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youngyew Male
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  #11 Old 25-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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Originally Posted by slumber View Post
see, u dont understand my point.. what im saying is,
dont like being attach = bond 10 years
but loved to be pampered = they want the scholarships (as if like pampered) but dont like to be attach ( which is bond for ten years ).some people like me doesnt like the 10 years bond with the government as i dont like to be working in the same condition for ten years.
Did you read my previous post? Let me requote it:
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This is a rather huge part of why people are not coming back. You mentioned that people don't want to be attached and bound to government service, that I concur - staying back in the government hospital mean that you need to deal with low pay even by the time you become a specialist, and that is definitely not what most people look forward to.
Which part of this paragraph is a misunderstanding of your point? Read properly before alleging people as not understanding you.
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Last edited by youngyew; 25-01-2009 at 03:36 PM.
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  #12 Old 25-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

haha.. wow.. i really dont see that! is it on previous post?
hmmmm...my bad...should i discard from this forum?
like vikraman said, i should read from previous post b4 i made a conclusion.


really d*** a***

hahaha
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  #13 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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Well, to be honest, I don't really see any problem with how they feel about their bond as long as they actually serve the bond as stipulated. =P If they were REALLY unpatriotic they'd just run away to another country without serving the bond.

My only concerns are that I might rot working in a government office, given the working environment and conditions there. *sighs* This is assuming they DO have a job for me though.
I agree whole-heartedly. I really think that as a scholar, one should always serve the minimum bond, as stipulated in the contract. No stupid excuse would justify the act of defecting to another country/forgoing the bond, as long as you are called to serve your bond. Those who did the above are just selfish morons (pardon my usage of words, but I really do think so).

However, if JPA were to release you after a year of unemployment since the day you report back, then I think it is fair (as said by them as well) for you to request for a release of bond. I always believe in honouring a contract that one signed when one decides to take up the scholarship.
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  #14 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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I agree whole-heartedly. I really think that as a scholar, one should always serve the minimum bond, as stipulated in the contract. No stupid excuse would justify the act of defecting to another country/forgoing the bond, as long as you are called to serve your bond. Those who did the above are just selfish morons (pardon my usage of words, but I really do think so).

However, if JPA were to release you after a year of unemployment since the day you report back, then I think it is fair (as said by them as well) for you to request for a release of bond. I always believe in honouring a contract that one signed when one decides to take up the scholarship.
If JPA does not give you any job after one year (which is the norm for most graduates except medicine, dentistry and pharmacy), you are considered released automatically and you do not have to do a thing.

Anyway before anyone starts thinking that I am shamelessly rationalising absconding act, let me preemptively clarify that I am merely stating the reason behind the act instead of justifying the act from the ethical standpoint.

Absconding is wrong, there's no question about it. Whether the lack of insight at the age of 17 should come into the picture is quite another question.
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  #15 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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If JPA does not give you any job after one year (which is the norm for most graduates except medicine, dentistry and pharmacy), you are considered released automatically and you do not have to do a thing.

If I remember correctly, you are supposed to write to them to ask for an official release.

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Absconding is wrong, there's no question about it. Whether the lack of insight at the age of 17 should come into the picture is quite another question.
Well, I personally don't think there's "quite a question" about that. Half of those who signed the contract after getting their SPM results are already 18, with the other half 6 months to 18. 18 is the legal adult age in Malaysia, that's the age when you can drink, get married without your parents permission, open a bank account in your own name, etc.

While I acknowledge that not everyone is very matured by that age, everyone has to pay for the choices they make. Plus, the way I look at it, it is not that you are not given a job for 4 years. JPA scholars will get a job, and they WILL get paid, albeit less than private sectors. Those who came out and whine about serving the country is just selfish morons. However, on the matter of coming back later, say 4-6 years after graduation, I am supportive of that. As long JPA scholars serve their bond in thier lifetime (but don't come back after 20 years lar, you'll just be too old. I also doubt the words of someone who says that they will come back after 20 years.), that's fine.
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  #16 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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If I remember correctly, you are supposed to write to them to ask for an official release.
Why should we? The contract only lasts that long, after that they have no right to ask you even if they want to.

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Well, I personally don't think there's "quite a question" about that.
Me neither.

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While I acknowledge that not everyone is very matured by that age, everyone has to pay for the choices they make.
That just about sums it up. I guess an important point not to be missed is that at the age of 17, many people don't jump in with the intention of absconding in the future. However, many people changed their mind as time passes by. Yes by law and by ethics there are little to no excuse for them to abscond; but the fact remains that this IS a major factor for abscondment and regardless of our criticism and contempt, hundreds of people are still going to do the "dishonourable" thing. They continue to enjoy a luxurious life overseas, all the while blissfully ignorant of our vehement protest.

So instead of delusionally wishing for the imaginary moral lash to bring the cows home, we should perhaps channel some real energy in solving the problem. Like, stop giving scholarship recklessly altogether, or effect a stringent measure to punish the absconders instead of letting them run scott free.
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  #17 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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Why should we? The contract only lasts that long, after that they have no right to ask you even if they want to.
I remember that there was no such escape clause in the contract (could be wrong, but unlikely). The "you're free after one jobless year" policy is obtained through verbal confirmation from the JPA officer. Therefore, if I remember correctly, there was a statement from JPA that one should request for a release after 1 year of unemployment.

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So instead of delusionally wishing for the imaginary moral lash to bring the cows home, we should perhaps channel some real energy in solving the problem. Like, stop giving scholarship recklessly altogether, or effect a stringent measure to punish the absconders instead of letting them run scott free.
I agree with what you said here. The solution is rather simple actually, charge them in court. By doing so, every rational minded person (I assume that all scholarship holders are rational here. They might not be, but ....... ) will definitely either:

1. Pay a hefty fine
2. Serve the agreed years

Well, for this to work, I have a (great) suggestion. Indoctrinate the next generation of JPA Law scholars with great moral values. Have them come back to the country and file lots and lots of lawsuits against those who absconds. This should solve the problem. xD
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  #18 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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Well, for this to work, I have a (great) suggestion. Indoctrinate the next generation of JPA Law scholars with great moral values. Have them come back to the country and file lots and lots of lawsuits against those who absconds. This should solve the problem. xD
Now THIS I wouldn't mind doing. Bring on the paperwork! =D

Anyway, I really think they should crank up on the enforcement a bit. There's a lot of talk about filing lawsuits against absconders but I don't think a lot is done in reality.
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  #19 Old 26-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

On the situation at government hospitals, I would say that it varies by locations. I have a number of friends who are serving at various government hospitals, and I would say that the situation varies.

Like those in Penang General Hospital, I know of some who are doing locum almost every day (whenever no on-call), to earn extra income. There are some hospitals/clinics that are more slack, and also from what I understand, it varies by departments as well. So, you would go on rotation, and certain departments/tasks are more taxing.

Above is from someone who has never worked a second in hospital, and is based on what I heard from my friends.

On serving the bond, my opinion is that one should try your best to see how you can contribute back. While it is true that once the 12 months expire (from the day you report to SPA), you're contractually off the contract, but you might want to contribute back to the country through other means or in the future.

Say you renege your contract and work elsewhere, you can share your experience at various platform (including ReCom) and help others to learn. I am not saying that this would be equivalent to serve the bond, but it is a way of you giving back too!

And while you would be serving 10 years in hospital, it is not same department, same hospital all the while (again, if I am not wrong).

Maybe those of you who have had the experience in the hospital, to come forward and share your first hand info.

Looks like this discussion has been swayed towards the bond for medical students.
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  #20 Old 27-01-2009 Default Re: Bond to JPA

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Now THIS I wouldn't mind doing. Bring on the paperwork! =D

Anyway, I really think they should crank up on the enforcement a bit. There's a lot of talk about filing lawsuits against absconders but I don't think a lot is done in reality.
Heheh, so here we have our first JPA Law student, ready to grill other scholar's a$$. xD
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