National Service for private doctors?

[The_Observer]

The latest cookoo idea from the Government?

As a medical student, I seriously disagree with that proposal...The MMA has recently objected too...

What do you guys, medic and non-medic alike, feel about this issue?

Read this first:
http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Friday/Frontpage/20040611072302/Article/indexb_html

[chenchow]

Personally, I would think that it should be optional. Perhaps, they could provide some incentives for those private doctors to help out in government service, more than it is just required.

[pandaboy]

I agree with chenchow. this is actually a good idea....due to the shortage of doctors in government sectors. however, incentives must be given to the doctors...

[SHuLy]

i think the idea started off rather drastically. it should have surfaced gradually, approaching various sectors involved before making the announcement or suggestion.

one thing is for sure, to force the doctors in the private sector to give 'service' to government sectors in order for them to renew their license is a form of blackmail! this is not the right way to seek assistance from the doctors, what more, coming from the government.

the government should see to why are there doctors leaving public hospitals to practise privately and do a brainstorm on how to keep these good doctors. perhaps allocating more funds for public health?! with the number of applications from medical-aspiring students, there shouldn't be a problem. i think that it is the inefficiency of workforce planning and the conditions (this includes facilities and equal opportunities, be it in job promotions or participation in conferences), and of course, the 'labour' charges.

doctors opt out of the sector mostly because they have adequate time for themselves and of course, the pay is much, much better. it is not that they are no longer interested in serving the people. they are still able to do so in the private sector. to say that doctors who opt out of government service because they are seeking solely for money and no longer interested in treating patients is absolutely immature! if so, these doctors could have set up their own business instead of being on-call 24 hours a day for each and every of their dear patients. even their working hours are extended and they stand a chance of being sued by the patient for just a minor, erroneous misunderstanding.

i really hope that the ministry of health would ponder into the statement that they had recently made and think before they talk. it is quite disalarming to see such puerile suggestions given by a ministry of the government.

[chenchow]

In fact, read the statement by Health Minister. It was pledged during a dialogue with the Association of Private Hospitals Malaysia here last week. The idea was not mooted by him.

Read this article:-
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2004/6/15/nation/8212652&sec=nation

While I don't think that compulsory service should be done, there should be more interactions between government doctors and private doctors.

[SHuLy]

perhaps those who pledge during that day were a few private doctors and it did not signify the voice of the rest of the private doctors.

haha...or it is had seem to be the right thing to do at that moment! -though it is quite unethical. saying is one thing, doing ..is another

[tunsrilanang]

yeah, private sector doctors should volunteer to help the gov't sector doctors. since not much help is received from the private doctors, i guess the drastic measure taken by the government would save the (dire) need of non-upper-class malaysian to receive better treatment.

well, its not easy to govern a lot of ppl...and to say the government's action as 'tak patut' and all, but in a larger scope, the general ppl of malaysia would benefit.

[__earth]

I dont really agree with it.

Though the govt meant to do good by providing better service to the poors that generally visit government-built facility, I believe it is important not to force the private sector to do something.

Alternatively, the govt should offer incentive like money or something to encourage volunteerism, or increase the length of residency for graduates. Demanding all the doctors to do "public service", veterens and freshies alike is wrong. Just because they are Malaysians, the govt cannot force people to do public service.

Furthermore, the larger trend is scary. First, the national service, then the doctors, later, who knows. Conscription?

[ElansarGelmir]

Increase the pay of public hospital docs!

By the way, just a curiosity, when they mention doctors, do they mean specialists or just normal GPs? I believe that we have abundance of GPs in Malaysia, but lack of specialists... Many students who pursue medic quit after becoming GPS. Perhaps the govt should do something to ensure that they become the specialists that they wanna be?

[chenchow]

I think the number of GPs are nowhere near sufficient level, especially in rural area. The starting pay of government hospital GP including allowance is more than RM4000 for those who just finish housemanship. I think it is not bad already right?

[The_Observer]

Errr...chenchow...I wonder where you got the figure $4000 from?
My sources indicate that interns get like 1k2 or 1k4 and those who finished housemanship get like 2k4 a month. And that's without excluding taxes, expense, etc....

Like that how to live...even some minor Government functionary shaking leg in the office can earn that much per month...

[Steppe]

I heard it with my own ears when my relative told my mother that her daughter was earning about RM 4,000 gross (not nett) per month all in all, inclusive of on-calls and allowances.

On comparison, a pharmacist or engineer can earn about RM 3,500 per month after 3 years. Taking into the consideration of the extra 3 more years for the doctor degree to that of any other course, I tend to believe the RM 4,000 gross is reasonable (inclusive of on-calls, allowances).

The wife (doctor) of another doctor relative of mine was already earning RM 1,500 - RM 1,700 many, many years back (may be 5-8 years ago, cannot remember exactly) when she was doing her 3 years compulsory service in KLGH. She was grumbling to us that the heavy workload with shift and with hardly any breathing space in between especially in casualty department was simply not worth it then (different from UK working conditions). A lot of doctors suffered then, simply insufficient to raise a family.

My sister who has just finished her A levels exams and she has applied for teaching science subjects in one of the independent schools. The salary offered is about RM 1,000. From local newspaper adversement, a clerk job asking for an SPM applicant with knowledge in word processing offers RM800 - RM 1000.

[ElansarGelmir]

Our GPs no where near sufficient levels? Chen Chow, in BM alone, there are more than 3 or 4 GP polyclinics that packed up and move else where since there is a stiff competition there. My friend's father, a GP himself, has to work longer hours just to get more customers coz his clinic is located together with 2 or 3 other clinics.

[The_Observer]

Oh ok...then probably my sources was a little outdated....
But still...in developed countries...in equivalent amount...that $4000 is what they pay to interns...

About the GP thingie, I guess BM is rather lucky then, no the case in quite a wee bit many parts of Malaysia

[Randomphantom]

The problem now is the shortage of public sector doctors. I can only see this as a short term solution as this still doesn't stop doctors from going for greener pastures for more lucrative returns. I think a pay raise for public sector doctors may be more appropriate - meanwhile government hospitals could use the extra help from private sector doctors. But I don't think forcing people to volunteer is anyhow fair - it should be optional and offer a sizable incentive. We don't want an additional outflux of doctors from Malaysia now...

[The_Observer]

This article sums up a lot about the issue at hand:

http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Sunday/Columns/20040620112345/Article/indexb_html

[ElansarGelmir]

the Public sector should improve themselves and try to be more competitive than the private sectors... A question... Is Malaysia practicing socialism?

[The_Observer]

If you want a funny fact, I got one...

Cuba has a better health system than us! They have a better model of public health even though they may not have classy private hospitals or world-renowned specialists....

Cuba is socialist, am I right?