Medicine in Ukraine, Russia, other part of the world

[Dandelion]

Hi, i'm hoping that those studying in Ukraine and Russia particularly could help me in this. i would like to know how is it really like living and studying there? Would appreciate if you can give me your views as I'm torn to study there or stay in malaysia.(U probably heard how hard it is now to get into medic here since everyone is a top scholar) :)

[babygirl]

i'm also seeking these information...but i think u can go to
[SIG] Every Little Thing About Medicine

[Rhys_lion]

hey there....

i'm interested in doing med in ukraine as well... i heard that the lessons r conducted in russian language. since its such an alien language to us here in malaysia, i wonder isit difficult to cope?

[kelvinlym]

When I started the German course, I didn't know a word of German (except Gesundheit).

Don't worry, it'll grow on you.

[Dandelion]

Thanks a lot for replying....still befuddled about Ukraine though. if you know anyone who studies there or in russia, guide them here!!!!

[chenchow]

You can contact phyxsius , this is her nick. She is in ReCom. Perhaps you can message her.[/i]

[bill]

my fren n me oso curious about the quality n style of learning n teaching.but i tink the teachers use English to teach students n we r encouraged to learn Eng coz hav to talk wf people there.but do we need to learn Latin language n physical training?i c in 1 page bout CRIMEA U there.can we go there after stpm?is the degree there accepted in other country like Australia n UK?

[Dandelion]

Argh!!! The pre medical(foundation) course's in Russian!!!!! is that gonna be trouble?

[Riang]

Hi, I posted this input in another topic titled "JPA Fumbles". as follows:
"Actually I wonder how MMC and LAN can accredit ANY university as being of a high standard when NOT EVEN ONE university in Malaysia is accreditated by WHO until now? In Russia as of 2004, there are several top universities recognised by the WHO and have even produced Nobel / other scientific award winners as individuals or as teams. That is why Russia, also China and Japan now, which were formerly Iron Curtain, Red Curtain and Bamboo Curtain countries (former closed economies) are determined to get as big a market share as possible before the pricing goes higher.

I have also found that the majority of the Russian Universities medical graduates can be employed or can do their specialisation in US, UK and Europe easily because their degrees are recognised compared with medical graduates from Malaysian Unis which can only go to the traditional unis in UK/Aust and some other limited places.

I wonder when are we going to throw away the shackles of our British "colonisation" and look at the better places of educational excellence which Malaysians have never been able to go to before because those countries - eg China, Russia, Scandinavian countries - were not open to us foreigners before despite their great traditions of excellence in science and medicine for so many centuries.

I also recall that when I was younger anything Japanese was "bad and low quality" eg. comments such as "kereta tin Milo" were common. But look which country is laughing to the bank now?
learning anther language is just a norm for most countries which value their own culture. Even in Malaysia foreign students in IPTAs must know some Bahasa.

Sorry, just my two cents worth. Riang.

[The_Observer]

I would not be bothered with any Ukrainian or Russian universities except Moscow or Mosocow State Uni.
Those 2 produce lots of good stuff...but for the rest...forget it.

Don't deceive yourself, if ppl have a choice between a Ukrainian grad or a UK grad...you know who they will pick...

Another thing, because of British influence on our history it is easy to understand why American antipathy towards the British also falls on us. Just happen so that the US is the most powerful country now thus they can say or do anything they want. 1 century ago, it was the other way around. Dun worry, our time will come!

[pandaboy]

I think this thread and such should be moved to SIG(Special Interest Group) for Medicine. Please continue discussion there.

You can join the SIG for Medicine at the link below:
http://recom.homelinux.org:8000/~recom/modules.php?name=SIG&id=Medicine

You need to join the SIG before you can view this thread.

[ Topic moved to SIG Every Little Thing About Medicine. ]

[pandaboy]

Maybe we can list out those unis in Ukraine and Russian that use English as their main language?

[The_Observer]

The thing is...there is none. Period.
I am sure the professors speak English...but as the main medium of teaching...not in the near future. But it will, since Malaysia now starts to shift its scholarship students to Russia and Ukraine.
<The_Observer spits at the idea>

So, future Russians and Ukrainians...better brush up on ur Russian and Cyrillic. You will be in for a lot of govno.

[pandaboy]

The thing is...there is none. Period.
I am sure the professors speak English...but as the main medium of teaching...not in the near future. But it will, since Malaysia now starts to shift its scholarship students to Russia and Ukraine.
<The_Observer spits at the idea>

So, future Russians and Ukrainians...better brush up on ur Russian and Cyrillic. You will be in for a lot of govno.

Huh? Are you sure? If I'm not mistaken, there are medical unis in Ukraine or Russia in which the medium of teaching is fully in English. I cant remember which uni though. But the students there still need to learn Russian and etc because they need to communicate with the patients in Russian most of the time. Anyone can confirm about this?

[amirulnazri]

Yes I can definitely reply to that. I fully agree. The whole educational course is in English Language, period. And the lecturer is really good in English, there's no denying that. For example my Biophysics lecturer speaks British slang! Now how good is that... you only need Russian in 4th year afterwards. That's for treating Russian patients.

[The_Observer]

Well then...unless you have a good command of Russian, you would be fine.

If not, your clinicals will be hell of a time. Any translators?
Better brush up on your Russian because your clinicals are your real medical training. I think you already know that.
Plz don't mind me.

[Steppe]

Please check the following for medical studies in Indonesia:

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/9/5/education/8652692&sec=education

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/9/5/education/8652675&sec=education

http://www.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/9/5/education/8815255&sec=education

[tracyl]

currently studying in russia for medicine. yup,it is taught in english if u go for the english faculty. Yup, for the clinical years u will have to use russian to communicate with the patients.
But, u will be taught russian since yr 1 plus, the ppl here don't speak a bit of english. So, u will have to learn russian anyway b4 the clinical years. Or else u can only sit at home n do nth at all.
So, if u are worrying about the language... don't be!!!
but the system here is really different from m'sia.. everything needs memorising.. or mayb it's the medical course.. i've no idea.. so.. Think and consider hard b4 u decide....
Good Luck!!

[dv]

you must be dumb.cos only dumb students end up in bogus medical schools in russia.
when you return to malaysia,you will soon find out how incompetent the undergrad studies in russia has prepared you for the real world of medicine.

[tracyl]

ok, so now i'm actually dumb for being here. okie, so u've been here? u graduated? u found out that it's incompetent? thanks for telling me and sorry that i came here.

[SHuLy]

tracyl, don't bother about dv's comments. he/she is probably a sadist who happened to cross this thread. he/she is only registered as a 'guest'.


though to a certain extent, it is true that the entry requirements for russian medical schools are lower, there are students there whom i know... all brainy ones! haha.

[byzhanii_bogn]

yep tracyl, don't be bothered, he's just a guest anyway.

i do think that russia offer one of the best medicine school in the world.

my friends sis is in moscow medical academy...

[tracyl]

thanks, i'm ok with it... appreciate u guys for consoling me~

[byzhanii_bogn]

a couple of my friends are planning to do med in ukraine. but there's this guy i met from school (my senior) keeps on saying this is not good, that is bad... complainign every single thing there...

do u think he's actually discouraging us to go there, because if more going there, it'll give him the competition after we got back...lol

[tracyl]

i c,i take u r from greenroad?
memang there are bad things here la, but as a first year student, i haven't much to say yet.
But, if u really want to be a good doctor, i guess nth could stop u from being 1.

[SHuLy]

well, i do agree with you tracyl, that determination and perserverence will make you a good doctor...

i would like to add here as well, that sometimes, the university which you are studying in do play an important role here whereby a student is influenced by his/her surrounding...and hopefully, it is able to maximise the student's potential...

[byzhanii_bogn]

8O HOW DO YOU KNOW???

[SHuLy]

opportunities.

[byzhanii_bogn]

can't be too coincidental... i'm from GR yea...

[babygirl]

hi.. i'm currently studying in russia too..under foreign student department..english as teaching medium..

some say that the standard here is not that high.. since i'm only first year student..i've nothing to comment about this..
language problem.. ppl here hardly speak english..but some professors do speak quite fluent english..at least understandable..
just like tracyl said, the clinical year is in russian..now we've clinical part in our russian language subject.. hope that this will help.. learning new language surely is not that easy..so does learning russian language..
the system here is quite different from malaysia's..but everthing has its pros n cons..depends on how u think..

[SHuLy]

GR?

[huipen]

Hi everyone. I am new here.. Found this useful site when I googled to search for some info on medicine courses. I was just wondering how can we apply to Ireland for medicine? Do we have to apply through the UCAS form too? How much would it be to study medicine in Ireland? Maybe as compared to UK or cheaper? Thanks in advance for all your help.

[jc]

Well , I'm new here too... Just wondering anyone here from Indonesia who wants to share his/her experience about medical course there ....[/quote]

[SHuLy]

hey there huipen,

currently, studying medicine in ireland is more expensive than UK. this is with regards to the tuition fees. i'm not sure if there is going to be any increase for UK universities. as for the expenses there, i'm not too sure about this matter.

it also depends on which university that you are applying to. some universities accomodation is higher than others.

for british unis, you can get more information in their prospectus, which is quite complete. as for irish varsities (disregarding RCSI), the prospectus is rather 'incomplete'. there are only 6-8 pages of information. Aedumus Consultancy is handling the applications and stuff about irish unis (IUMC).

[huipen]

Hi Shuly,

Thanks a lot for your info! Wow, I did not know that tuition fees in Ireland would be much more expensive than UK!! Anyway, to apply to Ireland, I have to go through the Aedumus Consultancy and not through the UCAS. Can i know how to contact the Aedumus Consultancy? In your opinion, how would the Irish medical universities fair against the UK counterparts?

I understand that in orer to apply to Oxbridge and UCL, one has to sit for the BMAT test. Where and when is the test held and how much would it costs? How is the paper like? Is it very tough? Is there any way to get hold of some of the past or sample papers?

Thanks a lot for all your help!! I deeply appreciate them.

[SHuLy]

hi huipen,

i'm not sure if it is MUCH more expensive, but i calculated for this year (and it also depends on the current exchange rate for GBP and Euro) that the tuition fees in Ireland universities is more expensive. I forgot the exact amount though. I'm not too sure about the daily expenses in ireland compared to UK either. the university prospectus is like i said before, not very helpful..!

i did not apply to Oxbridge. perhaps there are others here who can give you a better view on the BMAT test. i think there is a sample test paper. if i am not mistaken, it tests you on scientific knowledge and there is an essay that you will need to write. check out: bmat.org.uk.


yesterday, the Sun newspapers had articles on studying in UK. i find that section pretty interesting.

go to: iumc.com.my

Representative in Malaysia
Aedumus Consultancy Sdn Bhd
Suite 5.18 Level 5 (North Block) The Amp Walk,
218 Jalan Ampang
50450 Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
Telephone: 603-2163 2302
Fax: 603-2775 2889
Email: iumc@<hidden>


where are u studying currently?

how do the varsities fair eh? hmm, this i am not too sure. some say that medicine in Ireland is good. people are used to connect RCSI with ireland. Aedumus deals with IUMC, namely, cork, galway, trinity and Uni College Dublin. you'll have to apply separately for RCSI. i do not know how to compare. i have no idea how different it is studying in ireland and in UK. can't help you in that sense. sorry!

First of all, let me introduce myself briefly. I'm currently reading medicine in a university in Moscow under JPA scholarship. Enough intro? I think so. Well, I read through some entries about medical education in Russia in this forum and I feel that I have to express some of my thoughts here. Before I continue further, I would first like to apologise for my command of English language. After a few years in Russia, I would say that my English has deproved significantly. Well, maybe it's my own fault but I dare say that living in Russia has also played a great part.

First of all, I can summarise everything into a short 3 words: I feel cheated! Yeah, I felt cheated when I first arrived in Moscow, I'm still feeling cheated now and I think I'll continue to have this feeling until I finish my whole course, maybe even for my whole life. The mass media does not always give precise information about this ex-Communist country. I was told one story before I came to Moscow and when I reached, I see a totally different story. I should really stress the fact that there're loads of private students who're studying in Russia, some came long before the Malaysian government recognised these Russian diploms. And if you guys don't understand what private students mean, then I can explain. Private students are those who use their own/parents' money to pay for their whole course without aid from sponsorship bodies like JPA. So when people pay money for a degree, for sure they will 'brag' about how good their univ is. So the term "quality" might be distorted. These people want other people to think that they graduate from a good univs. About agents, I mean come on, these fellows are trying to make a living so they also can brag a lot about the univ they're promoting. My piece of advice, NEVER trust the media so easily! I still remember a newpaper article saying something like "why go to UK for a medical degree when you can get the same quality-education in Russia for a lot more cheaper?". This brings me to my second point. My mother always tell me, "You get what you pay for". So do you really expect that a rm700k medical degree to be similar with a rm150k one? I doubt it. You can never compare 700k with 150k. When you graduate from a 'cheap' univ, people stare at you differently.

In terms of teaching, univ in Russia is class-based unlike in Malaysia or UK where students go for lectures. This is one thing I like about the Russian system. Students get more attention from lecturers. But it all depends on the students themselves. You can't expect the lecturer to teach everything, so you'll have to ask questions and this is where you can interact and get more knowledge from your lecturers. In term of course contents, I would say it depends on ourselves because we can get most of the materials from reference books, so it's up to us whether to read or not to read. And during assessments, it's the lecturer themselves evaluating you. This is where a 'big' loophole appears, you can 'satay' your lecturers for good marks. Well, this is what some are doing and they're doing quite well during exams compared to their other counterparts. The Russian exam system invites a lot of bribery. Everytime the exam month comes, you'll see a lot of 'duit kopi' filling the lecturer's pocket. But this is not necessary if you 'satay' your lecturer well enough so the easiest route is to 'satay' your lecturer with the optimum burn throughout the whole year and at the end of the academic year, you can get an automatic pass. An automatic pass actually is some kind of a reward for those intelligent students who keep up excellent results throughout the whole year so they're exempted from exams. Actually, the univs are not the only corrupted ones around, almost all governmental departments in Russia are corrupted and the police force heads the list.

Field experience is also another lacking factor in Russian medical training. I got to know that people studying in UK or US get to do some summer training or other projects that contribute a lot to their course. Some might say hey, in Russia we get clinical exposure early in the 1st and 2nd year during general surgery or therapy lessons. Yes I agree, but I don't feel that I gain much during those lessons. I'm still doing pre-clinical studies so I can't comment on clinical years. Talking about clinical years is another nightmare because my command of Russian language is still very well below par. Russian is a difficult language as difficult as German with those cases and genders etc. I still remember Mr. Teoh telling us that Russian language is not that difficult. But hey, I'm practically still dangling here DREAMing about speaking Russian fluently. So all I can say is to all those who plan to come to Russia, make sure you can master the language, otherwise you're just wasting your time here. I stress that most Russians do not speak english. Even if you're lucky enough to meet one that does, that fellow will probably insist on speaking russian.

Speaking about Russians, they're really cold. I was told that smiling to a Russian is not a wise thing to do. They would think that you're laughing at them. But this is not the worst thing, the worst thing is the presence of a silly radical skinhead group that goes around town tormenting foreigners. There's nothing you can really do. Just take precautions and leave the rest to luck. Haha, if you're lucky enough, then maybe you'll get bash up by a group or two. But thanks to them, we get to holiday for a week during Hitler's birthday. This is the time when they celebrate Hitler's birthday by searching for foreigners and bashing or better killing them. These skinhead group is so daring then even send emails to embassies asking the ambasador to send all foreigners back home or they'll all be killed. They want only Russians on Russian soil. There're lots of cases where people are being bashed up but normally people just keep quiet because they know they can do nothing.

JPA's giving us 200usd a month. At first, it was quite enough until the Russians started to increase the price of everything. For example, the bus fare has increased almost 300% since my first year. The univ and hostel fees had also increased. Even the price of pastries in shops had increased significantly. The value of Russian currency is dropping. And we're still stuck with 200usd. Sigh, suffering? I just feel that we're being left out by JPA, we're dumped here to suffer and JPA is not doing anything to help us.

Personally, I feel that studying in Russia is not really that bad if you throw away all the expectations and everything other people says. The less you expect, then you won't feel too disappointed. The keyword here is adaptation, you just have to adapt the this new condition and everything will be fine. Complains? Forget it, just bear with it. My father keep on saying that studying anywhere is the same. I listen to him hoping it's true but deep down inside I know he himself know it's not true.

So anyone still interested to come to Russia? You might think that I criticise too much, but all I want to do is stop people from thinking that Russia is that good. If you don't think you're up for the challenge, better go elsewhere, forget about Russia. My advice: If you have other options, better forget about Russia. Otherwise, think really hard before making a decision.

[SHuLy]

that was a real eye-opener malaysianstuckinrussia...although i am aware that the quality of medical education is not as high as india/UK, but i never realised that it would be as you have pictured it to be..and yeah, i thought the media gave an 'accurate' perception.

this would be a good read for those contemplating to study medicine 5 years abroad or at IMU, and perhaps the twinning to UK programme..

[pangping1510]

ur personal experience and review really shocked me...guess i wil gotta choose ukraine more than russia then...at least my cousin sis is there now and she can give some advice to me... :lol:

[pandaboy]

I consider that now medicine has became a very popular field. Nearly everyone in my ex-class wants to be a doctor.Now to fulfil the high demand of it, flocks of Malaysians have been pursuing their dreams in countries like Russia n Ukraine!It boils down to the $$$$ factor! I've got to agree that its much more cheaper than any other private uni or college which offers medicine.Personally, i am also among those whose ambition is to be a doc and studying there would be my last resort that is if i can't get medic in IPTA.
I also know many Recomers wants to pursue medic.
anyone out there who has any further links regardin this topic plz feel free to post it on this thread. I would really appreciate if fellow recomers who are currently studying medic,dentistry ,engineering etc in Russia and Ukraine to share their experiece with us. Is it really safe there? Is it worth the money? Is it recognized? What is the difference between the edu system in Russia and Ukraine???
i need answers to ceased away my doubts n curiousity!

From a locked thread.

[Tralon]

Hi :D I'm a newbie here...

Sorry 2 hear story about "malaysianstuckinrussia" story...well, I'm studying med in India...No big deal either..Standard of living here is soooooooooo much expensive after india open up d economy..especially this city, Bangalore...Rent is almost double compared 2 KL..Food is d same cost as KL unless u r not very fussy about d restaurant..Public transport? Cheap but pathetic condition unless u wanna cramp like a sardin..get yr own bike..only d good thing is i like d weather though..air-cond city..20-24 C except during summer!

hey...good news. jpa increased our allowance from a mere 200usd to 700usd. but accomodation's on our own, jpa introduced the 60:40 system. if we rent a room outside, then we'll get the full amount, otherwise we get only 420usd. good news huh?

[titep_shin]

ds is the 1st day i register as a recom member...so i stil not sure about the function....so i suppose u all can c my msg?if can c...plz reply 2 let me know my message is posted :p

i am a STPM 2003 4.0 and an unfortunately 128..... i been offered indonesia and i rejected.after i rejected it due to financial problem, gov say it can converted to scholrship if v serve gov for 10 years...but it's too late.... i aldy reject it ....%$#@<hidden>!#$!@<hidden>

so i 'been offered biomedical science.... and steppee...ds is about biomedical science....
biomedical science is basicly a lab job. v study thing almost same with the medicine student,but v don't have a clinical years.for biomedic,v normally study 3 o 4 years,then v gian knowledge about science which are focus on medical field.v all helper of doctor.so v can do research,lab diagnostic work....etc....there are saying tht biomedical graduate can enter as 2nd or 3rd year medic stdent in oversea U,but i am not sure about it.

i drop my biomedical course in UM . i decide to fulfil my dream as a doctor since my childhood.so i aply for local University again and taiwan medicine and China medicine. the application for taiwan medicine is aldy close but for china,it will b close in 30 april,so any1 interested ,plz b quick.

China medicine degree is not recognised by MMC,so graduates have to go through a final year exam s the local U medicine student does.(anyone can plz help to tell me more about the examination and recognition question?)can any1 tell me more about medicin in taiwan and china oso ?

i dun like rusia...and i afraid i can't adapt in Rusia.so hopefuly i can gain entry of Taiwan medicine which are recognised by MMC or local U
pray for me plz :P

[Tralon]

If finance is yr main problem, and worry about recognition by MMA, u can always try thru d embassies..Like India High Comm or even Pakistan, it has 1 or two intake to MMA recognized college..But u have 2 act quick and apply..

But if u choose unrecognized ones, anywhere in d world, think hard. Passing d license xm is tough, and beside, d system of examination over here will be different, not 2 mention most of d cases for d xm in m'sia are quite dissimilar 2 what u will have studied. Ask any unrecognized grads around..U'll hear d same story...

Good luck anyway and all d best in yr application.

[saddam]

thank u for everything malaysianstuckinrussia and every1 here i wish to study either in ukraine or china. is china offerring any cheap medic course?i wish someone can help me, thanks

[libran_mei]

Hie everyone! I got rather interested with the topic currently at hand after reading a couple of comments on studying abroad in Russia, India and even Ukraine, thus intrigues me to post this up. My very own experience in Ukraine, a memorable journey taken in pursue of my dreams as a doctor. In a nutshell, I was accepted into a local university to take up medical right after my A levels. Of course, everyone in the house was overjoyed and relieved. Then, out of the blues, a close family friend introduced a relatively unknown university in Ukraine, an equally unheard of place.However, my parents got interested and started inquiring all kinds of sources, from government departments to friends. I, on the other hand had only one thought in mind. Nothing is wrong to take a path less traveled, as long as i have the chance to continue my tertiary education in the medical field. So, not long after, I was leaving on a jet plane,almost literally,to such a faraway land.

Crimea State Medical University is indeed not your typical Uk or Aus unis.Many face difficulties in adapting to their system of education, simply put, the academic results of a student rely heavily on the lecturers. The grading system is such, whereby a maximum mark of 5 is given to a perfectly answered oral test. 3 being the passing mark, and anything below requires a student to retake the test. The thing is, lecturers there are practically mind-set. In other words, they depend on first impressions. If you falter in your first attempt in a test, your following tests will be very much difficult, thus most probably your mark will remain as it is throughout the entire semester. A very discouraging fact indeed.

Another thing worth mentioning, is the politic-playings in the university, specifically the anatomy department. My anatomy lecturer happened to be a well-known and experienced surgeon, however, due to his strict demeanour and die-hard principles;he never ever accepts a gift of anysorts to avoid briberies, thus remains as an assistant professor only.The saddest part would be, his mere presence is thought to be a threat to the current professor's position as the head of the department. As anyone could guess it, there is rivalry between the two professors and constant degrading comments been lashed out at my poor lecturer. Sadly, at the end of the day, his students suffer the consequences. No matter how well the group prepares the scientific summary reports or the natural preparations (corpse preparations) , the lowest marks would always be awarded by the head of the department without even batting an eyelid. But amidst all these cold hard facts, we always felt thankful and grateful having him as our teacher, simply because of his sheer dedication and love towrds teaching. We gained alot of knowledge from him, mostly cannot be obtained from books but instead from many years of experience as a top surgeon in the country. He is superbly intelligent and patient, always pressing us to be among the best. He even made us learn Greek, Latin and Russian medical terminologies. Greek and latin are of great importance as many diseases are in those terms. Even aponyms( names of scientists who discover the particular anatomical parts or positions) are stressed in his classes as they are later used in real life.I really could not thank him enough.

besides all this, first years also have to endure long hours of classes every day, mostly from eight to six due to the many subjects such as biophysics, chemistry, russian, latin, anatomy, histology, politics, economy, bases of law, biology,physical training, and also history and culture of Ukraine. Some subjects may appear useless or even dumb but they are equally important, due to the fact that the lessons must be attended without fail or else, the students will not pass his/ her first year. I have to admit tht, I felt stressful at times, and with the workload, i almost constantly fell sick. With the weather being so crazily unpredictable as well, life there got tougher with each passing day. The hostel is nothing to be proud of either with the facilities seemingly old fashioned and non-functioning, and the facilities i meant are basic ones, the chairs, tables, beds, heaters and toilets. Oh well, bathing time is another memorable adventure, with the burning hot and icy cold water supplies, flowing at very odd times. In the middle of a bath, you wouldn;t be surprised to be jumping up all of a sudden due to the cut off of hot water and ice-cold water splashing down on you instead.

The basic comforts we used to enjoy back home, became mere dreams only. The things we craved and longed for, seemed so far away and impossible. The last thing we needed when we were so far away from home, would be a sense of insecurity. And with many cases of students being attacked by locals without reasons, we feared for our safety and each outing became full of suspicions and worries. All in all, I think for those who really want to be doctors, regardless of the hardships you are bound to face, then perhaps you could just survive Ukraine or even Russia. No high expectations or hopes, but just the knowledge and experience gained are prioritised, then go ahead and consider Ukraine as an option. I still have many wonderful friends who are going strong there, these great people are the ones, who gave me the strength to carry on during the toughest moments and lifted me up when I was in the pits; emotionally, physically and spiritually. As for me, my journey ended last month due to parents' wishes and will be continuing locally until further opportunities are given.

As one of my seniors used to say, any decisions made are never wrong or right, rather the subsequent consequences are to be beared. So, i can tell you, the choices i have made so far, are not regretted but appreciated because i was given the chance to choose. Best of luck to those who wish to take another step further in their lives, a step into the future.

[titep_shin]

hi....10s 4 sharing ur experience in ukraine medic.....

so u coming back 2 continue izzit?den have to come from the beginning point again?aren't it is wasted?

so wht do u plan 2 go continue ur studies?u mention u ll accepted in local U after ur A level....u mean u getting a private medical offers izzit?y dun u study locally and in stead going ukarine?

i m oso a student decide 2 study in medicne and i am waiting for the local University result....hope can enter local u and tht mean i can save lot of $ :p

any way....best luck of u ya! :p

[titep_shin]

hi saddam...
studying in china need bout RM 75000 for 5 years...
tht mean d study cost is almost same s china....
and the living cost is also almost same or little cheapper..
btu the most important is stduy 5 years only...
and as an chinese...i ahve 2 say tht i have much feeling to china if compare 2 rusia....at least v have the similiar culture and easy 2 adapt....
but sadly...v have 2 take an test after u cum back....so....hai3...
i oso can't decide go rusia o go china beter.....

[libran_mei]

yea..in terms of time, it is a waste. But, the knowledge and experiences gained, i would never trade them for anything in the world. the friendships i have made, have been one of the greatest joys in my life as well. the idea of starting all over again is quite scary n sad even, but i guess i hav no choice and i can only hope tht i can cope..anyhow, if theres anything else u would like to know, just ask k?take care and good luck to you too!=)

[titep_shin]

i can imagine ur feeling.....coz i same xperience v u

i am an STPM 2003 candidate who is 1 of the 128 CGPA 4.0 cannot get in medicine in Local U... i study 1 year of biomedic in UM...den i quit it....and apply ds year Local U medicine again...oso start from beginnig.... but my 1 year xperience is so nice n wonderful n i ll nvr 4get 4ever.... i now only can wait june the UPU result c can get in local U medic o not.....so v r both 1 2 do medic n v both now start from zero :p
hehe...best luck 2 u....gambate !

libran_mei, i wonder why you didn't go straight for the local medic course? was it because of financial problem? anyway, i really like reding your experience in ukraine.

my opinion: russian language is a very difficult language which has got a complicated grammer and cases. it's almost similar to german. the medicine course itself is a tough route to take. so to study medicine in russia or ukraine is a really difficult thing to do.

to me, if you plan to study in ukraine or russia, you'll have to be either a damn intelligent student or a damn hardworking student, anything in between means you're not good. you can't be good enough if you're just being mediocre.

Can I just say that the 'Guest' whose post appears immediately before mine is not the same person as myself, who has posted frequently (and perhaps too lengthily) under the same name.
To the other Guest - I came first, so change your username! :)

PS Agree it is difficult to study in Russia/the Ukraine because of the language barrier, among other reasons. That said, there are students in our local unis who find it hard to study in English and need to study with dictionaries beside their textbooks - thank goodness they can manage without having to speak in English to their patients nine times out of ten. I'm not casting aspersions on them in any way at all, but rather it reflects the quality of English language teaching we get in schools these days...

[Steppe]

I have 2 cousins (they are sisters) who are doing the medical course in Kruz? (not sure of the spelling) now, the elder one is in first year and the younger one in pre-med.

So far, we have not heard anything negative or perhaps they are not telling. I suppose they are coping. They have this financial constraint and felt that Russia is the only place that they could get a medical degree within the financial means. Hence, I think they will make it with determination.

I have met a senior schoolmate who said that if given a chance restrospective, she would not go or apply. However, she is second year now. She did mention that everything cost money....if you skip classes, if you are late for classes or assignments, etc. etc. This is the hidden cost and can come out to be quite a lot.

There is the other senior schoolmate who is doing well, in fact the second top of the class (the girl friend is the top student). When the dean came to visit our town for the promotion of doing medicine in Kruz, he gave a talk. Surprisingly, his English has deteriorated!

[skyguy]

I have about 5 friends studying in CSMU, 3 of them are in yr2 and 2 of them are completing thier pre-medic in june. What they say is totally opposite libran_mei's comment, they say that you could get malaysian food all the time like nasi lemak, mi goreng etc... at the cafe located at the ground floor of the hostel, cost of living is low, you need less than RM500 to survive, indeed there were some downside like what libran_mei said such as non-functioning facilities, but things like this are common in most universities hostel not to mention even UM,UKM and some local U's have this problem too. But the most important thing is you need to have a lot of courage and determination to study over there, they say if u think Ukraine is like UK,USA or Canada it will be best if you stay at home, the best thing for students planning to go there is make sure u keep low expectations and think of your main aim going there and that is to get you medical degree and come home.

[pangping1510]

hi libran mei, thx for sharing ur experience with us here :lol: may i ask u some questions? how many yrs hav u studied there? why did u come back? is the security problem that serious ? thx :D

[libran_mei]

haha!its kinda fun to read all ur comments..=)anyway, to clear ur doubts and to reiterate some,i WAS in the local uni(IMU) for two days *grins* cos my best fren is there, and she managed to sneak me in just to see how the lectures are conducted..and yes i was bound to be there in the sept intake 2004 as well, everything was planned including the PMS (partner medical school) to Aus..but I chose Ukraine over the well-planned idea, simply becos i wanted something new.something different and yep i got wat i wanted but luck wasn really on my side as i fell sick every month religiously until my parents had had enough and coming home seemed to be the only choice left..i was in Ukraine for six months only actually..

and yes of cos there are some food which seem malaysian,if u try hard enough not to compare to the original good ol m'sian's,then again they are edible. but sometimes u don just crave for nasi lemak or nasi ayam, but mom;s cooking=)

well..like i said also, there are people who adapt superbly well and everythings fine including my dear frens but we do share the same sentiments like the conditions of the uni and hostel..by the way, just to note, the cost of living has just increased.and the increase is inhumanely high due to the fact tht, more malaysians are there now, and well bussiness is blossomin at every corner and its only common now for a plate of fried rice to be priced at nine grivens.seriously, the rm500 no longer applies ,sad to say.

once again, i have to stress, goin to Ukraine or even Russia with the impression its like any other Unis around the world, is going to get you in a real big pot of hot soup. so, don rush things and try find out more, to those hopefuls out there.and no, i din go there having tht impression becos i was given quite a clear picture wat to expect beforehand by family friends and seniors.but unfortunately, just din turn out rite no matter how determined or courageous i was.

take care everyone and oh, celebrate mother;s day!=)

[Ruth_Lee]

Hi everyone,
I am a new user here. I would like to know izzit true that there are lot's of corruption happening between the student and lecturer as in to pass examination students need to pay their lecturer money? If that's the case than the MD that we obtain from ukraine it's not of any value right. And can i know what language do we have to use for the 6th year MD examination. I heard people saying we have to answer the question in russian language? And actually do we have to learn russian or ukrainian language for daily conversation. Do we also have to buy our own books or izzit given as free? Can i know more about the culture, people and the education there. Thanks for everyone.

[libran_mei]

hie Ruth..
well the fact is, corruption exists almost everywhere but unfortunately its more widespread in ukraine and russia. some cases are mild but there are also quite a number of severe ones.the worst would be when theres a feud goin on between the professors and students being dragged into the mess. the end result would be tht, during state exams for second years, whereby the exams are carried out orally by these professors, the only possible way to pass(not to mention to pass with flying colors) would be some well, not conventional methods. simply put, not just by diggin into ur books from first year stuff to second's but rather some "presents" to be your real passport to ensure a passing grade. but then again, i would say this is a case of minority becos i have also seen bright intelligent students reaping what they sowed at the end of the day, just by the conventional method.so, don lose all hopes yet.

and, its not invalid the degree obtained there becos you do learn things which are more than applicable in the future, i have known graduates from there who are doing well here in malaysia.you see, medical profession is not all about in the books or the place you have studied. for example, when i was there, my anatomy teacher always stressed tht the human body is a miraculous thing to study on becos there are so many different variations where some cannot even be found in books but only when you come across a body of such. i remembered very well when he described the many different possible positions of ovaries in humans. wow, tht was an eye opener.the conclusion is, i would never say the medical degree obtained there is invalid nor is it questionable, becos every student would have gone through the same or even more as others.

also, the sixth year students would have to undergo the last examination in English. but rest assured, your russian would be flawless by then also becos during your clinical years(4th to 6th) you would be conversing with patients in russian.you would gain all the practises you need. and yes theres a difference between ukrainian and russian language. ukrainian is more like you knoe, a dialect of russian, like hokkien or cantonese to chinese language. the funny thing is, in CSMU, 90% of the population is russians.so, everyone speaks russian there rather than ukrainian. and oh, no free books please.every single thing is to be beared fully by students.

the culture there is very different frm almost everywhere i have seen.the way they dress, speak and act really portray the very fact tht they are not yet exposed to the world out there. yeah, we had quite a shock at first when we tried to converse with the russians.not very friendly, some almost barbaric but as always theres a silver lining in every dark cloud, there are nice ones also,eg, my teachers. but my russian teacher did explain, tht russians cannot really tolerate us, foreigners not being able to speak their language.so, not being able to understnad us is to be angry at us.well, once you can manage the talkin skills eveyrthing should be easy.my frens and i made a point to brush up our russian so tht bargainin prices in market would be hell lot easier!

[Lee]

Thanks a lot libran_mei. I'll have more questions to ask only if i have successfully gotten my offer letter. I am still waiting for the offer letter for 1st year MD in csmu. Thanks and take care everyone.

[amirulnazri]

The thing is...there is none. Period.
I am sure the professors speak English...but as the main medium of teaching...not in the near future. But it will, since Malaysia now starts to shift its scholarship students to Russia and Ukraine.
<The_Observer spits at the idea>

So, future Russians and Ukrainians...better brush up on ur Russian and Cyrillic. You will be in for a lot of govno.

Huh? Are you sure? If I'm not mistaken, there are medical unis in Ukraine or Russia in which the medium of teaching is fully in English. I cant remember which uni though. But the students there still need to learn Russian and etc because they need to communicate with the patients in Russian most of the time. Anyone can confirm about this?

Of course ... in CSMU everything is conducted in English up until your fourth year, where it is OBLIGATORY to use russian because you're treating russian patients!

How in the heavens are the patients gonna speak English with you?

And one more thing I can assure you it is much more safer to do medicine in Ukraine, ie in Crimea specifically. Because the problem with Russia is that they are having a very big problem with racism - skinheads. They're very dangerous.

Here in Crimea they're a lot of other races as well, particularly Crimean Tatars, and they're muslims too.

[amirulnazri]

And about the food in ukraine, everything is here, nasi lemak roti canai and just about everything except SANTAN! So it's quite difficult to prepare nasi lemak lol...

[Lee]

Hey people i heard that our government is going to derecognised the medial degree from csmu. is this true?

[zchen]

[ i drop my biomedical course in UM . i decide to fulfil my dream as a doctor since my childhood.so i aply for local University again and taiwan medicine and China medicine. the application for taiwan medicine is aldy close but for china,it will b close in 30 april,so any1 interested ,plz b quick.

China medicine degree is not recognised by MMC,so graduates have to go through a final year exam s the local U medicine student does.(anyone can plz help to tell me more about the examination and recognition question?)can any1 tell me more about medicin in taiwan and china oso ? ] quote from previous page

wanna ask.if u intend to do medic in china,y bother to return to malaysia so early?if it were me,i'll work in china till the degree is recognised here<if i ever intend to return>.china has such a large population..surely it needs more docs?m i not right?

[cooldog]

I think there's great competition in China if you want to practise there, especially in the city. Unless you want to work in the rural areas, which I think there's a great demand for doctors there.

I have heard of people graduating from China but failed the recognition examination and finally going into some other jobs that has nothing to do with medicine. Eg, business. But, I heard they are doing quite well though they are not working as doctors.

In Taiwan, I heard that doctors and dentists get lawsuits filed against them easily if patients are not satisfied with their work. So, they work under a lot of stress. But, the pay in Taiwan is good. Don't know how true are all these.

[titep_shin]

wanna ask.if u intend to do medic in china,y bother to return to malaysia so early?if it were me,i'll work in china till the degree is recognised here<if i ever intend to return>.china has such a large population..surely it needs more docs?m i not right?[/quote]

wht u say r right....but i am a malaysian....i love my country....although I ,as a student of 128 can't get in local U medicine,(and perhaps my race) are mostly treated unfairly by the malaysia gov,i stil love malaysia .....ds is my country...so anyway I stil hope can back to malaysia and contribute to malaysia society....

my mum is a taiwanese....and i 've been to taiwan quite lot times...tht's y i have a special feeling to taiwan...and i m glad to pursueing my medical degree in taiwan....jz I duno can get in o not....anyway,the result ll out in 27 MAY,really hope i can get in taiwan U medicine course .....If not....may b i have to go to Rusia o China loh....

stil thinking Rusia o China beter ? :P

[zchen]

if you intend to return then russia.i suggested this as i did hear of a dentist in my town who did hv success in taiwan after pursueing his degree there.when he returned, of course he was treated like......and had to start from scratch again.

[Steppe]

There is this dentist in town who graduated from Taiwan and he has opened his own clinic. He is doing very well. The general opinions in town are the most popular dentists are the dental specialist - the orthodentist from UK and the other general dentist who graduated from Australia, then this dentist from Taiwan. I think the skill of the person matters.

If one wants to come back to Malaysia, one must do the 2 years internship in Malaysia in the case of graduating doctors (not too sure for dentist, presumably the same?). Then, followed by the compulsory 3 years in government service. If any doctor or dentist comes back later, the 3 years compulsory service are always there. This is required by the government to get the doctors or dentists to work for government and after 3 years, they are then allowed to open up their private clinic.

[selvi]

hei there. i was wondering r there any spm skool leavers who r goin to do their pre-u/pre-medical in ukraine n r planning to continue to do their medical degree in crimea state medical university. anyone out there who is interested, feel free to ask about csmu. i took my SPM last year. And this sept 2005 im goin to ukraine to do pre-u/pre-medical

[masdie]

a lot of top students and also below-average students want to become doctors. i don't understand if it's their life-long dream, or it's the job they thought is their dream job, or worse because it's the course for top students. and many resolve to going to cheaper places where sometimes quality is compromised to accomplish their dream. but frankly speaking, i look down on doctors graduating from indonesia, russia, ukraine, india and all the unheard of places. i don't trust them. and i won't trust them until they prove that they're able to treat patients like a good doctor. some of you might scold me for discriminating them but seriously i can't help it. it's not that i look high on doctors graduating from uk, us or even malaysia, but i think they had been trained and scrutinised well before graduating. i know there're also fat-asses able to graduate from these places but the fact that they graduate from these places is enough to give me a good impression. i also know that there're good one studying in russia, ukraine etc etc, but unless i'm sure, i prefer to take precaution. call me anything you want. but this is what i feel deep down inside.

[libran_mei]

what kind of proofs are you looking for anyway?define good doctors. by your standard, impressive "shows" put on by impressive doctors?oh no, maybe the color of the cert produced by these doctors?or perhaps even the quality of the paper used?i am definitely not sorry for saying how pathetic and low ur thinking is.keep your thoughts to yourself really, cause they are not even worth mentioning about.

[masdie]

what kind of proofs are you looking for anyway?define good doctors. by your standard, impressive "shows" put on by impressive doctors?oh no, maybe the color of the cert produced by these doctors?or perhaps even the quality of the paper used?i am definitely not sorry for saying how pathetic and low ur thinking is.keep your thoughts to yourself really, cause they are not even worth mentioning about.

haha, i see someone getting 'hot' over here. first of all, this is just my opinion, i'm not forcing everyone to believe in what i believe. to me a good doctor is one who is competent, can perform his duties well, one who knows what he/she is doing, knows his/her stuff well, and will be responsible for what he/she has done. i really don't like to see doctors who only knows how to prescribe medication for fever, cough and oh ya, MC. and seriously, i don't know you and i don't know where you're studying, i didn't even bother to look up your previous entries, but if you want to attack me, please, be more mature. don't fight like a small kid. you make me pity your ass. come up with facts and bust me.

[Lee]

hey is there any one who are pursuing their MD in kursk state medical university or who have applied for that medical university. can i know more about the university. thanks.

i did a search for the list of primary medical qualifications recognised for registration with the Malaysian Medical Council. the results? haha. it seems both mma and mmc have forgotten completely about their websites. mmc haven't updated their website since 27/09/2000 while mma since 2002.

- http://www.mma.org.my/info/recognised_colleges.htm
- http://www.moh.gov.my/mmc/schedule2.htm

[ChronoReaper]

what kind of proofs are you looking for anyway?define good doctors. by your standard, impressive "shows" put on by impressive doctors?oh no, maybe the color of the cert produced by these doctors?or perhaps even the quality of the paper used?i am definitely not sorry for saying how pathetic and low ur thinking is.keep your thoughts to yourself really, cause they are not even worth mentioning about.

haha, i see someone getting 'hot' over here. first of all, this is just my opinion, i'm not forcing everyone to believe in what i believe. to me a good doctor is one who is competent, can perform his duties well, one who knows what he/she is doing, knows his/her stuff well, and will be responsible for what he/she has done. i really don't like to see doctors who only knows how to prescribe medication for fever, cough and oh ya, MC. and seriously, i don't know you and i don't know where you're studying, i didn't even bother to look up your previous entries, but if you want to attack me, please, be more mature. don't fight like a small kid. you make me pity your ass. come up with facts and bust me.

Hey please la...... it's up to individuals to be a good Doc. Do you think the docs who graduated from Malaysia like UM are all that damn good?? Then why UK now have derecognised docs from UM??

[kintaro_kun]

do you think there's something wrong with the accreditation of medical schools by MMC? as i look through the list of accredited med schools, i see no schools from china, taiwan,south korea and japan. does MMC think that university of baghdad is better than peking university (i thought uni of baghdad was flattened in the war)? does MMC think that some university of some-name-i-cant-pronounce in algeria is better than university of tokyo?

there are more prestigious med schools in the far east than there are in the middle east, africa or malaysia in that matter.fudan university,seoul national university,uni of kyoto, waseda and many more are so much more prestigious than even the so called 100 year old UM(i denounce the 100 year old thing of UM :x ).

it seems to me that MMC reviews the med schools according to the region the uni is situated, not the quality. i thought the government was serious about attracting quality workforce (in particularly med professionals),by rejecting uni of peking and tokyo scholars for some people from nowhere, this policy IS SURE getting us nearer to wawasan 2020.

[zchen]

tokyo uni,kyoto uni,osaka uni,beijing uni,fudan uni are all supposingly better than many unis stipulated in the list by mmc and mma,according to uni ranking at least...


Rank Name ( source : the times,uk )
Country Score Citations
per paper
1 Harvard University US 200.00 32.2
2 Cambridge University UK 179.39 26.3
3 Oxford University UK 165.32 25.6
4 Imperial College London UK 139.28 14.4
5 Stanford University US 133.05 30.1
6 Johns Hopkins University US 116.48 26.3
7 Karolinska Institute Sweden 112.18 16.9
8 Yale University US 90.95 27.4
9 University of California, Berkeley US 84.7 33.0
10 University of California, San Diego US 78.84 29.1
11 Beijing University China 66.29 ?
12 Massachusetts Institute of Tech US 64.96 55.8
13 Tokyo University Japan 64.34 17.6
14 University of Melbourne Australia 63.09 12.3
15 University of Sydney Australia 62.65 11.5
16 Heidelberg University Germany 61.19 15.3
17 Duke University US 57.95 22.6
18 University of California, San Francisco US 57.82 29.2
19 University College London UK 57.56 20.5
20 University of Toronto Canada 57.54 18.3
21 Edinburgh University UK 55.87 20.1
22 University of California, Los Angeles US 51.08 20.0
23 Columbia University US 49.26 25.8
24 Cornell University US 48.39 23.1
25 National University of Singapore Singapore 47.20 11.7
26 Princeton University US 43.64 39.3
27 McGill University Canada 37.86 20.7
28 Kyoto University Japan 37.22 20.2
29 Helsinki University Finland 36.23 17.5
30 Kings College London UK 35.66 14.0
31 Vienna University Austria 35.09 11.1
32 Humboldt University Berlin Germany 34.66 12.0
33 ETH Zurich Switzerland 32.41 29.1
34 Australian National University Australia 32.18 13.6
35 California Institute of Technology US 31.42 45.8
36 University of Auckland New Zealand 30.91 12.2
37 Monash University Australia 28.79 12.7
=38 Frankfurt University Germany 28.22 13.2
=38 Munich University Germany 28.22 13.6
40 Boston University US 27.92 19.1
41 Washington University US 27.48 23.2
42 University of Chicago US 26.67 25.4
=43 Paris VI, Pierre and Marie Curie University France 26.53 13.0
=43 Strasbourg University France 26.53 22.7
45 Queensland University Australia 25.72 13.2
46 University of Michigan US 25.66 20.5
47 Free University Berlin Germany 25.40 14.8
48 Hong Kong University Hong Kong 25.28 8.0
49 Fudan University China 25.15 ?
50 University of Florence Italy 24.72 12.1
51 Erasmus University Rotterdam Netherlands 24.15 20.4
52 Gottingen University Germany 23.71 11.9
53 University of South Australia Australia 23.16 ?
54 Aarhus University Denmark 22.33 12.3
55 Washington University, St Louis US 21.04 27.5
56 Chinese University of Hong Kong Hong Kong 20.40 7.5
=57 Hebrew University of Jerusalem Israel 20.21 16.1
=57 Innsbruck University Austria 20.21 11.6
59 University of California, Davis US 19.77 15.4
60 Chulalongkorn University Thailand 19.53 ?
61 Otago University New Zealand 19.39 9.9
62 University of British Columbia Canada 19.36 16.4
63 Amsterdam University Netherlands 19.09 16.2
64 Vanderbilt University US 18.66 23.2
65 Catholic University of Louvain Belgium 18.52 15.7
65 Leiden University Netherlands 18.52 18.5
67 University of S?o Paulo Brazil 18.09 5.9
68 University of New South Wales Australia 17.97 11.0
69 Nottingham University UK 17.95 12.4
70 Nanyang University Singapore 17.84 ?
=71 Istanbul University Turkey 17.27 ?
=71 Technical University Munich Germany 17.27 13.8
73 Tokyo Medical and Dental University Japan 17.14 11.6
=74 New York University US 16.84 21.1
=74 Tubingen-Reutlingen University Germany 16.84 12.2
=76 Ecole Normale Sup?rieure, Paris France 16.70 27.8
=76 Lomonosov Moscow State University Russia 16.70 ?
=76 Paris I, Sorbonne France 16.70 ?
79 Liverpool University UK 16.14 10.5
80 Manchester University and Umist UK 15.87 15.4
=81 Adelaide University Australia 15.59 11.3
=81 Tsing Hua University China 15.59 ?
83 Tel Aviv University Israel 15.15 9.0
=84 Alabama University US 15.02 17.5
=84 Brussels Free University Belgium 15.02 14.0
=84 Glasgow University UK 15.02 15.8
=84 State University of New York at Stony Brook US 15.02 22.7
=84 Utrecht University Netherlands 15.02 16.0
89 Hong Kong University of Sci and Tech Hong Kong 14.34 ?
=90 Hokkaido University Japan 13.77 10.6
=90 Osaka University Japan 13.77 18.7
=90 University of Pennsylvania US 13.77 20.9
=93 George Washington University US 13.33 14.8
=93 Nanjing University China 13.33 ?
=93 Pennsylvania State University US 13.33 16.4
=96 Basel University Switzerland 13.20 20.2
=96 Gothenburg University Sweden 13.20 13.4
=96 Lund University Sweden 13.20 14.3
=96 University of Western Australia Australia 13.20 10.0
=100 University of Southern California US 12.90 19.0
=100 University of Texas at Austin US 12.90 20.8


but the courses are probably not in english,which may affect the recognition of that uni.just my opinion though...i found out that in osaka at least the course is in japanese.

[kintaro_kun]

well, can some one be sure that the unis accredited by mma mmc are all using english as the medium of instruction in med? how well can the malaysian graduates of most of the african or middle eastern unis converse in english or convey medical jargons using english? we already had a disaster by recognising CSMU, i certainly dont hope the next doctor i meet can only use arabic to tell me i have the flu :roll: .

[worthy]

Hi, I posted this input in another topic titled "JPA Fumbles". as follows:
"Actually I wonder how MMC and LAN can accredit ANY university as being of a high standard when NOT EVEN ONE university in Malaysia is accreditated by WHO until now? In Russia as of 2004, there are several top universities recognised by the WHO and have even produced Nobel / other scientific award winners as individuals or as teams. That is why Russia, also China and Japan now, which were formerly Iron Curtain, Red Curtain and Bamboo Curtain countries (former closed economies) are determined to get as big a market share as possible before the pricing goes higher.

I have also found that the majority of the Russian Universities medical graduates can be employed or can do their specialisation in US, UK and Europe easily because their degrees are recognised compared with medical graduates from Malaysian Unis which can only go to the traditional unis in UK/Aust and some other limited places.

I wonder when are we going to throw away the shackles of our British "colonisation" and look at the better places of educational excellence which Malaysians have never been able to go to before because those countries - eg China, Russia, Scandinavian countries - were not open to us foreigners before despite their great traditions of excellence in science and medicine for so many centuries.

I also recall that when I was younger anything Japanese was "bad and low quality" eg. comments such as "kereta tin Milo" were common. But look which country is laughing to the bank now?
learning anther language is just a norm for most countries which value their own culture. Even in Malaysia foreign students in IPTAs must know some Bahasa.

Sorry, just my two cents worth. Riang.


I totally agree with hi,/her....for example my biophysics Prof is the one of the writer for The European Biophysis Journal....and he is teaching us...Med Degree's from Russia are accepted in Uk,Europe and US listed as one of the best by WHO as they are established long time ago....maybe our mind are clouded by all the bad thing said about communist countries...but the fact is different and you have to see it with your own 2 eyes to believe it..

[masdie]

Med Degree's from Russia are accepted in Uk,Europe and US listed as one of the best by WHO as they are established long time ago.

Do you have proof?

What do you mean by "accepted"? Russian graduates must sit for qualifying exams before being able to practice in UK and US. If by accepted you mean they're able to sit for those exams then it's pretty useless isn't it?

One of the best? By WHO? Who told you that? Any proof? Or is it just what people tell you?

It's good to be proud of your own school, but if you want to brag about it, at least give us some proof.

PS: If you look up on medical student forums on the internet, most of them recommend Czech medical diploms over Russian and Ukrainian diploms (though generally it is advisable to avoid Eastern Europe altogether)