeis. To graduate as a Biochem major, we have to take a total of 21 courses (including labs, which counts for 0.5 course each). And worst is, the lab itself takes 6 hours of class a week. Whoa.... Like my Chem class now, I have to take a total of 11 contact hours (5 hours for Chem studies and 6 hours for lab). And on top of that, we got to take Physics (if I know I'm required to take Physics i won't major in it at the first place... I there's no Physics in BIOCHEMISTRY), and as i'd mentioned, 21 other classes. Whoa, can mati arr!!!

Pandaboy, i understand why u are dispassionate about the higher level of chemistry. me too... I dunno why, but my guess is it got more and more physics oriented than the one we've learned in high school. We have to learn everything in molecular levels, and sometimes, in the nuclear level (the first chapter for my chem is nucleogenesis, which is not very helpful in helping me to like Chem more). And we have these complicated measurements with weird mathematical figures like 0.340281 moles of something or 0.001382 amu which u aren't sure that u are right or wrong (coz in high school, we are used to get nice rounded answers to most of the chemistry questions). I don't know what's ur reason is, but i think those are the factors that contribute to my dislike of chemistry here.

[pandaboy]

Yeah, I find it very difficult to understand the concepts in chemistry.....maybe it's because it has a lot of physics in it... I dont know. I realised that I like Physiology the most...hmph! Biochemistry has too many things to memorise! Terrible..I hate this...Are u guys in US have open book exams?

[gal_flower]

Not me, at least. We don't even use cheat sheets. I hate chemistry when it starts to delve into physics. I HATE PHYSICS!!! No offense, but it's a personal feeling. So the physics part just ruin things between me and chemistry. And Biochemists have to take physics too...I didn't know that =(

p(^^)o

[SpRInG]

but actually, the higher you go, you will find out that, actually biology, chemistry, and physics, they're all so related, they're all so linked and there's never a distinct discrimination between these science subsets

[gal_flower]

Now, doesn't that make you feel that you have been cheated the whole time? :wink: :wink: They separated the subjects, categorized classes based on the subjects, etc...and now, we find out it's so inter-related that you cannot do one without the other!

[pandaboy]

but actually, the higher you go, you will find out that, actually biology, chemistry, and physics, they're all so related, they're all so linked and there's never a distinct discrimination between these science subsets

Yeah, my chemistry tutor said the same thing too. We need to use physics to explain Chemistry, and we need Maths to explain Physics....bla bla bla...they are all related... :(

[SpRInG]

LOL... cheated? hehe... maybe.... but not really.... koz that's the way, for us to sort of like master the foundation, and then to achieve something even greater...

that is wat scientists today are still achieving, how to really 'combine' all of that...

and all in all, all that i see is the beauty of science, the beauty of creation, that there is unity in diversity... that's the beauty don't u think so? :D

[phantom]

Not me, at least. We don't even use cheat sheets. I hate chemistry when it starts to delve into physics. I HATE PHYSICS!!! No offense, but it's a personal feeling. So the physics part just ruin things between me and chemistry. And Biochemists have to take physics too...I didn't know that =(

p(^^)o

the reason why u need to take physics is becoz apart from da inter-twine of science branches, most biochem major will like to be a doc. in order to enter medical school,one has to take MCAT and MCAT tests higher standard of physics,that's why even if u r a bio,pre-med,chem major, u still need to take tougher physics than those studying mircrobio or biotech.

toldcha,the higher the uni ranking,the more u gonna suffer.just dont change u major,keep striving,it takes time to build strong foundation.

plus,dont u feel grateful that our education system divide sciences into physics,chem and bio becoz if we combine them all together like in PMR science, we failed to see the micro view of each branch.
plus,combining will lead to a ppl hating science in the whole. when we divide them,some ppl tend to like physics and chem,but hate bio. others love bio and chem,hate physics.some other ppl love physics and add math and loathed chem and bio.
so these people hate one branch of science,not sciences in the whole.

[DecentMerson]

but actually, the higher you go, you will find out that, actually biology, chemistry, and physics, they're all so related, they're all so linked and there's never a distinct discrimination between these science subsets

i agree ... i'm taking Astronomy as my electives.... there, we kinda talk about how chemistry -> biology....

and there're hell lot of physics in Astronomy.... but didn't really show how these 3 fields are related to one another...meaning, can someone give a vivid example about how physics, chemistry and biology??

[pandaboy]

the reason why u need to take physics is becoz apart from da inter-twine of science branches, most biochem major will like to be a doc. in order to enter medical school,one has to take MCAT and MCAT tests higher standard of physics,that's why even if u r a bio,pre-med,chem major, u still need to take tougher physics than those studying mircrobio or biotech.

toldcha,the higher the uni ranking,the more u gonna suffer.just dont change u major,keep striving,it takes time to build strong foundation.

plus,dont u feel grateful that our education system divide sciences into physics,chem and bio becoz if we combine them all together like in PMR science, we failed to see the micro view of each branch.
plus,combining will lead to a ppl hating science in the whole. when we divide them,some ppl tend to like physics and chem,but hate bio. others love bio and chem,hate physics.some other ppl love physics and add math and loathed chem and bio.
so these people hate one branch of science,not sciences in the whole.

Is that what the students in US has been doing? From what I know, to get into medical schools in US, one has to have a degree. So usually students will take up Biochem degree to get to medical schools?

I realised that I am losing interest in Biochemistry as well! I have to do two compulsory subjects (Biochemistry and Chemistry) and one optional subject (of which I chose Physiology). Now that I started to lost interest in Biochemistry, this is worrying me! Sigh... :cry:

Have you all started learning glycolysis, citric acid cycles and all those metabolism reactions? Man, I get dizzy after looking at all the molecule names and reactions... :? I was thinking... OMG, how am I to remember all those names! :x

[ElansarGelmir]

I dun have open book exam either. And no cheat sheets. That doesn't make life easy. And there are so many kia su ppl who knows every syllabus in the Chem and yet they take it again, increasing the class average grade. I can't stand physics either, coz even though how hard I have studied and thought i pandai liao, i still can't solve the test problems. To Physics genius out there, any tips about what do we need to focus on in problem solving questions?

Have you all started learning glycolysis, citric acid cycles and all those metabolism reactions? Man, I get dizzy after looking at all the molecule names and reactions... I was thinking... OMG, how am I to remember all those names!

Haha... those are pieces of crumbs. I can even remember how many Nicotinamide or Flavine Adenine Dinucleotides involved in Krebs Cycle and blah blah. Just go to Singapore and they will nail it down in ur head. Too bad we didn't do much of this in INTEC.
P.S. if u think this is bad, wait till u got to photosynthesis

[pandaboy]

I dun have open book exam either. And no cheat sheets. That doesn't make life easy. And there are so many kia su ppl who knows every syllabus in the Chem and yet they take it again, increasing the class average grade. I can't stand physics either, coz even though how hard I have studied and thought i pandai liao, i still can't solve the test problems. To Physics genius out there, any tips about what do we need to focus on in problem solving questions?

Yeah la...no open book, not even formula sheets. Darn... I dont understand what u mean by kia su people knowying every syllabus??

Haha... those are pieces of crumbs. I can even remember how many Nicotinamide or Flavine Adenine Dinucleotides involved in Krebs Cycle and blah blah. Just go to Singapore and they will nail it down in ur head. Too bad we didn't do much of this in INTEC.
P.S. if u think this is bad, wait till u got to photosynthesis

Photosynthesis is just as bad... The numbers of NAD and FAD and their reduced forms...ok la, can remember. But all those damn names in every reactions.... You sure you got all of them in your head? :roll:

[ElansarGelmir]

Ok, we have people who knows everything in the syllabus but yet they are still taking the class. Now, that is just not fair. Go on to other classes! Are they trying to get bonus As?

[nxwen]

Whoa, now I am quite worried. Biochem was one of my choices, others are biotech, pharmacy, chemistry etc. Anything chemistry based or bio down to the molecular level. Wat bout Biomedical Science? Any details?

Wah, must take physics, scary. I know in S'pore engineering student must take bio. So, I guess wat goes around comes around.

I hope that STPM bio will give me a good base. We are supposed to know how many NAD, FAD, NADP are involved in Krebs cycle and photosynthesis. Guess that's why they said STPM is one the toughest exam in the world. Lots to memorise.

Anyway, wat uni in the US are famous for this type of courses?

[chenchow]

I dun have open book exam either. And no cheat sheets. That doesn't make life easy. And there are so many kia su ppl who knows every syllabus in the Chem and yet they take it again, increasing the class average grade.

How come it is not open book? I believe all of those kind of courses over here are open books, or at the very minimum with a few pieces of cheat sheet. It does not make sense to make students memorizing it.

Pandaboy, not necessary you need a biochem major or anything like that. Any major would do, even English or any engineering major would work fine.

nxwen, no need to worry too much. You would be fine. It is not true that engineering student have to take bio, at least they do not need to take any bio in their A Level.

Memorizing does not make a test tough.

[nxwen]

Well, I remember that in NTU for civil engineering, students need to study bio in their 1st year or something. Heard this from a talk by NTU.

It is not the memorising that makes it tough. It's the extensive syllabus. They can test us on anything under the sun (even out of syllabus). We learn much more than A-levels or any other pre-u courses.

I am juz worried that I will lose interest too as I go along.

[ElansarGelmir]

I dun have open book exam either. And no cheat sheets. That doesn't make life easy. And there are so many kia su ppl who knows every syllabus in the Chem and yet they take it again, increasing the class average grade.

How come it is not open book? I believe all of those kind of courses over here are open books, or at the very minimum with a few pieces of cheat sheet. It does not make sense to make students memorizing it.

Pandaboy, not necessary you need a biochem major or anything like that. Any major would do, even English or any engineering major would work fine.

nxwen, no need to worry too much. You would be fine. It is not true that engineering student have to take bio, at least they do not need to take any bio in their A Level.

Memorizing does not make a test tough.

Not all universities work the way Cornell works. After all, I think it is better not to have cheat sheets or open book exam because the questions will be easier (you don't have to spend time referring to this and that, as the exam level will be set to a certain difficulty that won't require you to know every word in the book)...

and nxwen, memorizing the no. of NAD/FAD is one of the easiest part in Biomolecular Chemistry / Biochemistry of life... Try writing an essay on how cheratines are formed, or why does it have a higher tensile strength than a celullose? Haha. . . that will give u a big headache.

[pandaboy]

How come it is not open book? I believe all of those kind of courses over here are open books, or at the very minimum with a few pieces of cheat sheet. It does not make sense to make students memorizing it.

I agree...doesnt make any sense at all asking the students to memorize. I'll forget it anyway after the exam....not that I wont refer to books anymore when I go out to work. Even my tutor, a Reader in Biochemistry needs to refer to book when I asked him some questions before.

Pandaboy, not necessary you need a biochem major or anything like that. Any major would do, even English or any engineering major would work fine.

Are you refering to my question about getting a medical degree in US? Wow..any major will do? How come it's like that? I thought we have to study something related to medicine. [/quote]

Well, I remember that in NTU for civil engineering, students need to study bio in their 1st year or something. Heard this from a talk by NTU.

It is not the memorising that makes it tough. It's the extensive syllabus. They can test us on anything under the sun (even out of syllabus). We learn much more than A-levels or any other pre-u courses.

I am juz worried that I will lose interest too as I go along.

My summer exam is exactly like what you said. 3 hours, 5 essays to write. They can test about anything! :cry:

and nxwen, memorizing the no. of NAD/FAD is one of the easiest part in Biomolecular Chemistry / Biochemistry of life... Try writing an essay on how cheratines are formed, or why does it have a higher tensile strength than a celullose? Haha. . . that will give u a big headache.

Nah....that's not as difficult as the cycles (like photosynthesis Krebs cycle, urea formation, citric acid cycle)....really crazy. Need to memorise all the chemical structures..that's the worse part. Dont you think that part is difficult? It's definitely testing our memorising power instaed of anything else!

[Hoong]

I am a third year biochemistry major. This forum might be outdated already but I just want to clarify something.

Mec Engineering programs that make taking bio compulsory are actually more "up-to-date" program that help preparing the students in designing biotech related instruments and mechines. More and more major projects like genomic sequencing, large-scale protein sequencing and microarrays are emerging. Thus a mec engineer that has some background in biology might be able to find some money in those field. I have met some mec engineers who are working for biotech companies or starting a company recyling old bio-related machines.

While a biochemist can survive without physics, there are some limitations doing experiment using purely biochemical approach. Since thermodynamics seems to explain everything in life, and since most bio-molecules bear charges and would therefore have electrostatics, and sometimes even electromagnectics properties, knowing some phsyics will allow biochemists to design simple experiments and learn more about their subject of interests. That's why most biochemistry programs require their biochemistry majors to take some physics courses.

People who are starting to lose interest in biochemistry should try to diversify your college experience. I have seen malaysians who major in biochemistry now doing phd degrees in a whole different field (religious studies for instance) in very prestigious schools or now working in other fields.

[jeremy3232]

i wanted to do pharmacy as i'm interested in Bio and chemistry and i seriously don't like Physics...

since i know that even Biochemistry major needs to study Physics, i'm now abit worried coz do i need to study Physics in order for me to complete my A-Levels or degree?

[Hoong]

Biochemistry and pharmacy are very different fields in reality. Biochemistry is the study of macromolecules in cells, eg RNA, DNA, proteins, by using in vitro system. Say you purify your favorite macromolecule--usually a disease-causing one when it is mutated-- to the purity of >95%, and test its activity, its coupling reactions, its interactions with other molecules in test tubes to find out its functions in cells. Depending on what one is looking at, one might also want to look at its structure, or study the detailed movement of each molecules in the active site of the macromolecule. These studies then allow us to design drugs to regulate this macromolecules when its goes wrong (that's when one gets sick).

Pharmacy is the study of the making, the application, and the prescription of drugs. Indeed, a good background in organic chemistry is very important. In general you want to learn to recognize drugs, understand how and why they works, how much one should takes, the side effects and everything along that line. Along the way, one might need to take an introductory biochemistry or physiology course or two, some electives to learn how drugs are manufactured and ethics in pharmacy, to gain a larger picture of what you are doing. A more related field to pharmacy would be pharmacology, which is the science of drug making. Pharmacologists oversee or involved in research to streamline the processes of drug designing, screening and production.

For a pharmacy degree, I do not think physics is a common part of the requirements for graduation in most institutions. There might be exceptions. You should find out from the programs that you are interested in. Physics might be more helpful for pharmacologists who are involved in making sure the tablets for instance in making sure if a drug os crystallized in the correct lattices whose properties would ensure proper solubility properties in the body. This in turn makes sure that drugs work properly.

Hope these comments help.

[Hoong]

Pandaboy, not necessary you need a biochem major or anything like that. Any major would do, even English or any engineering major would work fine.

Are you refering to my question about getting a medical degree in US? Wow..any major will do? How come it's like that? I thought we have to study something related to medicine.

[/quote]

What chenchow said is absolutely right. One only has to satisfy some premed requirements which include one year of general chemistry, one year of organic chemistry, a semester of cell bio, a semester of genetics, a year of physics, and a year of calculus. As long as one has taken those subjects, one is free to major in anything, be it performing arts or spanish.

On top of that one has to take MCAT which is the admission test to medical school. Usually, those "competitive" medical school applicants also have had some experiences in research and shadowed doctors for at least a year in the hospital.